Well the blimp is high above the fight, someone would have to be thrown into it.
10 meters is not that high in the grand scheme of things. Something like the goodyear blimp usually flies 457.2 meters as a lowball. Imagine being on the third floor of a building and seeing a blimp dead ahead, it's a bit odd is what I'm saying.
I know the idea of One-Shots throws off our sense of scale, but it really isn't "Minimal", it's just not overtly crippling. Granted I saw it as a 2x gap rather than a 1.5x, but that still means if these two swing at each-other and clash, that'd essentially net the equivalent of him swinging his weapon backwards with half strength. Not being game ending doesn't mean it's not a distinct advantage.
Yeah, but unlike AP the lifting strength gap is absolutely massive, Gildedguy is 100x stronger in that regard. He wouldn't really need to apply any skill or hold for a disarm, he really could just... grab the weapon in one hand and chuck it as it's being swung at him. That's not a big ask and it can't be avoided if he wants to keep making swings with it (and thus, actually get milage out of the weapon)
Skill isn't a magic spell, you still have to apply practical means and physical locomotion to work with it. In this case he's swinging a melee weapon, he inherently has to have some part of it get into melee range in order to make contact, and that's an issue. Maybe he could feign and jab to keep distance, but... Well I look at Gildedguy's page for a bit and his sword can stretch kilometers (And even without that it's it's definitely more than tens of), so it's not going to get the best results
It's not like the forcefields are listed as having a particularly high durability, it's just another thing for to get hit. And given the range and strength differences, the dynamic goes
The starting distance is just for the fighters, the blimp is out of the way.
Where did I say it was insurmountable? I just said it was a distinct advantage, and that all the arguments about where One-Shots start really throws off the sense of scale.
Durability is the ability to withstand damage and not get damaged as a result. That's not the same thing as resisting the force behind someone's throw, people with equal levels of strength can totally throw each other around the block if they don't dig their heels in when taking a hit unless they're extremely heavy or have some weird innate inertia.
I'm... not sure what you're picturing here. Is the idea he'll leap into the air and grab it as Gildedguy is tossing it? What stops him from playing area denial with his Long Sword or just flat out hitting him in an intercept? Mobility isn't the same thing as raw speed, and just being in the air isn't going to stop someone with kilometers of range to work with.
I hold to my statement about mobility, and in turn mobility is something Gildedguy can get around by just restraining them with the pen. Even without him being the best at doing it, it's still something that can tie the hands of guys on par with him, use that to tie Cinner's legs and that causes way more of an issue.
It goes both ways given Gildedguy's showings in this ballpark, but the fact he has a sword rather than a staff means he can really sever a limb or two to invoke this issue, at least given enough time to work with. Really it's generally going to be a very drawn out battle, so when I say things don't get the impression it'd happen immediately or even super soon, just eventually.
It's not a matter of him being hit, it's lifting strength. He could get his hand (Or his pen, really that makes getting anywhere near GildedGuy at all with a melee implement a risk) on that object and exert 100x the force Cinner can to get it out of his hands or away. And melee is very well where that advantage will be most prevalent, because without range that's going to be easier and easier to pull off.
I don't know where you're getting this from. I guess he did lose when it was destroyed vs Jade, but that seemed more like a tournament rule rather than him surrendering or being significantly weakened, and we see him very much so operate at peak condition with not only a stab wound through his arm but half of his armor still on his body. Heck he beat Bog specifically when the thing leaked through his armor and into his blood.
The terrain isn't really durable enough to take 8-A hits reliably and we know Gildedguy can just lash out by spinning around in his longsword if he loses line of sight, so that's not really risk free.
I mean, how complete is this forcefield's insulation anyways? It says it's a sphere that lasts for a time or a certain amount of attacks, can he just poke through it anyways? If so, that still means his weapon is poking out and could be grabbed.
That wasn't a skill issue, Andre pretty clearly is just overpowering them both at once on top of being generally good at a fight. You don't borderline no sell a rush of attacks on either side of you (which did hit, you can see he's not really blocking all of them) and repel their assaults by just skillgapping someone.
Cinner can guard once he’s gotten his staff back or use a forcefield and make his way back into range. Gilded usually only sweeps for a limited time before going back to his normal sword fighting.
You really should make a habit of highlighting specific parts of the post then replying, because this seems to be replying to a post about how "acrobatics and levitation" don't really say much about how he'd be able to retrieve it... with "he can guard once he has the staff back", resolving none of the issues about retrieval.
well,
We see the line is fine conducting a lightning bolt (something five times the temperature of the sun) and you can even see the ground getting scorched underneath him as this is happening, it does seem to burn away eventually but that's after very prolonged contact with something over 16 times hotter than Cinner's stuff (And also obligatory "heat split cringe" here, though I'm willing to engage with it fairly here because it is a string, it does feel like that'd be a least a bit more flammable than it is able to withstand being torn)
...?
I've said this from the start.
Refer to drawn out battle, and it's not that extreme of an idea. It's a blunt object, that's something you can grab without an innate risk and someone not having a weapon is very much so a boon. Heck, he tries something quite like this as his first move against Andre, it just doesn't work because his opponent was stronger there. It being as effective as it is here would just reinforce him trying that out.
Both of these moves involve extending his weapon. Cinner himself would be at a range, but the staff strictly has to make contact with Gildedguy to hit, and contact is range to grab.
It's not like it's given a higher rating on his page or noted as super strong, and Gildedguy is the one with the AP advantage in the first place.
Generally having all of your equipment destroyed in a match that's not supposed to end in death is a pretty bad sign, it doesn't strictly indicate he's a normal dude without it.
Not... really? It's hard to tell from how chaotic it's choreographed but there's no indication it's just Arzon doing everything, and we clearly see him keeping up in speed. There's no way he'd be able to perform the moves he pulled off if he was normal human speed fighting a Massively Hypersonic+ while wounded
He still physically entered the guy's body and tried to overcome said mind rather than just physically destroying him inside out, which is also a bit weird if the guy was physically normal under the armor.
He can just react to both by spinning slashing the surroundings, though. Heck, Cinner doesn't really have enhanced senses so if he breaks line of sight, he's equally liable to be surprised by an attack emerging from the debris.
There's not really an innate risk to grabbing a blunt object, unless he tried to directly catch it in his palm for whatever reason. Coming in from the side would be a lot more natural of a motion and pretty much only encounter the friction, which would be pretty negligible overall.
Not... really. Deflecting is skill, driving the force away from you so you don't have to deal with all of it. Head on withstanding the blow with one hand and then smacking them to the side is a matter of strength.
This is a major component to Andre pummeling the guy throughout the fight, though. He definitely wouldn't have the performance he did if he was physically weaker.
Similarly, I don't think I understand why a ramming attack would be notably devastating when AP and Lifting Strength especially is in Gildedguy's favor.
With an AP disadvantage, through Gildedguy's amps and stamina? I'm going to state again I'm really not a fan of treating heat as totally separate from attack potency and even in this case, Gildedguy wears gold, a conductor. It wouldn't have helped him endure being blasted with heat as he has.
These are fair claims, but what about Cinner's skill? Gildedguy is not as strong in evading attacks and often blocks or gets hit (taking the Gildedguy vs Andre fight as an example, the little wind guy does a way better job, Gilded's main ways are worse evading and tanking damage while trying to overthink his opponent in time + use his haxxes). On the other hand, it's the fourth key Cinner (against Cinner I argued 2x times, once in 8-A and once in his final key placed at High 7-A [now the battle being outdated]), and his skill growth in keys is significant even when his Pure form is restricted. 8-A Cinner kept with base Laser Frogman for long, and in later keys, his skill made him pretty much equal in clashing with war supercomputer 3rd level FU Android with dozens of AoE techniques to land exceptionally dangerous hax in every eye blink available.
These are versus threads, not feats they've demonstrated. It gives a stronger suggestion that the result was just... Wrong, rather than them having evidence they can actually keep up with that. How, exactly was he supposed to dodge dozens of instances of AoE in speed equal conditions?
At what point did someone mention this as a factor?
He's got 100x lifting strength, he could hold it or try it out for himself like he briefly considered with Andre's weapon after their fight, and even if he just decides to toss it, his longsword gives him the range to airshot Cinner and fling him another direction. That, and it's not very easy to stop Gildedguy from just grabbing it again even if they do get it back.
He does it like, thrice in a row from Bog to Oxob to Andre. Maybe in terms of his overall history that isn't much but I imagine he just didn't have the technique up his sleeve in past appearances, rather than it being a rare draw.
I don't believe I've said that. The all around attack is mainly a counter against him trying to blindside Gildedguy by sending the terrain into the air or getting evasive, if he blocks it that's still at least somewhat a favorable interaction given Gildedguy has the strength edge.
Fiction is extremely frequent about having someone be "normal" and then giving them superhuman feats anyways, and he does physically impossible stuff even when his armor's heavily damaged. Normal people just don't survive having an acid monster in their bloodstream or can handle flying around on a staff for a mid air fight (and heck, it says normal "stickman" rather than human, given the nature of the series maybe normal in that universe is Tier 7, who knows)
It’s being made to seem from you and Soupy’s arguments that once Cinner’s disarmed he’ll quickly be taken down. But Gildedguy doesn’t have an arsenal very suited for that, even with his primary weapon.
I see, so you’re both saying GG wins in the long game. Didn’t seem that way before but I get why you think that with the range and LS advantages. But Gilded shouldn’t be able to easily respond to all of Cinner’s attacks when he lacks the skill and acrobatics Cinner has. Some attacks Cinner has also would be able to shatter the ground. Solid Crash is specifically good for that which would reduce Gilded’s footing making dodging more difficult. And since both are around the same endurance wise it’ll come down to who gets more hits. But that dynamic is broken by Gildedguy being vulnerable once his armor is broken which would surely happen since it has in shorter fights. Slicing arms would also take luck and time since Cinner’s regeneration can heal damage deep enough to reach the bones within minutes and the AP gap shouldn’t be enough where Gilded’s sword which mainly acts as a bludgeon is getting that deep without a few hits in the same spots.
GG’s sword not cleaving through anyone else is probably because he just didn’t want to kill anyone else he was fighting, against Bog, someone he would have no reason to not want to kill and who took no visible damage from the 317 Megaton feat the cast scales to, GG’s sword was tearing through him like paper (Like towards the start of the fight where GG splits Bog’s skull with a single slash), he’d be more than capable of chopping Cinner’s limbs off with single slices, (Or at worst much faster than the minutes Cinner needs to heal, and if Cinner is being put on the defensive to avoid repeat slashes to individual areas, that’s just more pressure for GG to whittle Cinner down with before going melee) plus GG’s armor breaking isn’t as debilitating a weakness as you’re making it sound, he can still fight against comparable characters with heavy damage to his armor (Such as when he knocks Jade out with his sword right after she shatters his chestplate)
