Ganon vs Joker

[KnightOfSunlight]

You use the anime, which is inaccurate to the games and showings in them.

 

[ZephyrosOmega]

Silentpixels has a point. What's Ganon's mindhax resistance? End-Game Ren's mindhax is comparable to Yaldy, who mindhaxed 10^29 complex minds at once via Mementos.
Granted, psychokinetic attacks aren't considered mindhax yet, and mental ailments aren't exactly Ren's first move, so he likely still gets sealed first, anyway.

How is Ren's mindhax comparable to Yaldabaoth

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Direct counterpoint to that.

It's too bad Persona spells have also confirmed to be malleable, so thanks for the extra evidence towards it.

 

[ZephyrosOmega]

You use the anime, which is inaccurate to the games and showings in them.

You say while ignoring that the Milly's example is also using the anime

 

[ZephyrosOmega]

counterpoint to that.

It's too bad Persona spells have also confirmed to be malleable, so thanks for the extra evidence towards it.

Thanks for breaking down your own point that Ren will randomly open with insta-spawn deathhax before Ganon flips him off

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

I used mine as a reference to boost Sol's point. Persona spells have been proven to be malleable, so you literally did nothing but prove our point, that helps their malleable status.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

And you didn't read anything that's gone on this thread if you believe that's what he was said, Sol straight up said "lack of decisive spell progress causes ren to use death-Hax".

 

[ZephyrosOmega]

I used mine as a reference to boost Sol's point. Persona spells have been proven to be malleable, so you literally did nothing but prove our point, that helps their malleable status.

Your point: All persona spells are insta-spawn.

My counterpoint: Direct evidence to the contrary.

Your "counterpoint": "haha you showed evidence of them not always being instant-spawn so that means Ren will use instant-spawn!"

Never did Solacis say anything about them being "malleable".

I know Persona is one of the most hax-wanked verses on this site along with BlazBlue and DMC but surely you can see the issue here

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Malleable includes it being instant and homing. It can quite literally be either or, but it's noted primarily used as instant spawning. Hell, Yu the same thing at 1:49, where a Zio spells instantly spawns on top a shadow and strikes him.

Regardless, the point I made with my clip of the anime directly contributes to what Sol's was in the game, from the same game. So unless you have evidence on it from both the game and anime not being instant homing (which is literally part of it being malleable, being the point I made, I never mentioned Solacis) then that's it.

 

[Silentpixels]

we can't see the issue if theres no issue to see

""""""""

Solacis didn't say it, milly did, not that it should matter since theres also death spells that affect multiple opponents

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Gameplay consistently shows it being instant and homing, too, so it's not gameplay mechanics.

 

[KnightOfSunlight]

I had only seen Solacis' video, any showings from the anime are usually to be taken as inaccurate because well... they are.

But I'm gonna repeat what I said in the other thread and tell you to stop having a shit tone.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

The only thing I'm upset about is that this is another case of animations being taken at face value, but Seismic Toss got tossed out. Pun intended.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

The only thing I'm upset about is that this is another case of animations being taken at face value, but Seismic Toss got tossed out. Pun intended.

Again, the gameplay proves it more than the anime.

 

[Silentpixels]

wouldn't megidolaon also point to spells as being instantaneous

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

wouldn't megidolaon also point to spells as being instantaneous

It is.

 

[Silentpixels]

so theres little proof as to spells being connection based as opposed to being instant

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

My question is how do spells ever miss if they're instantaneous? And why would they ever use physical variants? I don't doubt it as hard as I used to, but like, hows this different from Final Fantasy just placing fira on enemies?

 

[RicardoSama]

Big Pig FRA unless counter claim

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

My question is how do spells ever miss if they're instantaneous? And why would they ever use physical variants? I don't doubt it as hard as I used to, but like, hows this different from Final Fantasy just placing fira on enemies?

It's like BlazBlue, Noel's guns aim wherever she sees, making "dodging" impossible... but it happens anyways.

And some characters are more physical than others, hence, Akihiko & Yusuke.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Big Pig FRA unless counter claim

The claim was instant deathax that spawns on him.

 

[Thatsafloridathing]

Wasn't sealing debunked as a starting move for Ganon though? Voting for Ren here, his death-hax seems a bit too potent for Ganon to deal with.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Yup.

 

[Silentpixels]

im sure he would still seal if the fight would drone on long enough that he realizes magic and regular attacks aren't working

its just that ren is more likely to switch to magic faster

 

[RicardoSama]

K thx for that, Ima ren unless counter clain

 

[KnightOfSunlight]

Ren says die and Ganon obliges FRA

 

[Dr._whiteee]

Most persona spells spawn directly on the target. But there is a degree of malleability possessed by persona users as said persona's have general elemental manipulation as well. Carmen can simply summon a fireball in her hand and throw it as a projectile, yusuke can eminate his coldness andfreeze opponents , Haru can conjure a shieldof specific size . These uses are not the specific spells we see used during combat, just general uses of their powers.

The spells used in combat specifically spawn on target which we can seehere vs Wakaba [2] , [3] . In the same animation style used for spells, we are shown a ballista moving through the air as a projectile . Psychokinetic skills probably being the best examples because we are shown them spawning on target and then ramming into enemies .

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

As I had said before, thank you, Whitee.

 

[Solacis]

With Ganon's wincon debunked, the votes are now:

Ren: 4 (Me, Milly, Silentpixels, Knight)

Ganon: 0

 

[RicardoSama]

I said Ren fra

 

[Solacis]

5 - 0

 

[TheQuirkyBoy]

Ren FRA

 

[Solacis]

One more till grace. Oh how the turn tables.

 

[Silentpixels]

well to be fair ren had no case when the ganon voters said he wins which was incredibly dumb since it was a one sided argument

 

[Bware1]

Ren FRA

 

[Solacis]

And that's grace.

 

[I'm_Blue_daba_dee_daba_die]

Joker FRA

 

[Thatsafloridathing]

Grace actually started an hour before Bware cast his vote, my vote wasn't counted there

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Honestly Ganon chucks him into the dark world long before death gg.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Honestly Ganon chucks him into the dark world long before death gg.

O.O