Elden Ring Profiles

[Mr. Bambu]

I made the blog

So using Arkham's sandboxes here's my suggestion of how I think the tiers should work

I don't think I agree with 5-C, tbh. Nokstella is underground, and whether or not it is an actual moon as we know it is questionable. I definitely, obviously disagree with even a possibly Tier 4 scaling to Radahn, Radahn's feat is objectively not Tier 4 outside of the usage of the word star. We see the exact effects of an impact of one of his falling stars. So just absolutely not, man. Radahn's stars aren't literally star-sized, the possibly Tier 4 concessions were for the Elden Ring and all who could scale.

There is though, it's just not a statement directly saying "he destroyed the moon guys"

But we can infer that given the lines about him taking away the sky, which based on other descriptions led to the moon being "lost", and this is shown via the memory stone fragments as meaning it was destroyed and fragmented.

I doubt the moon that was destroyed is an Outer God, as even though there is a dark moon outer god in theory, we know Outer Gods can't really appear in the Lands Between or do stuff there (that's a major part of their lore and motivations) even. So there's no way the moon of Nokstella, which was a physical thing given the fact it was fragmented, was the Outer God or something on its level

I actually don't agree with that, really. Nokstella and the other Eternal Cities are underground with glowing... something on the ceiling, implicitly being their sky. It doesn't really track that Astel destroyed a proper celestial body that was contained in a subterranean section roughly the size of a couple cities. Instead, I suspect they are referring to breaking open the "sky" of the cavern- making a hole in the Earth. Regardless of my own theories, I don't agree with 5-C based on this.

I'd try to reply to the massive amount of posts following this, but I don't feel I have much relevant to add as you guys were arguing over something I'm disavowing to begin with.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

I don't think I agree with 5-C, tbh. Nokstella is underground, and whether or not it is an actual moon as we know it is questionable. I definitely, obviously disagree with even a possibly Tier 4 scaling to Radahn, Radahn's feat is objectively not Tier 4 outside of the usage of the word star. We see the exact effects of an impact of one of his falling stars. So just absolutely not, man. Radahn's stars aren't literally star-sized, the possibly Tier 4 concessions were for the Elden Ring and all who could scale.

The possible High 4-C comes from a calculation, where someone counted all the streaks of light in the sky, and assuming somenof those were stars, and the other lights were meteors. So the High 4-C is not just stars ignoring any meteors, or vice versa. It takes into account, both.

 

[Paul_Frank]

I don't think I agree with 5-C, tbh. Nokstella is underground, and whether or not it is an actual moon as we know it is questionable. I definitely, obviously disagree with even a possibly Tier 4 scaling to Radahn, Radahn's feat is objectively not Tier 4 outside of the usage of the word star. We see the exact effects of an impact of one of his falling stars. So just absolutely not, man. Radahn's stars aren't literally star-sized, the possibly Tier 4 concessions were for the Elden Ring and all who could scale.

The Radahn stars aren't small, there was a line from Blaidd saying the thing that fell was a fallingstar, fallingstars are notably separated from actual stars via a lot of descriptions which call them meteors or meteoric explicitly, as opposed to stars, star clusters, constellations etc, which notably aren't described as that. So the Limgrave crater which was made by a meteor logically can't be used to argue all the stars are miniature in the Lands Between

I actually don't agree with that, really. Nokstella and the other Eternal Cities are underground with glowing... something on the ceiling, implicitly being their sky. It doesn't really track that Astel destroyed a proper celestial body that was contained in a subterranean section roughly the size of a couple cities. Instead, I suspect they are referring to breaking open the "sky" of the cavern- making a hole in the Earth. Regardless of my own theories, I don't agree with 5-C based on this.

I'd try to reply to the massive amount of posts following this, but I don't feel I have much relevant to add as you guys were arguing over something I'm disavowing to begin with.

This isn't the case, Astel's stuff happens before Nokstella is banished underground, it used to be above ground and had a normal sky. The series of events based on descriptions is that they did something, Astel came, took their sky from them and leveled the cities, then they were banished underground and subjected to a false night for going against the Golden Order and Greater Will, prior to that however they were above ground, hence their large amount of space related stuff, and yearning for a real sky again

 

[RH0904]

Bump.

 

[RH0904]

what else are we discussing next?

 

[Paul_Frank]

I'm not entirely sure what there is to discuss besides early game ap and stuff, the stats for anything after and including Radahn seem to have been agreed on by the majority, although stuff like LS always has the potential for better feats, even a value for that's been decided

 

[RH0904]

I'm not entirely sure what there is to discuss besides early game ap and stuff, the stats for anything after and including Radahn seem to have been agreed on by the majority, although stuff like LS always has the potential for better feats, even a value for that's been decided

there might be the occasional superise.

 

[RH0904]

btw, i think we should add a possibly higher to Radahn's 4-C because there are no limits that are outright metioned, but one limit could be that it takes a lot of effort, but charging also raises up the potency, which is litterally metioned all over the place where spells are concerned. take this with a grain of salt.
a

 

[RH0904]

waiting for a response as usual.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Ain't +'s used for the high ends of tiers though?

 

[RH0904]

Ain't +'s used for the high ends of tiers though?

thank for pointing that out, i just edited the aforemetioned comment.

 

[Paul_Frank]

Idk the rating is already a possibly to begin with, idk if you can even add a possibly higher to one of those

 

[RH0904]

ok, on second thought, i am literally stumped.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I'm not entirely sure what there is to discuss besides early game ap and stuff, the stats for anything after and including Radahn seem to have been agreed on by the majority, although stuff like LS always has the potential for better feats, even a value for that's been decided

Sorta thought the opposite, early game stuff is coming together nicely whereas Radahn and afterwards has a lot of discussion, given I've just learned the exact argument for 5-C. I had hoped it would be more concrete.

Still, if it is the wish of this thread, we could try getting a staff consensus together.

(For the record I am currently on Discord speaking to Paul, I'm not just ignoring the man, though I do dislike the perspective he possesses).

 

[Qawsedf234]

Ain't +'s used for the high ends of tiers though?

You have to fall within 0.5 to 0.6< of the highest end for a tier to get a plus rating

Sorta thought the opposite, early game stuff is coming together nicely

So like, what are we using for Rennala backwards AP wise?

 

[AnAverageUsername]

You have to fall within 0.5 to 0.6< of the highest end for a tier to get a plus rating



So like, what are we using for Rennala backwards AP wise?

Whatever small dragons are form what's been discussed here

 

[Paul_Frank]

Sorta thought the opposite, early game stuff is coming together nicely whereas Radahn and afterwards has a lot of discussion, given I've just learned the exact argument for 5-C. I had hoped it would be more concrete.

I think early game is the least concrete since there's not even like, an AP value afaik. It's just spit balling theoretical things to scale from right now.

Still, if it is the wish of this thread, we could try getting a staff consensus together.

I mean the thing is there sorta is a consensus, not a unanimous one, but the majority of both staff and non staff (2 administrators, and a discussion mod) agreed to at least a possibly for the tier 4 and a majority/general agreement to something is what a consensus is

 

[Mr. Bambu]

So like, what are we using for Rennala backwards AP wise?

I don't really know about specifically Rennala, because she fits into a very strange spot, having fought against Radagon, pre-Marika combination.

I will say that we have quite a lot of ideas on what to scale lesser bosses to, more feats to throw around, whereas for Radahn we have his stars falling and that's approximately it. EoG guys are most likely getting "possibly High 4-C" though that is not concrete yet, as I must reiterate.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I don't really know about specifically Rennala, because she fits into a very strange spot, having fought against Radagon, pre-Marika combination.

What I mean is that we need something to scale an early Tarnished, Godrick and insane Rennala to. Currently I don't know what that is and we can't make profiles for them without having that scaling established.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

We have the early Tarnished being able to survive lightning. Like straight up with little damage.

IIRC, it's 8-C as of now, but there was a CRT to make it 9-A+ or something IDK. I dunno if that was accepted

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

We also have At least 8-B, possibly 7-C for the Falling Star Beast. I feel like we could scale Godrick (And by extension current Rennala) to that via scaling above Tree Sentinel. And we see Tree Sentinel as mini bosses nearby the Leyndell Falling Star Beast

 

[Mr. Bambu]

What I mean is that we need something to scale an early Tarnished, Godrick and insane Rennala to. Currently I don't know what that is and we can't make profiles for them without having that scaling established.

This is true, though these are not all early game profiles. Similar to some late-game profiles lack scaling (Rykard and such, I recall people having issues with scaling them to Radahn when I mentioned it).

Lightning unfortunately isn't 8-C for tanking it, only for attacking with it, as you can actually tank lightning irl due to the lightning being grounded. At the very least we can upscale from shit-tier bosses, ig? Trolls, dragons, etc. Runebears can destroy large chunks of ruins. Surely they can upscale, aye?

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Also we can harm Greyoll iirc. Could we get GPE via her?

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Also we can harm Greyoll iirc. Could we get GPE via him?

She's ******* massive, too bad she doesn't move otherwise we could've gotten an insane KE Feat via that Dive Bomb attack Dragons love to spam.

 

[Qawsedf234]

, ig? Trolls, dragons, etc. Runebears can destroy large chunks of ruins. Surely they can upscale, aye?

Yeah but what are the values that they scale to? They need to have a feat to scale from but I don't know what we're using for that.

We also have At least 8-B, possibly 7-C for the Falling Star Beast. I feel like we could scale Godrick (And by extension current Rennala) to that via scaling above Tree Sentinel. And we see Tree Sentinel as mini bosses nearby the Leyndell Falling Star Beast

I guess that could work.

Also we can harm Greyoll iirc. Could we get GPE via her?

You could but Greyoll can also die if you kill enough of her children. But Zullie has calculated Greyoll's size two different times.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

You could but Greyoll can also die if you kill enough of her children.

I feel like that would fall under ssome kind of weird immortality gimmick or whatever. Point is, the option for folding her straight up exists.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Also for summons against bosses. How would we treat them scaling wise? Would they be case by case basis? I feel like the only one who wouldn't scale to the bosses they summon against would be Alexander?

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Also for summons against bosses. How would we treat them scaling wise? Would they be case by case basis? I feel like the only one who wouldn't scale to the bosses they summon against would be Alexander?

Summons as in other NPCs or Summons with the Bell? We usually just scaled Dark Souls Summons to the Bosses they fought, it's why Yuria is scaled to me.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

BTW, here's the updated Radahn page without the scans yet. And a random draft I did for Malenia's P&A because I was bored

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Summons as in other NPCs or Summons with the Bell? We usually just scaled Dark Souls Summons to the Bosses they fought, it's why Yuria is scaled to me.

NPC, like Millicent, Rogier and Nepheli

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

NPC, like Millicent, Rogier and Nepheli

We usually just scaled Dark Souls Summons to the Bosses they fought, it's why Yuria is scaled to me.

Alexander would be the exception since he admitted to essentially getting One-Shot by Radahn though he does get stronger later on.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Also for summons against bosses.

Well in my view for Spirit Ashes:

• Legendary Summons probably should scale with their lore rather than with gameplay. For example the Knight that defeated Goedfroy probably shouldn't be scaling to the Elden Beast
• The Mimic Tear is just the PC
• The non-legendary ashes should just be whatever their base thing is

For PC summons I think its mostly a case by case thing.

• For example Alexander mentions that Radahn one shot him and Blaidd outright states the Tarnished was the one who got all the glory, meaning that canonically the Tarnished was the main threat and the one who did most of the heavy lifting in that fight
• Alexander mentions that he was shocked the Tarnished defeated the Fire Giant and personally thought that not a single other person would be able to do that. After fighting him he also states it was impossible for him to win in a fight against the PC
• In 100% playthough the Tarnished will fight the bulk of people present for Radahn and defeat them in pitched combat later on

Overall besides a handful examples like Blaidd they really wouldn't scale to the player character in my view and even Blaidd is iffy on what version of the Tarnished he would scale to.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Well in my view for Spirit Ashes:

• Legendary Summons probably should scale with their lore rather than with gameplay. For example the Knight that defeated Goedfroy probably shouldn't be scaling to the Elden Beast
• The Mimic Tear is just the PC
• The non-legendary ashes should just be whatever their base thing is

I disagree with this. The Ash Summons directly scale to their Summoner as shown with Rennala/Ranni's Summons being able to damage and kill the Tarnished.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

In an alternate universe, theres a chance for Alexander to be 4-A....

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

TBH, I feel like late game Alexander is a glass cannon. He can legit do a lot of damage with his fire attacks if you're not careful

 

[Qawsedf234]

Rennala/Ranni's Summons being able to damage and kill the Tarnished.

When the Tarnished fights Rennala's shade, everything she's summoned is something the player character has already fought. We're also saying that the people the Tarnished fights in that encounter aren't scaling to Radahn's feat, meaning them being the same tier isn't wild.

TBH, I feel like late game Alexander is a glass cannon. He can legit do a lot of damage with his fire attacks if you're not careful

Gameplay wise yeah. But by his own dialogue there states directly that he stood no chance against the Tarnished.

Ah, I see you've finally made it here yourself. The city hanging in the air is slowly crumbling. What an incredible place we find ourselves. But that aside, you're certainly a force to be reckoned with, eh. I doubt there's a single soul who could've handled that giant, other than you. It was practically a god...

Of course I count myself, the great Alexander, among the many. Which means, I've but one thing to ask of you. Would you kindly undertake my ordeal? Come and tell me when you're ready. I've been longing to fight a warrior as accomplished as you.

You are ready then, I take it? Then let us begin! I am the great jar warrior, Iron Fist Alexander! Lend me strength, O warriors within! Let us become one champion, together!

As I suspected... Victory... was impossible. This vessel... was found lacking...

My thanks, I knew you were the stuff of champions. It was a marvellous battle. I implore you, take what I bequeath...from inside me... All vessels are destined to one day break. But the great Alexander lived as a warrior to his last! Ha ha ha ha!

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

When the Tarnished fights Rennala's shade, everything she's summoned is something the player character has already fought. We're also saying that the people the Tarnished fights in that encounter aren't scaling to Radahn's feat, meaning them being the same tier isn't wild.

Your own Ash Summons can literally be Upgraded to stay relevant to your arsenal, so you can just say that they get stronger over the course of the game since every function exists in the lore. Hell, the Spirit Tuning thing was considered a huge deal by the people in the Round Table when Roderika first learned about it.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Your own Ash Summons can literally be Upgraded to stay relevant to your arsenal

They can be upgraded sure, but even then not every spirit ash should be scaling to the maximum possible end. Unless we're going to say stuff like the Jellyfish or Giant Rat ashes should be 4-A since they can theoretically be summoned for the Elden Beast fight.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

They can be upgraded sure, but even then not every spirit ash should be scaling to the maximum possible end. Unless we're going to say stuff like the Jellyfish or Giant Rat ashes should be 4-A since they can theoretically be summoned for the Elden Beast fight.

Maybe not but the Legendary Ash Summons should scale 1 to 1 with you at least since they're the cream of the crop for Ash Summons, especially since one of them can literally just turn into you and was created in an attempt to make an Artificial Elden Lord.

 

[Qawsedf234]

especially since one of them can literally just turn into you and was created in an attempt to make an Artificial Elden Lord.

I acknowledged that

• The Mimic Tear is just the PC

The Mimic Tear is just a clone of the Tarnished. Which is why it would always scale. But we should be careful about how we do other Spirit Ashes.