Fairy Tail: Low 2-C Neo Eclipse

[CloverDragon03]

No, this title isn't some sort of joke. This is real.

This is the fourth Fairy Tail CRT since the forum move and this one is all about Neo Eclipse. This weapon was going to be used by Zeref to reset time back to 400 years ago. It wasn't just time travel, he was going to erase the entire Fairy Tail world via a time reset. In the context of time, the word "world" is synonymous with the word "universe" due to the universal scale of time itself. A time reset can't only affect something like a planet because of this. Neo Eclipse is currently sitting at Unknown right now, but as the title suggests, I have a tier suggestion for Neo Eclipse:

Unknown, likely Low 2-C

An important thing to note is that this does not scale to Fairy Heart Zeref's AP at all, as Neo Eclipse was only able to be formed by combining Fairy Heart with the Space Between Time. Therefore, if Zeref had just absorbed Fairy Heart, he would've had the Fairy Heart form, but he wouldn't have been able to create Neo Eclipse.

I've also compiled a few scans that further prove that Neo Eclipse was going to erase the world via a time reset here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17u_Mky10K3lh4wQ63D6xzSoO9wN47cB5h5x66-VPjjM/edit?usp=sharing

This will probably be a controversial thread, so let's please keep this civil.

Agree with Low 2-C Neo Eclipse: No

Disagree with Low 2-C Neo Eclipse: Yes

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

 

[CloverDragon03]

It was inevitable.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

.-.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

I completely agree with this, first let’s look at the explanation behind “Low 2-C”

“Characters who are capable of significantly affecting, creating and/or destroying an area of space that is qualitatively larger than an infinitely-sized 3-dimensional space. Common fictional examples of spaces representing such sizes are space-time continuums of a universal scale. However, it can be more generally fulfilled by any 4-dimensional space that is either:”

Zeref explicitly says that Neo Eclipse is not time travel and that he does not merely go to the past, but that he will reset time back 400 years ago and everyone’s lives will be remade, that means everything that has happened for the past 400 years will be erased completely and a new timeline will be formed, this means Zeref will be destroying an entire space-time continuum’s time for 400 years, Zeref calls Neo Eclipse the power that will end the world, with Mavis herself saying that Zeref will be erasing the current world with Zeref also clarifying that when Neo Eclipse activates, the present world will crumble and be replaced by a new world, that means the timeline itself gets destroyed and a new one is created in its place, lastly, the kanji for world used is “世界” and it can be translated to mean universe, all of this certainly falls within the definition of “significantly affecting a 4-dimensional space” for at least a "Likely Low 2-C" and would give Neo Eclipse the qualifications for said tier

 

[Slacjow]

Eh, can't you just give him Time Reset or something? Low 2-C isn't necessary.
But if other characters have low 2-C for the same ability it's fine.

 

[Ionliosite]

Disgareed. It doesn't reset the entire timeline, just deletes some years of time, so it doesn't qualify for Low 2-C.

 

[Zencha9]

i agree it was stated multiple times that it would destroy the timeline

 

[CloverDragon03]

Disgareed. It doesn't reset the entire timeline, just deletes some years of time, so it doesn't qualify for Low 2-C.

Zeref says that the old world was going to crumble away and a new one was going to replace it.

 

[senseikeleon]

Completely neutral on this I’ll definitely have wait to see what others points are

 

[Ionliosite]

Zeref says that the old world was going to crumble away and a new one was going to replace it.

That doesn't mean it affects the whole timeline, just that the current point in time would stop existing, which is true, but isn't enough for Low 2-C.

 

[CloverDragon03]

What it means is that the entire timeline would disappear and a new one that takes place 400 years ago would take its place. This is further supported by the fact that Zeref said it was a time reset and it was stated multiple times that the entire world would disappear.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

Unless the Fairy Tale verse is like only 400 years old I don’t see how this is Low 2-C since it’s not affecting the entire timeline. Why would this even be AP?

 

[CloverDragon03]

Unless the Fairy Tale verse is like only 400 years old I don’t see how this is Low 2-C since it’s not affecting the entire timeline. Why would this even be AP?

It's AP because it was going to destroy the entire Fairy Tail world. As stated before, it's a time reset and was stated multiple times that it was going to actually destroy it and have a new timeline take its place.

 

[Ionliosite]

What it means is that the entire timeline would disappear and a new one that takes place 400 years ago would take its place.

No, what this means is that it was going to delete 400 years of history, destroying the present as a result, and replacing it with a new one created by the new history where those 400 years went differently. This isn't Low 2-C because it doesn't affect the entire timeline, just 400 years.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Not according to this statement from Zeref. According to this, the entire world will disappear and it will be replaced by Zeref's timeline: https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net...dence7.jpeg/revision/latest?cb=20201018184935

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

No, what this means is that it was going to delete 400 years of history, destroying the present as a result, and replacing it with a new one created by the new history where those 400 years went differently. This isn't Low 2-C because it doesn't affect the entire timeline, just 400 years.

Would it be High 3-A rather than Low 2-C then?

Cause Neo Eclipse still resets the universe itself, however it may only be on an infinite 3-D level rather than a 4-D level

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

So he’s destroying the universe?

Would it be High 3-A rather than Low 2-C then?

Characters who demonstrate an infinite amount of energy on a 3-D scale, or those who can affect an infinite 3-D area or an infinite number of finite or infinite universes when not accounting for any higher dimensions or time, or more generally any realm of comparable size. Large numbers of infinite universes, unless causally closed from one another by a separate spacetime or existence, only count for a higher level of this tier. Being “infinitely” stronger than this level, unless uncountably so, does not qualify for any higher tier.

Sure if you can prove it affected an infinite area or has 3-A amounts of energy.

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

Is there something new that was not brought up on this thread? https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Thread:4131658?useskin=oasis

Or is the whole 400 years thing?

In which case I dont see how this will end up different

 

[CloverDragon03]

So he’s destroying the universe?

Yep, via a time reset.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

Well, there's sadly no way to prove that Fairy Tail Universe is infinite, however we do know it is at least as large as our Universe, so I guess the only thing that would work would be "Unknown, likely 3-A" as the universe itself would be destroyed and recreated

I may have just misunderstood what Low 2-C was

 

[Ionliosite]

Would it be High 3-A rather than Low 2-C then?

Cause Neo Eclipse still resets the universe itself, however it may only be on an infinite 3-D level rather than a 4-D level

... No, again, it needs to affect the timeline from the start to finish to be Low 2-C, and just affecting a part of space-time is just hax rather than AP.

 

[Ionliosite]

Not according to this statement from Zeref. According to this, the entire world will disappear and it will be replaced by Zeref's timeline: https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net...dence7.jpeg/revision/latest?cb=20201018184935

That scan only says he'll destroy the present, which he obviously will do since he's erasing 400 years, not the whole timeline, so still not Low 2-C.

 

[CloverDragon03]

... No, again, it needs to affect the timeline from the start to finish to be Low 2-C, and just affecting a part of space-time is just hax rather than AP.

Mitch is suggesting High 3-A, not Low 2-C

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

Mitch is suggesting High 3-A, not Low 2-C

H3A would not work unless is stated or proven the universe is of infinite size

 

[Ionliosite]

Mitch is suggesting High 3-A, not Low 2-C

High 3-A is even more unbased, since he isn't destroying an infinite sized universe.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

Well, there's sadly no way to prove that Fairy Tail Universe is infinite, however we do know it is at least as large as our Universe, so I guess the only thing that would work would be "Unknown, likely 3-A" as the universe itself would be destroyed and recreated

I may have just misunderstood what Low 2-C was

Okay now.
why is it more likely he is destroying the entire universe as opposed to 400 years of that planets history?

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

Mitch is suggesting High 3-A, not Low 2-C

Actually I'm just suggesting 3-A, we have no way to prove the Fairy Tail Universe is infinite, all we know is that the universe itself would crumble

 

[Tyri456]

Not according to this statement from Zeref. According to this, the entire world will disappear and it will be replaced by Zeref's timeline: https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net...dence7.jpeg/revision/latest?cb=20201018184935

To be honest, @Ionliosite explained perfectly, this is most likely a figurative way for zeref saying that the actaul present will be gone because a new one will be formed after the reset.

The problem still persist, that 400 year is unquatificable for low 2c, because low2c involve all the time in the space-time continuum.

But I'm neutral, because I do not really know how to evaluete this one in terms of AP, so I'm neither against neither agreeing.

 

[BlackeJan]

I see this as more hax then AP since nothing is actually being destroyed just reseted back in time

 

[UeTa]

I totally agree with this, since my first reading of the chapter. I alway have seen Néo Eclipse as the action of overwriting an old backup (World save) with a early, fresh copy. Which why the old world is destroyed. A bit like what you do in Skyrim when you "go back in time" and you overwrite you current world save with a old one.

 

[Ionliosite]

I see this as more hax then AP since nothing is actually being destroyed just reseted back in time

Reseting time can count as Low 2-C AP if the entire timeline is reset, as is the case with Enrico Pucci. Now, since this only resets 400 hundreds isntead of the whole timeline, it doesn't qualify.

 

[CloverDragon03]

To be honest, @Ionliosite explained perfectly, this is most likely a figurative way for zeref saying that the actaul present will be gone because a new one will be formed after the reset.

The problem still persist, that 400 year is unquatificable for low 2c, because low2c involve all the time in the space-time continuum.

But I'm neutral, because I do not really know how to evaluete this one in terms of AP, so I'm neither against neither agreeing.

It's possible that it was figurative, but taking it at face value, it's as simple as the world being destroyed.

Personally, I'd say it's still viable for 3-A, because even though it's not resetting everything, the fact remains that the world was going to get destroyed (and I'm saying 3-A instead of High 3-A because it can't be proven that the FT universe is infinite)

 

[Ionliosite]

Starting from the fact "destroying the world" is a vague statement that can mean from destroying humanity, the planet or the multiverse varying on multiple factors, Zeref is destroying the world by erasing the present and the 400 years of history before it, which is just time hax that's not AP applicable since it doesn't affect the whole timeline.

 

[CloverDragon03]

The fact that the world is being destroyed via a time reset is enough to justify it being universal since time itself is on a universal scale.

 

[Rikimarox2]

I hard disagree. This just seems like Hax, and most of what Zeref said is more than likely figurative. Not to mention, "World" could mean literally anything.

 

[Ionliosite]

The fact that the world is being destroyed via a time reset is enough to justify it being universal since time itself is on a universal scale.

By this logic, every single time hax is Low 2-C because time is universal. No, deleting time on a scale that doesn't affect the entire timeline isn't AP, it's literally the definition of time hax.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

Yeah, I have to disagree with Low 2-C Neo Eclipse now that it's been explained to me, I also agree that it's likely just hax now, the main reason I agreed is because I thought that resetting time in general was Low 2-C, but I guess I was wrong about that, since Zeref didn't effect the entirety of a timeline, it doesn't qualify, it mega sucks, but yeah, the best we can do for Neo Eclipse is Unknown

 

[CloverDragon03]

Also, I don't get how Zeref saying that the world will be destroyed and a new one will take its place is figurative. There's nothing to suggest that this is the case, especially coming from the smartest person in the Fairy Tail verse.

Edit: I'm fine with it being time hax, I just want an explanation on this.

 

[Zaratthustra]

Agree with Ion. Just deleting some hundreds of years is not enough for Low 2-C. At the same time, the "world" can be for humanity, the planet, the solar system, the Universe, and more... it's too vague.