Godzilla SP Novelization - Verse introduction

[Arceus0x]

Someone cooked up a michelin star meal here.

 

[Gasper]

Sorry if this is obvious, but i would just want to ask if there's any reason why Godzilla dosen't have Abstract Existence?
It's an Archetype and basically is described similarly to Godzilla from the anime.

 

[Arceus0x]

Sorry if this is obvious, but i would just want to ask if there's any reason why Godzilla dosen't have Abstract Existence?
It's an Archetype and basically is described similarly to Godzilla from the anime.

i mean being higher dimensional gives it higher dimensional existence, don't see why it would be abstract unless you can prove it

 

[Gasper]

i mean being higher dimensional gives it higher dimensional existence, don't see why it would be abstract unless you can prove it

Well, they are not just higher dimensional, they are Archetypal beings and Omega point being described as the singularity itself.

 

[Arceus0x]

Well, they are not just higher dimensional, they are Archetypal beings and Omega point being described as the singularity itself.

and?
archetypal beings means nothing, archetype is just a name, and singularities are real physical things. I don't get where the abstract existence would come from.

 

[Dereck03]

Okay, I know that tier 1 is the major premise of this thread, but honestly I have no knowledge of 1-B, I have more knowledge of the L1-C and 1-A, so instead of giving a wrong opinion I would rather not say anything about it, but I can say that the new profiles are fine.

 

[Arceus0x]

Okay, I know that tier 1 is the major premise of this thread, but honestly I have no knowledge of 1-B, I have more knowledge of the L1-C and 1-A, so instead of giving a wrong opinion I would rather not say anything about it, but I can say that the new profiles are fine.

Do you think this qualifies for at bare minimum Low 1-C?

 

[Dereck03]

Do you think this qualifies for at bare minimum Low 1-C?

Yeah, i would say that Low 1-C may pass, but highly unsure about 1-B, no cause it's wrong but because i don't really understand that tier.

 

[Arceus0x]

Yeah, i would say that Low 1-C may pass, but highly unsure about 1-B, no cause it's wrong but because i don't really understand that tier.

Ok

 

[Arceus0x]

The moment you realize that Godzilla stomps anything below Tier Low 1-C, including Dragon Ball. :V

let's not talk about fights rn, don't wanna piss off the wrong person.

 

[Arceus0x]

Bump

 

[KingTempest]

I'm unsure about Tier 1 stuff as that's not where I excel at, but looks fine otherwise.

Pretty much this

 

[LordGriffin1000]

I was asked to comment here although it contains Tier 1/HDE who ha, I'm leaning towards agreeing with 1-B and the profiles look ok but I'm not knowledgeable on what solidly qualifies so I'll see what the more knowledgeable members think. Will comment on anything else that catches my eye.

 

[Arceus0x]

I was asked to comment here although it contains Tier 1/HDE who ha, I'm leaning towards agreeing with 1-B and the profiles look ok but I'm not knowledgeable on what solidly qualifies so I'll see what the more knowledgeable members think. Will comment on anything else that catches my eye.

Could you call over some knowledgeable members?

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Could you call over some knowledgeable members?

Of tier 1? That would be...

@DontTalkDT @Ultima_Reality if either of you find the time, could you please give this a look, specifically the Tier 1 stuff when able.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Neutral about Tier 1 stuff. Profiles look good, though

 

[Unqver]

Alright, let me summarize. Why don't I agree? First of all, it's about the illusion of reality, which is clearly just a metaphor for ordinary people. If we easily defeat B and metaphorically say that B wants to defeat ourselves, unless the comic characters tear open their own comics, can this also be recognized?「なるほど」とカイ。「だが、どうやって消す？」と訊ねる。

芝居がかって両手を広げ天を仰いで、『骨』がここに隠されていた理由はなんだ？　いっそ破壊した方がてっとり早かったとは思わないか？　葦原がそれを試みなかったとでも？　答えはシンプルだ。君だってわかってるんだろう」

カイとユンの視線が正面からぶつかる。

特異点を破壊することはできない。それは言わば時空間の性質で、時空間の内側から破壊することはできないんだ。映画の登“場人物がスクリーンを破ろうとするようなものだ。特異点はあくまでもスクリーンの外側から与えられた『穴』にすぎない。劇中人物たちにその穴を塞ぐ手は存在しないんだよ
If there are other dimensions to describe, I can only say....... The red dust composed of high-dimensional molecules was injured by human weapons, and in the novel, it still runs through the building, 二〇三〇年、八月二十二日、戦車群にゆっくりと追い立てられる形で、ゴジラが有ゆう楽らく町ちよう一丁目に到達。帝てい国こくホテルを望む位置で日比谷公園へと顔を向けて停止した。
　そこから耳をすませるようにして頭をわずかに上へ上げると、東京駅方面へと体を向け直した。たちまち胸元に戦車群からの砲撃弾が集中したが、ゴジラはこれまでとは異なり、意に介する風もなく、視線を空にさまよわせた。
　このとき、多くの自衛隊員が「ゴジラの体がひどく大きくなっている」という感覚を覚えたという。

ゴジラは降り注ぐ砲弾には目を細めるだけで、東京駅へと向き直り、重心を下げると頭をやや低く構えた。戦車群は前面から後退を開始、その動きはゴジラに気圧されたようにも見えた。
　戦車群がビルの陰に隠れる前に、ゴジラの背中に並んだ鰭が青白く発光を開始。異形の森のようなその背中がイルミネーションに照らされるように浮かび上がった。
　ゴジラの口元に、青白い輪が浮かんで回転を開始。輪は見る間に二重となり、四重となり、多重の同心円がゴジラの視線方向に沿って浮かんで並んだ。
　ゴジラは軽く頭を引いたのち、勢いをつけて顔を突き出す。
　牙の並んだ口から、青い光の柱が出現した。
　青白い光が、ゴジラの口から吐き出された。
　光はただ直進し、立ちはだかるものを無視して進み、光線に触れたあらゆるものは消滅した。光はビルを貫通し、その向こうのビルを貫き、その向こうのビルにも穴を穿った。
　ゴジラの口から伸びる光線は途切れることなく、下に振られて地殻をえぐった。そ“そのまま頭は振り上げられて、光線は紅塵を切り裂いて空へ伸びた。
　体をひねる動きに光線も従い、ゴジラは青い光を振り回した。当初の向きから左へ九〇度ほど回ったところで一息をついたかと思うと、もう一度大きく息を吸い込んでから、再び光線を吐きはじめた。
　この光線は、新宿へ伸び、東京都庁に命中した。
with three-dimensional elements only due to incompatible shapes
紅塵は「これまで人類によって合成されたことはなかった」が「つとにその存在を知られた」分子ではあった。その分子構造は一九六〇年代に予測され、その後の計算機能力の増大によって存在が確証されつつある分子群と同一のものと考えられた。

分子群の名をアーキタイプ。

高次元空間の存在を前提としたその超分子構造の提唱者の名を葦原道幸。

当然、アミノ酸の右手系と左手系が入れ替わることだって可能だ。アーキタイプは『そういう高次元の操作』を必要とする物質なんだが、相手は高次元だ。人間の直観は届かない。アーキタイプ分子群に属する個々の分子の形がわかったとしても、それをうまく合成する『経路』がどれかはわからんわけだ
アーキタイプの合成には、ゴムボールを切り開かずに表裏逆にするような、あるいは、未来の配置を利用して過去に結び目をつくるような超次元的操作が必要とされ、その存在はあくまでも空想の中の分子として忘れ去られたままなっていた。その中心となるのは葦原環と呼ばれる分子の連なりで、これは四次元立方体の三次元への投影を連想させる形をしていた。
オーソゴナル・ダイアゴナライザー自体は、高次元で振り回すことのできるカッターの刃のような代物だ。調整次第で、糊やピンセットのように用いることも可能である。今はその性質を、アーキタイプ分子の高次元成分を切り離すことに利用したい。より正確には、その分子を変形し、高次元成分と現実世界を直交させてしまいたい。
アーキタイプ分子をアーキタイプ分子たらしめているものは、その高次元成分である。魔法の力は、別の次元との接続によって生み出されている。
....... Anyway, I don't agree with Tier1 and above

 

[Arceus0x]

Alright, let me summarize. Why don't I agree? First of all, it's about the illusion of reality, which is clearly just a metaphor for ordinary people. If we easily defeat B and metaphorically say that B wants to defeat ourselves, unless the comic characters tear open their own comics, can this also be recognized?

what the heck are you even talking about mate? It's clearly, very clearly stated that "It" cannot be affected from within space-time in that same exact dialogue. It is explained that people trying to harm it is like characters trying to break through the TV screen. Characters being on a lower level of existence by being like a tv series, a comic or video game to another character has granted the latter character tier 1 in the past since it establishes a reality-fiction interaction. Godzilla sees the past, present and future as a dream and views the universe overall like something in a tv. This logic has been used for several accepted tier 1 verses many times (who killed markiplier, looney toons, MCU's K.E.V.I.N. and more).

If there are other dimensions to describe, I can only say....... The red dust composed of high-dimensional molecules was injured by human weapons, and in the novel, it still runs through the building with three-dimensional elements only due to incompatible shapes

???? Mate they are explained in the novel to be higher dimensional molecules with a lower dimensional component. The molecules reach out to higher dimensions whilst having a part in the 3rd dimension, thus making it physically interact with other 3D objects. Additionally the red dust is used for the reshaping of the physical universe and the creation of the bodies of the creatures. "It" produces red dust but it's not made out of it, we don't know what it's made out of, similarly to every other entity is part of it. Tanks harming the 3D section of the red dust molecules in this world makes total sense and doesn't debunk any statement i've made so far.

....... Anyway, I don't agree with Tier1 and above

You can disagree if you'd like but in the end i'll wait for the evaluation from knowledgeable staff.

 

[Unqver]

what the heck are you even talking about mate? It's clearly, very clearly stated that "It" cannot be affected from within space-time in that same exact dialogue. It is explained that people trying to harm it is like characters trying to break through the TV screen. Characters being on a lower level of existence by being like a tv series, a comic or video game to another character has granted the latter character tier 1 in the past since it establishes a reality-fiction interaction. Godzilla sees the past, present and future as a dream and views the universe overall like something in a tv. This logic has been used for several accepted tier 1 verses many times (who killed markiplier, looney toons, MCU's K.E.V.I.N. and more).

???? Mate they are explained in the novel to be higher dimensional molecules with a lower dimensional component. The molecules reach out to higher dimensions whilst having a part in the 3rd dimension, thus making it physically interact with other 3D objects. Additionally the red dust is used for the reshaping of the physical universe and the creation of the bodies of the creatures. "It" produces red dust but it's not made out of it, we don't know what it's made out of, similarly to every other entity is part of it. Tanks harming the 3D section of the red dust molecules in this world makes total sense and doesn't debunk any statement i've made so far.

You can disagree if you'd like but in the end i'll wait for the evaluation from knowledgeable staff.

On the first point, you can expose them. I will be the first to support them. I am very supportive of the demotion of works with moisture.Isn't the red dust a high-dimensional molecule cut by human beings? What the hell are you talking about? Didn't I send the original text?

 

[Oblivion_Of_The_Endless]

On the first point, you can expose them. I will be the first to support them. I am very supportive of the demotion of works with moisture.Isn't the red dust a high-dimensional molecule cut by human beings? What the hell are you talking about? Didn't I send the original text?

Incomprehensible sentence.

 

[Arceus0x]

On the first point, you can expose them. I will be the first to support them. I am very supportive of the demotion of works with moisture.

idk what works with moisture is supposed to mean but do it yourself. Until then, as long as those verses are accepted as tier 1, and as long as seeing something as fiction qualifies as an r>f difference that grants tier 1, this verse will be tier 1.

Isn't the red dust a high-dimensional molecule cut by human beings? What the hell are you talking about? Didn't I send the original text?

you sent the original text and? Like I said, it's stated that they have a lower dimensional component. If you place a 3D object on a 2D object, the 2D object will only interact with a 2D slice of the 3D object. That is what's happening here. The red dust molecules are 3D slices of higher dimensional objects. Even in the anime it's explained that the that what we see are mere shadows of the real molecules.

 

[Unqver]

idk what works with moisture is supposed to mean but do it yourself. Until then, as long as those verses are accepted as tier 1, and as long as seeing something as fiction qualifies as an r>f difference that grants tier 1, this verse will be tier 1.

you sent the original text and? Like I said, it's stated that they have a lower dimensional component. If you place a 3D object on a 2D object, the 2D object will only interact with a 2D slice of the 3D object. That is what's happening here. The red dust molecules are 3D slices of higher dimensional objects. Even in the anime it's explained that the that what we see are mere shadows of the real molecules.

What are you talking about? The original text repeatedly mentions higher-order elements in the real world. Do you mean they live in a two-dimensional world？
当然、アミノ酸の右手系と左手系が入れ替わることだって可能だ。アーキタイプは『そういう高次元の操作』を必要とする物質なんだが、相手は高次元だ。人間の直観は届かない。アーキタイプ分子群に属する個々の分子の形がわかったとしても、それをうまく合成する『経路』がどれかはわからんわけだ紅塵は「これまで人類によって合成されたことはなかった」が「つとにその存在を知られた」分子ではあった。その分子構造は一九六〇年代に予測され、その後の計算機能力の増大によって存在が確証されつつある分子群と同一のものと考えられた。

分子群の名をアーキタイプ。

高次元空間の存在を前提としたその超分子構造の提唱者の名を葦原道幸。

 

[Unqver]

What are you talking about? The original text repeatedly mentions higher-order elements in the real world. Do you mean they live in a two-dimensional world？
当然、アミノ酸の右手系と左手系が入れ替わることだって可能だ。アーキタイプは『そういう高次元の操作』を必要とする物質なんだが、相手は高次元だ。人間の直観は届かない。アーキタイプ分子群に属する個々の分子の形がわかったとしても、それをうまく合成する『経路』がどれかはわからんわけだ紅塵は「これまで人類によって合成されたことはなかった」が「つとにその存在を知られた」分子ではあった。その分子構造は一九六〇年代に予測され、その後の計算機能力の増大によって存在が確証されつつある分子群と同一のものと考えられた。

分子群の名をアーキタイプ。

高次元空間の存在を前提としたその超分子構造の提唱者の名を葦原道幸。

What do you mean, high-dimensional refers to 3-D?

 

[Unqver]

What do you mean, high-dimensional refers to 3-D?

And, most importantly, high-dimensional cannot be in 3D just because the shape is different

 

[Arceus0x]

Also it's literally explained in the text you linked above that the scientists couldn't synthesise the molecules without higher dimensional manipulation.
Deadass says
オーソゴナル・ダイアゴナライザー自体は、高次元で振り回すことのできるカッターの刃のような代物だ。調整次第で、糊やピンセットのように用いることも可能である。今はその性質を、アーキタイプ分子の高次元成分を切り離すことに利用したい。より正確には、その分子を変形し、高次元成分と現実世界を直交させてしまいたい。
"The orthogonal diagonaliser itself is like a cutter blade that can be wielded in a higher dimension. Depending on the adjustments, it can be used like glue or tweezers. For now, we want to use its properties to separate the higher dimensional components of the archetype molecule. More precisely, we want to deform the molecule and make the higher dimensional component orthogonal to the real world."
literally the thing you linked explains that it has a higher dimensional component orthogonal to the real world, exactly the thing i am saying.

What are you talking about? The original text repeatedly mentions higher-order elements in the real world. Do you mean they live in a two-dimensional world？
当然、アミノ酸の右手系と左手系が入れ替わることだって可能だ。アーキタイプは『そういう高次元の操作』を必要とする物質なんだが、相手は高次元だ。人間の直観は届かない。アーキタイプ分子群に属する個々の分子の形がわかったとしても、それをうまく合成する『経路』がどれかはわからんわけだ紅塵は「これまで人類によって合成されたことはなかった」が「つとにその存在を知られた」分子ではあった。その分子構造は一九六〇年代に予測され、その後の計算機能力の増大によって存在が確証されつつある分子群と同一のものと考えられた。

分子群の名をアーキタイプ。

高次元空間の存在を前提としたその超分子構造の提唱者の名を葦原道幸。

What do you mean, high-dimensional refers to 3-D?

at this point it seems to me that you can't even properly understand the words i am saying, even though i am speaking in normal english. Just because something has 3D elements doesn't make it only 3D. The archetypes the humans see and touch is just a 3-dimensional slice of the true form of the archetype, which is higher dimensional.

And, most importantly, high-dimensional cannot be in 3D just because the shape is different

that is not my point at all. If you take a cube and take a square and put the square through the cube they will interact as a 2D slice of the cube will touch the square. The archetype is like that cube but in a higher dimension, and the 3D slice of it interacts with the 3D world.

 

[Unqver]

Also it's literally explained in the text you linked above that the scientists couldn't synthesise the molecules without higher dimensional manipulation.
Deadass says
オーソゴナル・ダイアゴナライザー自体は、高次元で振り回すことのできるカッターの刃のような代物だ。調整次第で、糊やピンセットのように用いることも可能である。今はその性質を、アーキタイプ分子の高次元成分を切り離すことに利用したい。より正確には、その分子を変形し、高次元成分と現実世界を直交させてしまいたい。
"The orthogonal diagonaliser itself is like a cutter blade that can be wielded in a higher dimension. Depending on the adjustments, it can be used like glue or tweezers. For now, we want to use its properties to separate the higher dimensional components of the archetype molecule. More precisely, we want to deform the molecule and make the higher dimensional component orthogonal to the real world."
literally the thing you linked explains that it has a higher dimensional component orthogonal to the real world, exactly the thing i am saying.



at this point it seems to me that you can't even properly understand the words i am saying, even though i am speaking in normal english. Just because something has 3D elements doesn't make it only 3D. The archetypes the humans see and touch is just a 3-dimensional slice of the true form of the archetype, which is higher dimensional.

that is not my point at all. If you take a cube and take a square and put the square through the cube they will interact as a 2D slice of the cube will touch the square. The archetype is like that cube but in a higher dimension, and the 3D slice of it interacts with the 3D world.

当然、アミノ酸の右手系と左手系が入れ替わることだって可能だ。アーキタイプは『そういう高次元の操作』を必要とする物質なんだが、相手は高次元だ。人間の直観は届かない。アーキタイプ分子群に属する個々の分子の形がわかったとしても、それをうまく合成する『経路』がどれかはわからんわけだ
The reason why humans cannot synthesize high-dimensional molecules is simply that their shapes are different
オーソゴナル・ダイアゴナライザー自体は、高次元で振り回すことのできるカッターの刃のような代物だ。調整次第で、糊やピンセットのように用いることも可能である。今はその性質を、アーキタイプ分子の高次元成分を切り離すことに利用したい。より正確には、その分子を変形し、高次元成分と現実世界を直交させてしまいたい。
アーキタイプ分子をアーキタイプ分子たらしめているものは、その高次元成分である。魔法の力は、別の次元との接続によって生み出されている。

The paragraph you posted was not complete, it's just a personal theory. How did it actually perform?

 

[Arceus0x]

当然、アミノ酸の右手系と左手系が入れ替わることだって可能だ。アーキタイプは『そういう高次元の操作』を必要とする物質なんだが、相手は高次元だ。人間の直観は届かない。アーキタイプ分子群に属する個々の分子の形がわかったとしても、それをうまく合成する『経路』がどれかはわからんわけだ
The reason why humans cannot synthesize high-dimensional molecules is simply that their shapes are different
オーソゴナル・ダイアゴナライザー自体は、高次元で振り回すことのできるカッターの刃のような代物だ。調整次第で、糊やピンセットのように用いることも可能である。今はその性質を、アーキタイプ分子の高次元成分を切り離すことに利用したい。より正確には、その分子を変形し、高次元成分と現実世界を直交させてしまいたい。
アーキタイプ分子をアーキタイプ分子たらしめているものは、その高次元成分である。魔法の力は、別の次元との接続によって生み出されている。

The paragraph you posted was not complete, it's just a personal theory. How did it actually perform?

Considering you're ignoring the entirety of the higher dimensional nature of the archetypes being stated over and over im gonna just go and wait for qualified staff to look at this. Gonna go now.

 

[Unqver]

Considering you're ignoring the entirety of the higher dimensional nature of the archetypes being stated over and over im gonna just go and wait for qualified staff to look at this. Gonna go now.

Ok, I don't have much time to argue about this now.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Yeah just ignore @Unqver as (no offense) his comments are freaking hard to understand, too complicated

 

[Unqver]

Yeah just ignore @Unqver as (no offense) his comments are freaking hard to understand, too complicated

So, can you be clearer about this novel than I am?
My viewpoint has always been very clear. The dimensions of this novel are not up to standard, and r>v is just a description of ordinary people

 

[Arceus0x]

Yeah just ignore @Unqver as (no offense) his comments are freaking hard to understand, too complicated

Yeah and he seems to be ignoring accepted wiki practices so might as well move on

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

So, can you be clearer about this novel than I am?
My viewpoint has always been very clear. The dimensions of this novel are not up to standard, and r>v is just a description of ordinary people

Bro just shut up, learn to fixing your way you commenting first, this will be my last post for you, anyway let's move on

 

[Arceus0x]

bump

 

[Just_a_Random_Butler]

Took a glance at the profile drafts. The key section should be relocated below the tier section. And the capitalization of the range terms should be capitalized as shown on the range page. There's also the editing issue regarding placing reference tags - they should be placed after punctuation. Aside from these, the pages look alright. No comments on tier 1, though.

 

[Arceus0x]

Took a glance at the profile drafts. The key section should be relocated below the tier section. And the capitalization of the range terms should be capitalized as shown on the range page. There's also the editing issue regarding placing reference tags - they should be placed after punctuation. Aside from these, the pages look alright. No comments on tier 1, though.

 

[EnderLord8]

I'm not an expert on this kind of thing, but reading everything and taking all my knowledge of tier 1 into account, it seems like it meets the necessary requirements to get 1-B

If I wanted to create a 1-B character, I would put similar justifications at least

 

[Antvasima]

@Executor_N0 @Agnaa @Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @PrinceofPein @Everything12 @Planck69 @Ovy7 @TheUnshakableOne @Rakih_Elyan @IdiosyncraticLawyer @Kerwin0831 @RatherClueless @DarkGrath

What do you think about this?

 

[TartaChocholate]

Sees a tier 1 Godzilla CRT

Sorry, sorry. But I so happy this is actually real.

 

[Arceus0x]

Sees a tier 1 Godzilla CRT

Sorry, sorry. But I so happy this is actually real.

don't get too excited, we don't know what the consensus will be here in the end.

 

[Qawsedf234]

What do you think about this?

For "It" there's at least enough evidence for Low 1-C, with the 1-B statement being straightforward but seemingly all there is regarding higher dimensions. The main issue to me is that orthogonal just means independent of or at an right angle. In either case there being countless higher dimensions can be called into question if you're being strick with wording.

For the rating it's fine. It would qualify to scaling to the cosmology and the higher dimensions are geometric in nature which is the bases for the tiering system anyways.

For the other stuff I don't know, I haven't looked at them yet.