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Ehh idk about that. Captain atom literally always holds back, he even held back against necron when they fought.
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Firestorm Upgrade
- Thread starter Adem_Warlock69
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It depends on if it was just portrayed as a giant explosion or something that can genuinely reset an entire continuum.
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I agree with Waka. Captain Atom rarely every uses all of his powers and abilities as it is not within his character and well, scared of letting loose. He can also bring down his power levels at will, so that's not supporting evidence for L2C
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Low 2-C seems better
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I know. But I think unless shown otherwise, the Big Bang should be treated as it generally is IRL, a low 2-C force
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This is what has been accepted. Is somebody willing to apply it so we can close this thread?
We need to decide whether 3-A is better to use that Low 2-C though. What do the knowledgeable members here think?
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I can make the edits later today.
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At least High 3-A possibly, Low 2-C seems fine.
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High 3-A? I thought we didn’t accept infinite-sized universes?
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Do you mean "At least 3-A, possibly Low 2-C"?
Anyway, thank you for helping out. Feel free to apply the edits.
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Sorry. That's what I meant.
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That is true. It would be an explosion that destroys everything but firestorm. Nothing implies timeline or dimension destruction. 3-A should suffice.
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As a side note, idk why a big bang would really be Low 2-C for creating time and space when it doesn't create all the time that will happen in the future until its end, just the present time, all things in a timeline that happened after that weren't created by the big bang, time just moves forward on its own because that's what time does.
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Big bangs are low 2-c here, and creating the future isn't needed, it literally creates spacetime which is a 4D universal construct
Big bangs are low 2-C its science
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That's false, they can be 3-A or Low 2-C, and the idea behind the latter tier seems flawed. By that logic anything that destroys all space and only the present time is Low 2-C too without even destroying the past because "lol that spacetime is a 4D universal construct". Create or destroy a timeline would be Low 2-C, and any Big Bang that starts and stops only creates the beginning of the universe.
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It depends on the context.
@Antvasima
I'd like your input on distinguishing the context of the statements below regarding the note on the Big Bang page.
"If a supposed Big Bang is inaccurately presented as a purely physical explosion, and a character withstands it, we tend to treat it as a 3-A feat. If a character generates a 4-D spacetime expansion that creates an entire universal continuum from scratch, it is treated as Low 2-C."
Does Firestorm's Big Bang affect spacetime in this case for Low 2-C? Looking into Imperiex, his Big Bang destroys the universe and creates a new one, whereas Firestorm's just destroys "everything in existence" except him.
Dr. Stein says the following:
- Now that the Matrix is fully bonded to you both, Firestorm is going through yet another Metamorphosis. A final stage, I mentioned. You're becoming more powerful than you could imagine.
- [The Matrix is] The big bang. The trigger for starting the universe or restarting it in this case.
- The universe is an endless cycle of expansion and contraction. It lives and grows for billions of years. And then collapses and starts again. According to countless scientists, including The Atom, this universe is long overdue.
- Think of yourselves as a living version of the large hadron collider underneath the Franco-swiss border.
- Everytime you and Ronald argue, you're causing a destabilization in the Matrix. The more you're at odds, the higher chance of triggering a new big bang.
- [What are the chancesof that, Professor?] At emotional equilibrium, near zero. But agitated? One in a million. Maybe one in a hundred thousand.
- You two blow up, and everything in existence will be destroyed, leaving only the two of you.
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Why is that?
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Why is destroying the past needed
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I mean without going into universe CRT too much, you need to create or destroy an entire timeline to be low 2-C. That said a space-time is a synonym for a timeline as said by Ultima, so if you create a space-time, you create the entire future of a universe as well.
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Please read our tiering page.
A space-time continuum is, space and time alone aren't as time can just refer not to all of time from its beginning to its end but only the present time. In that sense, space and time aren't a whole timeline, just 1 moment in it.
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I can apply it later today, now that things have been clarified.
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I updated the profile. Let me know if the format and wording is okay.
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The changes have been applied. Also, thanks for reminding me about firestorm. He has really good abilities so I think I'm going to try to find some good hax and make an additional thread
I think this thread can be closed
I think this thread can be closed
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I made a few adjustments. He has not been presented as invulnerable to anything below universal scale attacks, or as far more powerful than regular DC superheroes in general.
vsbattles.fandom.com
Firestorm (Ronnie Raymond) (Post-Crisis)
The original Firestorm was distinguished by his integrated dual identity. High school student Ronnie Raymond and Nobel Prize-winning physicist Martin Stein were caught in a nuclear accident that allowed them to fuse into the "nuclear man" Firestorm. Due to Stein's being unconscious during the...
vsbattles.fandom.com
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I mean it characters’ powers fly outwards from them then they’re not tanking it right?
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Yes, it is comic book logic. Characters do not necessarily scale to the energy that they are able to expel.
In this case we have to scale him from the level that is most consistent, and regular supevillains far below tier 4-B can regularly harm him, so even our current rating is generous. He is not presented as anywhere near as invulnerable as Superman, for example, but is usually used as a bit of a glass cannon.
In this case we have to scale him from the level that is most consistent, and regular supevillains far below tier 4-B can regularly harm him, so even our current rating is generous. He is not presented as anywhere near as invulnerable as Superman, for example, but is usually used as a bit of a glass cannon.
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Yes it shouldn't ignore newton's third law and its not "comic book logic", also characters far below 4-B havent hurt him, when has that happened?
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Does Newton’s third apply when you’re the nuke itself? I mean I can see it applying, so I’m neutral.
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- Thread starter
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The Ronnie and Jason Firestorm only fought Deathstorm and Anti-Monitor tho
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Killer Frost and the Hurricane guy, whatever his name was, for example. They both fought the Jason Rush Firestorm, if I remember correctly. Also, Firestorm tends to avoid attacks, not walk right into them.
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