Felicia Mitsuki vs. The Doom Slayer

[Jaakubb]

Where do we put the limit to this heat thing? It would be pretty weird for a 4-B character to be harmed by a nuke (100,000,000 degrees celsius iirc). But I can still see the reasoning behind it.

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

Bump

on its immortalities, the doom slayer is going to have (not yet, but is being discussed) immortality negation (type 2 and 4) as it can permanently kill (unless removed) the icon of sins with its crucible.

and probably Fate hax but I think that will be for your pre-Doom eternal keys.

 

[SomebodyData]

@Ricsi Immortality type 2 and 7 keeps that from being a problem

@Oliver unless the Icon of Sin got killed without any physical damage, Immortality type 2 negation isn't / wouldn't be a thing.

 

[Jinsye]

cough cough cough

 

[SomebodyData]

It's the equivalent of negging soul manip immunity despite not having a soul.

Sekiro seems to be a special case from what I can tell, mostly because it seems to come from some form of death manip or something rather than outright negation.

 

[Schnee_One]

Death Manip is only when unsheathing the sword, his death Manip is inapplicable otherwise

 

[SomebodyData]

It's very description mentions that they're both of said ability.

 

[Jaakubb]

Pretty sure Ricsi's point was that a 7-B character with no established heat resistance could still potentially get harmed by heat with, say, 8-B levels of energy. Don't know what the lower bound would be, 6-A getting hurt by 8-C even if they don't have any heat resistance feats seems kinda ridiculous, but this might be avoided with friction or whatever. Even if we could use friction, it would still have to be calced which is a whole other thing. Anyways, "blood boiling" was just one example. If Mitsuki doesn't have enough heat resistance, her soul gem could get melted or vaporized by DS.

 

[SomebodyData]

But like I mentioned, both melting and vaporization are AP feats. Yes a 6-A can get hurt, but that'll be because of cell death, the same way a 6-A can get hurt freezing or poison.

 

[Schnee_One]

It's very description mentions that they're both of said ability.

What quote do you mean? It says "Takes the life of any who dares draw it"

 

[SomebodyData]

An odachi capable of slaying the undying. Its crimson blade will take the life of any who dares draw it. Without the power of Resurrection, one could not hope to wield this weapon, which allows one to defeat even infested beings.

Using the following sentence for context here, it's referring to the power that takes the life of it's user as the same one that kills even the infested.

 

[Schnee_One]

CRT might be necessary for that

 

[SomebodyData]

Might not have been the intent, but it's all currently in the same description on Wolf's page anyways, so either the creator of the page misspoke or that's how it's always been.

 

[Schnee_One]

I mean if what you're saying is true about it being Death his immortality negation shouldn't be on his page, unless it has to be labeled like that anyway

 

[SomebodyData]

I dunno, seems like a nitpick since it links to death manip anyways, but alright, I'll do it alongside the KE revisions.

 

[Schnee_One]

KE revisions? Those aren't done?

 

[SomebodyData]

Ye

It just happens that the 7-C calc (maybe the others) break the KE rules.

 

[Schnee_One]

You know what I'm going to stop derailing.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

That's not how his sword works, nor is this the thread for Sekiro talk. Regarding the 7-C calc... for Wolf, it does not, for DOOM, I'd be open to believing that the case though I don't know which rule you'd actually be referring to.

 

[DTG499]

We should close this until doom eternal discussions are over. The BFG might be getting upgraded to 6-A and doomguy's physical tier to low 2-C depending how we interpret the statements of the icon of sin being able to destroy the universe.

 

[Jaakubb]

Wait how is bfg going to 6A?

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

when climbing to BFG 10000(that made a hole towards the center of Mars that is visible from phobes as if a pizza only had 3/4 slices) since 9000 is its power source

 

[DTG499]

Wait how is bfg going to 6A?

Doomguy shot it at mars and it made a crater this big

 

[SomebodyData]

Nice but this is their low 7-B vers.

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

we know but it is not decided yet if the bfg 9k escalate to 10k.

 

[DTG499]

Nice but this is their low 7-B vers.

It's going to scale back to 2016 doom if it goes through. And the calculation ended up being low 5-B to 5-B

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

basically the doom slayer rips and tears pmmm low and mid tier ovo

 

[DTG499]

Also to clarify about heat being hax sometimes, if you can heat something to a high enough level the molecules of that substance will just split apart. So high enough levels of heat can be a form of limited matter manipulation.

 

[SomebodyData]

@DTG Again, nice but this is their low 7-B vers.

Unless BFG - 9000 scales to Doom Slayer's physical stats, it shouldn't be relevant. Though I guess if it gets upgraded, it would mean that its no longer relevant to the fight.

That's just matter changing forms, like ice to water. But again, to do would require AP.

@Oliver he gets outhaxed by the low tiers tho

 

[DTG499]

If you vaporize atoms with matter manipulation it's treated as hax, heat is the same way.

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

doom slayer still has his Fate hax level archi sonic :v

 

[SomebodyData]

When explicitly matter destruction, yes.

Otherwise no. Unless you want to make a thread revising every character whose vaporized something, but you'd have to make that first.

Oliver archie's fate hax was basic tho

 

[DTG499]

When explicitly matter destruction, yes.

Otherwise no. Unless you want to make a thread revising every character whose vaporized something, but you'd have to make that first.

Oliver archie's fate hax was basic tho

If you vaporize something with heat, it's heat hax. I don't need to make another thread about it's already established.

 

[SomebodyData]

It's not established though. Show me a single heat manip page with 'heat hax' that isn't considered an AP feat.

 

[Jaakubb]

Heat is both hax and AP. Characters with x heat resistance can be assumed to have x normal dura iirc. Or maybe only if they have a common energy source. But it's never the other way around.

 

[DTG499]

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Superman_(Post-Crisis)

Big one right here. In the last thread we did with him he was going up against goku. And I shit you not all 50 of them agreed that Superman's heat vision negates durability via heat that matches absolute zero.

 

[SomebodyData]

Again, I understand that.

But what you're saying is in regards to cell death, which is irrelevant here.

Vaporization is an AP feat.

 

[DTG499]

Again we are dealing with manipulation of atoms, molecules, cells etc via HEAT. Vaporizing a human sized frame via heat would only translate to 9-A but negation of durability for that size(human frame). It doesn't translate to being able to vaporize a city. Just to vaporize someone who can destroy a city and tank city level attacks and doesn't have heat resistance.

 

[SomebodyData]

The specific change in the state of matter from heat is due to the energy added or subtracted. If you can survive 9-A amounts of energy, you should be able to survive 9-A amounts of energy.

Cell death on the other hand is specifically due to proteins being misshaped thanks to the heat.

The thread that dealt with this concluded that it varies with each verse. Is the BFG 9k's heat shown to be independent from AP and PMMM's heat independent from AP? If both are a yes, then you'd be correct. But neither verse shows this.

 

[DTG499]

Yes because the heat is would scale to 5-B but(previous to the BFG 10K feat) not to the actually force AP of the BFG, which has demonstrated 8-B. So they work independently, only pre doom enteral though. But this argument really is pointless because the BFG is probably going to be high 6-A soon.