God of War: Ragnarok Discussion Thread

[Diamentus]

Vision as an argument. Genius.

 

[KLOL506]

What would the threads even do? Wasn't it proven that they actually tried cutting the threads?

They did, and it failed. They literally chose temporal assassination as a last resort.

 

[Diamentus]

Using a movie to disprove "cosmic level battle" despite that everything pointing to Uranus creating the universe would ONLY lead to "cosmic level battle" being a universal battle.

 

[Diamentus]

How is this 37 pages?

 

[KLOL506]

Vision as an argument. Genius.

Literally ignoring that Gaia turned into an island to hide Zeus from the prying eyes of Cronos.

 

[Diamentus]

This ******* headcanon of "Gyes lying" despite nothing proving so.

 

[KLOL506]

You’re actually right, I misremembered! Hermes doesn’t react in time to a rock being launched from a catapult. I gave him too much credit. Also, where does Hercules factor into this?

LOL. JUST LOL. I can't believe he seriously chose death in using this line.

Are we to just ignore that Hermes was literally sitting on his ass on the statue when the catapult hit? Did we play the same game?

 

[Diamentus]

Completely ignoring the fact that the fight took place in the Chaos primordial realm, before the universe was punched out of Uranus. "But it's a nebula!" Yeah, and everything points to it being a universe, rather than just a nebula.

 

[KLOL506]

She’s able to move at infinite speeds to manipulate her threads, right?

So are Atropos and Lahkesis (Same exact feats as Clotho), and Kratos blitzed them. Thanks for proving to me that you don't believe in characters being able to stack up above baseline infinite speed and proving to me that you don't understand how powerscaling works.

 

[Diamentus]

Does he think Ariel is saying "No, time existed before Cronos." Because I don't see that anywhere.

 

[KLOL506]

Maybe he can use just a little bit of infinite speed while his son’s distracted and also in mortal danger. I guess him dying would keep him from learning that he and Kratos were gods. Makes me wonder why Kratos was worried about him at all.

Why would he do that when you don't need that kind of speed to plow through a small distance crevice? Logic has left the window I assume.

 

[Diamentus]

How is this confusing to him at all? It's physically the same moon, but in another universe. He also says "it doesn't hold up" despite having no evidence that it doesn't hold up, and WOG proves that it does hold up.

 

[KLOL506]

I wish he didn't use this link, because

1. Contradicted by secondary canon (Novel), which exists above WoG, which is tertiary canon, and if it is contradicted by source materials, source materials take precedence.

2. Cory also explicitly stated before that every myth controls their universes (It's even funnier once you realize that's literally the next tweet after that "Midgard is Scandinavia on Earth" tweet). See how we can both play the same game? The idea is that WoG is only acceptable if it does not contradict the source material, if it does, source material takes precedence.

3. Even if the branches weren't infinite, the realms are explicitly confirmed to be space-time continuums within the game itself, even without having to rely on WoG.

 

[Diamentus]

1. Cronos fought Uranus far after the primordial war.
2. The universe was literally inside of Uranus, it was punched out of him
3. It's a universe, not a galaxy

 

[Diamentus]

I swear to god, this guy has to be genuinely stupid. He clearly doesn't know what he's talking about.

 

[KLOL506]

Heck yeah we are, KLOL56, I am all about this! Especially if we’re starting to say that physical properties don’t work super well once magic is involved. Is it one of those things where it’s only if something can be said to be infinite that it counts? It’d help me if I knew what the breakdown was.

Ahem My Strength does not come from my body, but both are honed by discipline Ahem

Magic is intertwined with physicals and supernaturals in GOW. This is an inescapable fact. Gods are strong regardless of how they tone up their bodies because they're gods. Higher magic directly correlates to higher physical and supernatural ability prowess.

Not at all, especially because Odin never does anything that would make use of infinite speed.

Reacting to Kratos lunging at him would be good enough reason to slice out Atreus's life, buuuuuuut I guess he's one of those people who demand absolutely accurate on-visuals speed.

I’m arguing that if Kratos can’t use his infinite speed even when there’s no reason for him to hold back, say, when he’s trying desperately to catch up to a god who has captured his son, then he can’t actually be said to have it.

So you want the game to end in 2 seconds flat for the feat to be valid? Is that what you want?

Retconned with Ymir/Ginnungagap. On the plus side, I can now correctly spell Ginnungagap without looking it up.

Did he hear one goddamn thing about pantheons being completely separate from each other, all myth creation stories being valid, and Bruno straight up saying why SSM doesn't do retcons?

 

[Diamentus]

Ahem My Strength does not come from my body, but both are honed by discipline Ahem

Magic is intertwined with physicals and supernaturals in GOW. This is an inescapable fact. Gods are strong regardless of how they tone up their bodies because they're gods. Higher magic directly correlates to higher physical and supernatural ability prowess.



Reacting to Kratos lunging at him would be good enough reason to slice out Atreus's life, buuuuuuut I guess he's one of those people who demand absolutely accurate on-visuals speed.



So you want the game to end in 2 seconds flat for the feat to be valid? Is that what you want?





Did he hear one goddamn thing about pantheons being completely separate from each other, all myth creation stories being valid, and Bruno straight up saying why SSM doesn't do retcons?

If the game was infinite in speed, the game would end in 0 seconds flat. The guy straight up doesn't want a game

 

[KLOL506]

I’m not claiming that it didn’t have a similar cosmic feel, just that the cosmic feel is that it takes place in space with stars. Like Gravity, with Sandra Bullock and George Clooney.

Literal ******* headcanon that such a battle with a cosmic feel only involves a battle in outer space and doesn't involve wrecking the absolute crap out of it.

I also love it how he constantly accuses me of saying things that aren't true and then also accusing me of being unable to accept facts when in reality he is literally the one projecting himself onto me.

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

I guess Sandra Bullocks and George Clooney are cosmic power houses now.

 

[Lilixa]

Some people really try to push "Vs debaters are inconsistent" agenda. After that, they will make video about it just to shitstorm entire VS debaters.

yep but at the same time someone saying saitama is wall level or something with made up justification.

Should be careful since human has hypocrisy and dualism or even trandualism behavior by default

 

[KLOL506]

Completely agree with you here. The blog post was quite old, and I’m happy that we’ve reached a more reasonable consensus on that. Also, it wasn’t a timeless void.

It was a timeless void, "eons and eons" doesn't mean much as there is no concrete time scale slapped onto this and eons literally means "indefinite period", Gaia could've easily said "hundreds or thousands of years" to make the argument valid, but she didn't. The blog literally addresses this argument.

The exact statement from the blog on this feat was Zeus had a “godly version” of the Hyperion Dash. My problem here was that a statement from WOG was being twisted to fit a narrative, rather than being properly used as evidence for what was happening.

I didn't know basic scaling logic is now "twisting answers to fit a narrative". Logic has completely left the window I guess.

I feel like you say this when you’re not certain how to respond, KLOL56. It’s okay to re-evaluate things given new evidence.

Funny he says this while ignoring evidences himself and literally huffing copium because he can't realize that the comics are literally being blunt about the stuff they say.

Definitely does matter if he creates the galaxy, I would love to hear this reasoning expanded upon. I am also willing to compromise with you and say that there may be as many as three hundred stars in that space. Can anybody reach out to Limit Breakers about this?

No, it does not matter, he merely needs to know that such a thing exists, and just like that, boom, galaxies exist in the GOW universe. You don't need rocket science to connect the dots here.

What if there’s magic involved?

Your claim, not mine.

And did the IRL equivalent ever determine that the universe was billions of lightyears wide? I’m actually curious if there are any historical records on this.

Ah yes, the good old "ancient people didn't have adequate knowledge to know the true size of the universe" argument trying to conflate with a fantasy series made by developers in the 21st century who have no reason to pursue historical accuracy with video games built clearly to provide an escape from reality. Like @Aetheric Pariah himself would say, I HAVE SEEN IT ALL, FOLKS.

Where did Ariel Lawrence say it was a copy? Her statements are short and explicit. The word “copy” never appears in them. It’s our moon as seen from another dimension.

I didn't know that even with common sense you wouldn't be able to dictate this.

Statements aren’t evidence. I will say it again, because KLOK56 didn’t really disprove it. The Greek world does not encapsulate all of it.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this is the part where you effectively lose all credibility.

The artbook calls it vast, which introduces a lot of ambiguity.

There is no artbook, only the Prima Guidebook, which literally repeats Cecil Kim's statements verbatim with some slight grammatical changes, but the "infinite distance" part there is spot on.

The Bonus Disc blatantly states it's a chasm of immeasurable magnitude. Now, if it didn't have the "infinite distance" statements, sure, it'd mean to be just vast, but with the infinite distance statement slapped on, the immeasurable magnitude statement only serves to add icing on the cake.

I will continue to argue that the infinite properties of the underworld, if they do exist, aren’t as simple as the attempt to create evidence for the infinite speedfeat makes them seem.

It's literally that simple, but if your overdose on copium prevents you from seeing this, then I am afraid I can help you no further.

Exaggerations, as evidenced by Hermes, in a life or death situation, being unable to move off of a statue before it got hit by a catapult shot. I really am sorry, I genuinely thought Hermes had a more impressive failing there.

I swear to god this guy has listened to none of the points I made about Hermes being a lazy-ass to the point of thoroughly underestimating how far Kratos would go to wipe out the pantheon, or the fact that he was literally sitting on his ass on the statue when the catapult hit, doing ****-all.

KLOL56, you might want to re-read what I said. I’ll repost it for you: “There’s a little more about Hermes guiding the souls of the dead to the underworld and bringing dreams to mortals in real time, and I can’t see how that counts as a speed feat. What the latter statement confirms is that he’s like Santa, and what the former confirms is that he runs a lot. I say this because we don’t see him doing it. If he was going from person to person, passing out little travel pamphlets… you get what I’m saying, I’m sorry, I could have presented that more maturely. But it doesn’t equate to him running to each person individually or anything like that.

Once again, wrong, and please don't bother using your "exaggerations" headcanon on this again because we have seen just how dangerously dishonest you have been with your arguments.

He’s fast, but evidently having the speed to travel to the other end of the universe instantly didn’t lead to him using that to save his life.

Because he's arrogant and lazy as ****.

You’d think he would have chilled out on Jupiter or something while Kratos worked out his issues. Or in the underworld, considering he can get there instantly.” It doesn’t matter if Kratos knows what Hermes amuses himself with. It matters that it doesn’t seem like, when push comes to shove, it actually holds up.

Because again, Hermes being lazy and arrogant as **** means nothing to you, does it?

I actually covered this a little! I think the preoccupation with God of War: Ascension comes from it being seen as the best game to boost the feats of the series. It was written to sound cool and epic, and I think it’s better that it did, even if it doesn’t mesh with the direction the series took, because it made for a better experience at the time.

And all that cool and epic was literal and etched into the lore, in case you haven't noticed.

Omnipresence is also not a thing in the God of War franchise.

Argument from incredulity at its finest.

They have every reason to hyperbolize their details. They want to sound cool.

Didn't know that the gods being unfaithful sex-crazed maniacs sounded cool.

KLOL56, do you think everybody caught a fish that big, or totally sunk that three point shot when you weren’t looking? We want to feel good about ourselves. We want to feel strong.

Apples to oranges comparison, IDK why you made such a dogshit statement to begin with.

For gods, embellishing your story and having it become part of the mythos, a reason mortals pray to you for salvation, is a huge thing that they’re after. Odin even brings this up directly, when he mocks Kratos for never experiencing the kind of love that pure worship provides.

Okay? And how does it prove the stories of the Gods to be false?

And God of War II isn’t downplayed at all if the actors aren’t capable of infinite feats. It’s still a compelling story of a man seeking vengeance upon the gods who brought ruin to his family and life.

And also about a man having been driven so far over the edge that he will stop at nothing to achieve said vengeance, even if it means the death of the world.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaand that's it. His parting words are his interpretation and if he doesn't agree, cool, let him be in his own delusions, and let him be bothered with his own definitions of what the term "misrepresentation" means here.

I know he will also work on a response to these arguments but I fear he will keep using the same old arguments over and over and over again so it's best not to give this man any more attention than he's already gotten.

 

[Dienomite22]

The guy doesn't know basic information. He obviously dislikes our ratings of the verse but isn't confident enough in his proposal to create a CRT on the website where people can properly respond to his argument and going by the arguments he made you can see why he lacks confidence.

 

[Shmooply]

Yea, just don't waste energy on this guy.

 

[KLOL506]

I also find it funny that the dude ignores the other tweet that Cory makes after that WoG tweet that the dude put in his Google Docs.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Dienomite22 that sounds like every single downplayer outside of the wiki I’ve ever seen.

 

[BEASTHEART8800]

He doesn't seem worth engaging lol

 

[CorneredHarbor]

This.

Let’s Talk About God of War

Let’s Talk About God of War The original Introduction I was inspired to write this because, strangely enough, nobody else had. (Unless I just missed it? I know there’s been scattered commentary on the God of War franchise’s power level increase, but nothing quite like what I wrote.) Kratos, see...

docs.google.com

It has now come to my attention that he is now literally going against the comics and the Comic-Con interview and just... coping. Yeah no, not even worth addressing anymore.

Honestly, from what i've seen he didn't really add anything new to the table. I saw these arguments like a hundred times.

 

[KLOL506]

Omnipresence is also not a thing in the God of War franchise.

Ha. Ha ha ha. Hahahahahahahahahahahaha.

NO.

"GAIA STIRRED AGAIN from her slumber when the gods mentioned Kratos. Her interest had been piqued when not only Zeus but also Hermes began speaking of him. Now another goddess brought Zeus information that puzzled her enough to eavesdrop.

For anywhere there were trees and earth and rock, there was Gaia." - GOW2 Novel Chapter 17

"Well that he should, Gaia thought. The Sisters of Fate decreed that he be there when Kratos released Prometheus. She inhaled and mountain ranges rose. When she sighed, river valleys formed and continents moved. Gaia had hoped for his triumph, but now there was more than hope. Distinct possibilities existed." Also GOW2 Novel Chapter 17

So not only do we have temporal omniscience, we also have Gaia be omnipresent on the Mortal Earth as well.

 

[BEASTHEART8800]

How strong is the main character from Elden Ring? How haxxed are they? Are they more powerful and haxxed than the hunter from Bloodborne? I want to match the hunter up with the redeemed Warrior once the CRT passes, and then the MC from Elden Ring.

 

[Theglassman12]

@KLOL506 you're welcome btw

 

[KLOL506]

@KLOL506 you're welcome btw

Thanks. You and @Aetheric Pariah both.

 

[KLOL506]

Mach 14.36. They can easily keep up with Pegasus which can make rounds from Rhodes to Mt. Etna (The imprisonment spot of Typhon) within 4 minutes flat.

Rhodes to Mount Etna is roughly 1182 km.

GOW2 Guidebook + Artbook confirms that Typhon is actually imprisoned in Mount Etna BTW.

 

[BEASTHEART8800]

Speaking of Elden Ring

 

[Lilixa]

Speaking of Elden Ring

OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

[Lilixa]

dammit i really love Odin as character, i don't know why...

 

[Diamentus]

This just in: Existence Erasure now scales you up to high outerversal. Who would've thought?

 

[RH0904]

we need some help over at the elden ring thread.

 

[RH0904]

This just in: Existence Erasure now scales you up to high outerversal. Who would've thought?

WUT? That doesn't make any sense?????????????

 

[KLOL506]

This just in: Existence Erasure now scales you up to high outerversal. Who would've thought?

GIVE ME THE NAME. I want to know which madlad made this claim.

 

[Diamentus]

GIVE ME THE NAME. I want to know which madlad made this claim.

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