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Gogeta blue tier

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Honestly, if we're not counting Beerus at 2-C by himself then the feat shouldn't be as notable as we're making it out to be. There's a reason we didn't take it into consideration before. Either Beerus should be 2-C or the feat is at best a bit above baseline Low 2-C as we see there's not some insane distance between the universes.

Frieza says Broly is above everyone. Unless Broly is above Whis, Grand Priest, and Zeno, then that statement holds no water but hype.

Goku thought he surpassed Beerus way back when he was fighting Hit.

It's to show the amount of hype certain characters get for statements that hold no water without feats to back it up, which the entirety of the Broly movie lacks. The most notable thing scaling wise in the movie is that Broly is above Goku Vegeta and Frieza by an unfathomable amount. Throw out all the multipliers one wants (which I'm still against) but that's all that can be proven. Frieza's statement isn't any different than SEGA saying that Infinite is the strongest villain in Sonic despite many other characters being above him, if you don't like the Mewtwo analogy.
 
@Cal Kudos for the Infinite analogy.

Beerus + Champa's feat being 2-C is bullshit since there's no reason to assume that they would destroy Universes 6 and 7 at once when both were in Universe 7. They would destroy Universe 7 first and then Universe 6 since Universe 6 is right next to it.
 
The Wright Way said:
No. The difference between Low 2-C and 2-C is infinite. It's 4-D vs 5-D. You cannot become 2-C just by powerscaling off Low 2-C's, unless you literally view them as fictional.
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What? You are 5-D only in High 2-A, but 2-A and below are 4-D and the difference is being able to destroy more than one universe at the time.
 
ShadowWarrior1999 said:
@Cal Kudos for the Infinite analogy.
Beerus + Champa's feat being 2-C is bullshit since there's no reason to assume that they would destroy Universes 6 and 7 at once when both were in Universe 7. They would destroy Universe 7 first and then Universe 6 since Universe 6 is right next to it.
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To all the skeptics who doubt

Your argument/Opinio was debunk on thread . As well as other users too. You guys keep repeting yourselves.

Now, you guys are doubting Goku or Frieza validity. Whats next Jiren being stronger than Beerus or All God of Destruction is hype statement. Omegalul.

@The real cal howard

Beerus sweating to KK it was because he did not know he had such a handy technique. Here

This has been solved and agreed with @AKM sama proposal. Thread:3150938

This thread needs to be closed.
 
ProudLearner said:
Goku is a Master Martial Artist so his statement is valid.
Click to expand...
You don't seriously think this is how things work in real life right? The degree of how much character can change their Ki is ridiculous. Goku also thought he had a shot against jiren first time they fought before Jiren unleashed his ki and thought Kaio-ken would give him a shot against Beerus in the past. F*cking Goku couldn't tell that Monaka was an absolute weakling.

Now Goku is a reliable source?
 
ZERO7772 said:
You don't seriously think this is how things work in real life right? The degree of how much character can change their Ki is ridiculous. Goku also thought he had a shot against jiren first time they fought before Jiren unleashed his ki.
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No. But Anime yes.

Goku thought the Spirit bomb with SSB KKx20 was enough to defeat him yet with Supresssed Jiren realising a hint of his power was enough to defeat Goku.

Jiren was so suppressed that Goku could not sense his full potential. Let alone his hidden power.
 
Amazing how everything I asked not to be done to respond to my arguments has been done. Said it was already addressed on the other thread I wasn't on? Check. Laughing at the supposed incredulity of my arguments? Check.

I trust the DB ratings as far as I can throw them tbh. It's one of the prime series to get hyped up to oblivion so I don't trust what's agreed on unless I see it firsthand. It's not egotism, it's skepticism.
 
ZERO7772 said:
F*cking Goku couldn't tell that Monaka was an absolute weakling.

Now Goku is a reliable source?
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That's just Goku lacking common sense. or just PIS

That's really your best argument lol
 
That's just Goku lacking common sense. or just PIS

That's really your best argument lol

>Goku was wrong in the past and it doesn't support my head canon

>I will just call it PIS and laugh at the other guy lol.

You just said Goku lack common sense but then you said his words are trust worthy. Are you listening to yourself buddy?

This discussion is pointless.
 
ZERO7772 said:
>Goku was wrong in the pastand it doesn't support my head canon

>I will just call it PIS and laugh at the other guy lol.

You just said Goku lack common sense but then you said his words are trust worthy. Are listening to yourself buddy.
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As Goku the Main Charater I will trust his words over you @ZERO7772

Its just PIS.
 
@ProudLearner Not really. It went through because of the fanbase wanting Dragon Ball to be as strong as possible rather than legit accuracy.
 
Can I hop in for a second?

Conidering I was the one who made the 2 revision threads where Gogeta was upgraded, I strondly advise for people to read through those 2 threads if they have not already. Because after a lengthy discussion, it was agreed upon that Beerus and Champa destroying their 2 universes was a 2-C feat instead of a tier 3 one and because we agreed its a 2-C feat, it would be applicable to scaling to those who are beyond the power of both Beerus and Champa.

Not taking sides but if you disagree with Gogeta being possibly 2-C, then you'll have to debunk Beerus and Champa doing a 2-C feat in the 1st place.
 
Honestly, Kukui is right to say this. Every argument here was already brought up in the revision threads and I haven't seen anyone appropriately claim Gogeta Blue isn't possibly 2-C with argumentation and/or evidence.

At this point, I'm just questioning if the people arguing against it have even skimmed the revision threads.
 
Yeah because I clearly have the time and energy to read through two large af threads. It's much easier for those who have already read it to summarize the arguments.
 
ShadowWarrior1999 said:
@ProudLearner Not really. It went through because of the fanbase wanting Dragon Ball to be as strong as possible rather than legit accuracy.
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We are using a feat of Beerus vs Champa to see where are standing and then we see who is stronger then they are combine with the resutls being All Angels and GP upgraded. This previous charaters that mention are unquantifiably way stronger than Beerus and Champa combine. As said by @CryoTheMayo "'Occam's Razor'. The concept that the 'simplest' solution is usually the correct one. You have to make many claims, many assumptions, with no evidence, to come to the conclusion that Beerus and Champa would destroy Universe 7, then 6 and then just stop. Whereas, simply claiming the feat is 2-C due to them fighting in Universe 7 and threatening both Universe 6 and 7 only requires pointing to what their attendants claimed within the canon."
 
The real cal howard said:
Yeah because I clearly have the time and energy to read through two large af threads. It's much easier for those who have already read it to summarize the arguments.
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That explains your lazy behavior on this thread. Take your time and read it. Just like right now you have the time to complain about it with no evidence and just speculation.

Its not our problem that the two threads were open for weeks and you did not participate.
 
Yeaaaaah I don't understand why you are arguing this if you haven't at least skimmed all of our work and debate. We didn't go through hundreds of posts just for it to be all dismissed with arguments that were already debated and settled.
 
The arguments have already been, mostly, summarised. Going into the exact depth and magnitude of what directions we took said arguments would take quite a while, all to update somebody who could easily just pop open the two threads and skim through all of it in an hour or so.

If somebody wants to go ahead and update you, they can have fun with it. Maybe ask AKM? He was involved in more of the thread than I was, and he was the one who did the updates IIRC.
 
RashFaustinho said:
I still have to understand who is the wise mind that can determinate that Gogeta is as strong as the COMBINED power of Beerus and Champa, possibly without using arbitrary wanking nonsensical and most importantly of all STUPID head canon stomp multipliers.

In a series where BOTH Stomps and Multipliers are inconsistent af
Click to expand...
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


This
 
I was in both threads, go check it out. The argument for Gogeta being as strong as the combined power of Beerus and Champa was and still remains stupid wanking fanboyism, whatever you put it.

The arguments presented for Gogeta being this strong through "Stomp Multipliers", putting him 2X GoDs because "he stomped Broly" were stupid before and are stupid still now, but I guess Gogeta's just too cool for that, uh?
 
Again, and again, I have said this repeatedly. It isn't wanking. Gogeta explicitly curbstomped Broly in-universe and is described in vivid detail in the novel. Gogeta curbstomped someone comparable to Beerus and is described as doing so without much effort. It's likely that Gogeta is considerably stronger than he has already displayed and Broly was also unable to adapt to Gogeta, despite Broly adapting to people infinitely stronger than he is in mere minutes or Broly even adapting to SS Gogeta and growing so powerful to prompt Gogeta to use Blue.

I'm honestly not sure what else to say. You keep denying what happens in the story itself to fit your viewpoint that it's fanboyism to claim that Gogeta is 'possibly 2-C' or 'possibly 2x Beerus' for easily curbstomping someone at least as powerful as Beerus.
 
For the very last goddamn time DB doesn't acknowledge the infinite gap between 3-A and Low 2-C. I guess Gogeta must be High 2-A then if Broly could adapt to infinity but couldn't do it again for Gogeta.
 
@Pritti

Well, go watch the Broly film or read the novel. I'm not sure what else I'm supposed to provide. Gogeta stomped Broly with ease. Broly is Beerus-level. This is only arguing for Possibly 2-C, meaning that it's less than likely 2-C but more than at least Low 2-C due to the scaling presented.

Gogeta Blue >> Broly >/= Beerus

I also didn't argue, at all, that Broly is 2x Beerus so I have no idea why you are claiming that.

@Cal

What relevance does this...have exactly? You seem to be misusing the term infinity as well. I am referring to figuratively infinite. Goku became 'infinitely' more powerful for leaping from 4-B to 3-A via the God Ritual. Broly went from somewhere above 2nd form Frieza to stomping Post-ToP SSG Goku.
 
Literally non of you even attempted to explain why Broly couldn't adapt to Gogeta. Broly, after the Star dust breaker, literally had a massive outburst in power and still couldn't lay a finger on Gogeta.
 
Doesn't all the 12 Universe have the same Space-Time? i mean, when trunks traveled throught time numerous time, it created Time rings in the Universe 10, it isn't possible if they aren't at the same Time-space.
 
I'm tired of this, I've repeated this times and times again in 3 different threads, stomping someone doesn't mean ANYTHING in this manga. We've multiple instances of people stomping with minuscle differences in power, people NOT stomping with ABNORMOUS difference in power, super saiyan multipliers not working as intended, and so on and so forth. But all of this is ignored. Because he stomped Broly. And since he stomped him, "it makes sense that he is possibly 2X Gods" None of this makes sense. This is just stuff that you're been making through your mind and isn't supported by the manga whatsoever. Because this series is inconsistent as hell. Claiming there is a certain difference between a stomper and a stomped is plain out stupid.

Either way I've noticed that the mods tend to agree with those who spam and comment more aggressively when they don't agree between themselves. Because they don't have the time to read through all of this - Even the users themselves don't have the time to read all that stuff. So this is all a waste of time. I've strongly opposed to this nonsense, there is people rightfully so lamenting about this ridicolous wanking, but I couldn't do a thing about it. Gogeta will be possibly 2-C because the Dragon Ball community decided so. Based on a STOMP. On a guy "possibly stronger than Beerus."

  • Sigh*
 
He's stronger than him. That's all that needs to be said. You're acting like Broly is if SCP-682 had a baby with Doomsday that became a Saint from Saint Seiya and can adapt without limits forever. He's not. He clearly just reached his peak at the moment.
 
Rash. We literally argued that multipliers and power level scaling are too inconsistent to use for scaling the multipliers for AP stomps. Can you PLEASE refresh your mind on what possibly means?

I'm not even bothering with what Pritti said. Please go skim the revision threads that were specifically about arguing that claim.
 
The Causality said:
Doesn't all the 12 Universe have the same Space-Time? I mean, when trunks traveled through time numerous time, it created Time rings in the Universe 10, it isn't possible if they aren't at the same Time-space.
Click to expand...
That's complicated. You could also argue that the universes have their own smaller spacetimes while still being bound by a larger one that is the timeline.

I honestly think that we should clarify how the DB cosmology even works since people seem to disagree on that (and personally, I don't even think that the authors themselves care about it).
 
Pritti said:
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Please prove that SSB Gogeta > Beerus and Champa combined power.
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I don't see why Gogeta being possibly 2x as strong as a character he stomped without effort would be a extraordinary claim.

especially when Goku said Broly is probably stronger than Beerus.He surely didn't say he's above two destroyers.

Why would this be relevant?

If Broly is comparable to a GoD then stomping him leaves open the possibility of Gogeta being 2-C
 
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