Downgrade of weapon users

[NikHelton]

Not so long ago, I participated in a discussion where it was decided that character A does not scale to character B, since it uses a weapon to kill him. This makes sense to some extent, but for some reason it is used in isolated cases.

I will give you an example of several situations and characters. I MUST SAY RIGHT AWAY THAT THE EXAMPLES GIVEN ARE USED FOR A CLEAR EXAMPLE AND CAN BE EXPLAINED BY CONVENTIONS. JUST IGNORE THEM.
Sorry for the capslock, but this is done so that the supporters of the verse do not start explaining to me the subtleties of their universes.

And so we have:

Drax, scaling up to Kull Obsidian, impaling him with his knives.

Musashi Miyamoto, who uses katanas to harm Pickle, Yujiro and Hanayama.

An Atomic Samurai who also uses a katana to kill all his enemies.

And also the whole verse of "Demon Slayer", where all the pillars use weapons

It should also hurt every shooter whose shoot have no calculations, but scale to the durability of the creatures they killed/hurted.

For example, if we calculated the strength of a character through an explosion and the surface area of the body, then to find the strength of the weapon, we must divide the area of the body by the area of contact of the weapon.

This should have a big impact on the wiki.

 

[KLOL506]

Not so long ago, I participated in a discussion where it was decided that character A does not scale to character B, since it uses a weapon to kill him. This makes sense to some extent, but for some reason it is used in isolated cases.

I will give you an example of several situations and characters. I MUST SAY RIGHT AWAY THAT THE EXAMPLES GIVEN ARE USED FOR A CLEAR EXAMPLE AND CAN BE EXPLAINED BY CONVENTIONS.

Peak. Absolute peak. Do no research on the verses at all and claim to know they're clear examples while ignoring all context.

Sorry for the capslock, but this is done so that the supporters of the verse do not start explaining to me the subtleties of their universes.

If you don't understand the subtleties then don't attempt a mass downgrade right off the gate. Especially one of this kind that has been rejected for eons now.

Wolverine that scales up to Hulk using its claws.

I don't think I have to tell you that Wolvie doesn't even scale to the claws physically (Even his flesh and muscle doesn't scale, only his bones do because duh). Or what those claws are made out of.

ADAMANTIUM. A metal that harms Tier 2/1 beings on a regular basis.

Drax, scaling up to Kull Obsidian, impaling him with his knives.

Again, only his knives scale.

Dante uses his weapon to defeat Cerberus

UES means this entire argument is invalid. Majority of his weapons come from Tier 7/6/4 demons, while the man himself has Tier 2 feats to show for it, or scales to Tier 2 folk. Not only that, his dad replicated all the Tier 2 feats with his own power and channeled those powers into random-ass useless weapons to do so.

and Kratos, who uses the sword of Olympus to kill Kronos.

Terrible, terrible argument to make, solely because of GoW's UES. Because of said UES, a weapon in GoW is only as good as their user and their magic level depending on how much energy they pump into it, and we have multiple instances of such happening. Hell, even failed QTEs will show you that even if Zeus uses the BoO against Kratos with all his might, it can't even cut all the way through and Kratos's skin poses a significant amount of resistance against it, to say nothing of the fact that in succesful QTEs he can legit stop it dead in its tracks with his bare hands.

As for Cronos? The Blade of Olympus literally acts as a conduit for its own wielder's power to channel it through. It won't work in the hands of mortals. PERIOD. The Blade has no power on its own because Kratos drained it completely for his own use, and is now channeling his own raw might into it.

Plus, Kratos himself is a Tier 1 being who can tango with these people with his bare hands and has the scaling to show for it. All his other weapons are Tier 2/1 in scope as well.

It should also hurt every shooter whose shoot have no calculations, but scale to the durability of the creatures they killed/hurted.

For example, if we calculated the strength of a character through an explosion and the surface area of the body, then to find the strength of the weapon, we must divide the area of the body by the area of contact of the weapon.

This should have a big impact on the wiki.

Nah. You're taking this way too far for comfort. I halve half a mind to tag other staff members and have this closed immediately.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

What exacly is your goal to begin with?
It's obvious that it needs to be case by case there are multiple things that need to be taken into consideration when scaling with or without weapons

 

[KLOL506]

@Planck69 @Emirp sumitpo @LordTracer @Theglassman12 @DemonGodMitchAubin @KingTempest @LordGriffin1000 @Elizhaa @Maverick_Zero_X @DarkDragonMedeus

 

[NikHelton]

Peak. Absolute peak.

I'm sorry, but I don't understand your point. I use a translator.

If you don't understand the subtleties then don't attempt a mass downgrade right off the gate. Especially one of this kind that has been rejected for eons now.

I made this thread because I saw a problem. Why don't you just help me figure it out instead of telling me I shouldn't have created the thread? The essence of the thread is in the discussion.

I don't think I have to tell you that Wolvie doesn't even scale to the claws physically. Or what those claws are made out of.

We are talking about his key "Claws"

ADAMANTIUM. A metal that harms Tier 2/1 beings on a regular basis.

It doesn't really matter, since we rely on profiles. Logan damaged the High 3-A character with his claws. Which have increased penetrating power due to the small area of contact.

Based on what I've heard from another member of the calculation group, it doesn't give us the ability to scale the weapon up to this creature.

Again, only his knives scale.

Yes, but his knives also have a reduced contact area.
If a child stabs Batman with a knife, it won't make him a "9-A" with a knife.

UES means this entire argument is invalid. Majority of his weapons come from Tier 7/6/4 demons, while the man himself has Tier 2 feats to show for it, or scales to Tier 2 folk. Not only that, his dad replicated all the Tier 2 feats with his own power and channeled those powers into random-ass useless weapons to do so.


Terrible, terrible argument to make, solely because of GoW's UES. Because of said UES, a weapon in GoW is only as good as their user and their magic level depending on how much energy they pump into it, and we have multiple instances of such happening. Hell, even failed QTEs will show you that even if Zeus uses the BoO against Kratos with all his might, it can't even cut all the way through and Kratos's skin poses a significant amount of resistance against it, to say nothing of the fact that in succesful QTEs he can legit stop it dead in its tracks with his bare hands.

Please read what I wrote with a capslock. I know what a huge job you've done on GoW and DMC, and I respect that. However, I made it clear that some points are explained by conventions and given as examples on which we can see everything clearly.

Nah. You're taking this way too far for comfort. I halve half a mind to tag other staff members and have this closed immediately.

Because... why? Why should a character with a weapon receive a "6-C" key with a weapon for being able to pierce a 6-C creature with a weapon if the area of the bullets is made to increase the penetrating power?

 

[SYPHe5D]

Peak. Absolute peak. Do no research on the verses at all and claim to know they're clear examples while ignoring all context.


If you don't understand the subtleties then don't attempt a mass downgrade right off the gate. Especially one of this kind that has been rejected for eons now.


I don't think I have to tell you that Wolvie doesn't even scale to the claws physically. Or what those claws are made out of.

ADAMANTIUM. A metal that harms Tier 2/1 beings on a regular basis.


Again, only his knives scale.


UES means this entire argument is invalid. Majority of his weapons come from Tier 7/6/4 demons, while the man himself has Tier 2 feats to show for it, or scales to Tier 2 folk. Not only that, his dad replicated all the Tier 2 feats with his own power and channeled those powers into random-ass useless weapons to do so.


Terrible, terrible argument to make, solely because of GoW's UES. Because of said UES, a weapon in GoW is only as good as their user and their magic level depending on how much energy they pump into it, and we have multiple instances of such happening. Hell, even failed QTEs will show you that even if Zeus uses the BoO against Kratos with all his might, it can't even cut all the way through and Kratos's skin poses a significant amount of resistance against it, to say nothing of the fact that in succesful QTEs he can legit stop it dead in its tracks with his bare hands.

As for Cronos? The Blade of Olympus literally acts as a conduit for its own wielder's power to channel it through. It won't work in the hands of mortals. PERIOD. The Blade has no power on its own because Kratos drained it completely for his own use, and is now channeling his own raw might into it.

Plus, Kratos himself is a Tier 1 being who can tango with these people with his bare hands and has the scaling to show for it. All his other weapons are Tier 2/1 in scope as well.


Nah. You're taking this way too far for comfort. I halve half a mind to tag other staff members and have this closed immediately.

I think the op even forgot that the Sword Dante uses is the physical manifestation of his Power also: "A memento given to Dante by his father, this large magical blade is the physical manifestation of Dante’s power

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

For example, if we calculated the strength of a character through an explosion and the surface area of the body, then to find the strength of the weapon, we must divide the area of the body by the area of contact of the weapon.

Would this not just lead to a lot of calc stacking?

Like I don't get the point of this thread, we already do it as a case by case basis

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Which have increased penetrating power due to the small area of contact.

No? Adamantium can harm characters that powerful because it is just that strong of a metal.

 

[KLOL506]

I'm sorry, but I don't understand your point. I use a translator.

No, I don't think I will.

I made this thread because I saw a problem. Why don't you just help me figure it out instead of telling me I shouldn't have created the thread? The essence of the thread is in the discussion.

Because there's no point. Fiction doesn't care about nitty-gritty details like this especially when supernatural metals are involved.

We are talking about his key "Claws"

And?

It doesn't really matter, since we rely on profiles. Logan damaged the High 3-A character with his claws. Which have increased penetrating power due to the small area of contact.

Wrong. Wolverine can harm those people with his claws exactly because they're made of adamantium, not because of surface area abuse.

Based on what I've heard from another member of the calculation group, it doesn't give us the ability to scale the weapon up to this creature.

I am afraid that's not how Tier High 3-A and above go, so no.

Yes, but his knives also have a reduced contact area.

Okay? It's just piercing damage. It's inconsistent in American comics and is never meant to be taken seriously in any metric. We have rules against this in our Powerscaling and PIS pages.

If a child stabs Batman with a knife, it won't make him a "9-A" with a knife.

At the same time we're not gonna downgrade Batman from 9-A because piercing damage.

Please read what I wrote with a capslock. I know what a huge job you've done on GoW and DMC, and I respect that. However, I made it clear that some points are explained by conventions and given as examples on which we can see everything clearly.

Said conventions get nuked completely once you read the underlying verse logic. So they cannot serve as examples. PERIOD.

Because... why? Why should a character with a weapon receive a "6-C" key with a weapon for being able to pierce a 6-C creature with a weapon if the area of the bullets is made to increase the penetrating power?

Because more often than not it's more so the property of the metal being strong that grants this? Or the blade actually has consistent feats of harming Tier 6 characters?

 

[KLOL506]

I think the op even forgot that the Sword Dante uses is the physical manifestation of his Power also: "A memento given to Dante by his father, this large magical blade is the physical manifestation of Dante’s power

Also this. The Demon Blades in DMC are a physical manifestation of Dante and Vergil's true power. The blades are just conduits.

 

[KLOL506]

Also another thing.

Piercing damage doesn't automatically mean you can pull it off if you don't have the appropriate strength. Piercing damage is just how efficiently you can transfer that energy within a small surface area, you still need to apply elbow grease to it. You're not gonna be able to cut through steel with a normal-ass blade if you don't have the raw might and technique required to impart that kind of energy in the first place.

 

[StrymULTRA]

It doesn't really matter, since we rely on profiles. Logan damaged the High 3-A character with his claws. Which have increased penetrating power due to the small area of contact.

It literally can't jump the damage output to an infinite degree lmfao.

Because... why? Why should a character with a weapon receive a "6-C" key with a weapon for being able to pierce a 6-C creature with a weapon if the area of the bullets is made to increase the penetrating power?

Trust me, a 8-C will never and ever be capable of be harmed through conventional weaponry. A thing is piercing power, but it still has sizeable limits (like KE can still be calculated).

 

[KLOL506]

It literally can't jump the damage output to an infinite degree lmfao.

Exactly, imagine what's gonna happen if you try using that against Tier 2/1 people.

Trust me, a 8-C will never and ever be capable of be harmed through conventional weaponry. A thing is piercing power, but it still has sizeable limits (like KE can still be calculated).

Good old PIS and plot arrive.

 

[KLOL506]

Would this not just lead to a lot of calc stacking?

Precisely why we were barred from measuring energy from pressure via piercing damage, else we got wanked results like 8-B to 8-A.

 

[SYPHe5D]

Also another thing.

Piercing damage doesn't automatically mean you can pull it off if you don't have the appropriate strength. Piercing damage is just how efficiently you can transfer that energy within a small surface area, you still need to apply elbow grease to it. You're not gonna be able to cut through steel with a normal-ass blade if you don't have the raw might and technique required to impart that kind of energy in the first place.

Basically this, even IRL a swordsman has to be strong enough in order to cut though stuff, like even with a sharp sword you can’t even cut through wood without exerting enough Power.

 

[NikHelton]

No? Adamantium can harm characters that powerful because it is just that strong of a metal.

Durable and sharp. Yes. These are still sharp pins whose shape suggests that they fit into something more easily

 

[StrymULTRA]

Durable and sharp. Yes. These are still sharp pins whose shape suggests that they fit into something more easily

You're essentially saying those things can multiply the damage by an infinite degree, when they clearly are within finite measurements.

 

[NikHelton]

Would this not just lead to a lot of calc stacking?

Like I don't get the point of this thread, we already do it as a case by case basis

Yes, that's what's going to happen.

However, I don't understand why this should concern some characters and bypass others.

 

[KLOL506]

Durable and sharp. Yes. These are still sharp pins whose shape suggests that they fit into something more easily

Finite measurements, multiplying piercing power to potentially infinite higher-dimensional degrees. Do you see the problem here?

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Durable and sharp. Yes. These are still sharp pins whose shape suggests that they fit into something more easily

Do you have a scan that says Adamantium can pierce through character that strong because it's sharp?

The explanation has always been because it's a strong metal. Adamantium is the same metal that makes up Cap's shield, a shield powerful enough To tank blows from Thor and characters of similar level.

There's still the problem that Adamantium is High 3-A. You can try divide and subtract High 3-A all you want and it'd still be Infinite. You cannot divide Infinity

 

[StrymULTRA]

Plus this piercing power thing isn't even true irl, tanks only receive extremely minor damage from guns and the like, they need weapons made right to destroy those to be damaged.

If OP is right, tanks can be destroyed from using just a bunch of assault riffles against them.

 

[KLOL506]

Do you have a scan that says Adamantium can pierce through character that strong because it's sharp?

The explanation has always been because it's a strong metal. Adamantium is the same metal that makes up Cap's shield, a shield powerful enough To tank blows from Thor and characters of similar level.

That is indeed correct.

Adamantium is considered to be a "virtually indestructible" steel alloy as per the official Marvel page. The claws are also stated to be capable of piercing almost anything solely due to adamantium and its strength. Not because "omegalol piercing damage".

There's still the problem that Adamantium is High 3-A. You can try divide and subtract High 3-A all you want and it'd still be Infinite. You cannot divide Infinity

This too. Infinity divided by anything is still infinity.

 

[NikHelton]

No, I don't think I will.ъ

Continue to behave in a toxic way

Because there's no point. Fiction doesn't care about nitty-gritty details like this especially when supernatural metals are involved.

Why is this applicable in some cases, but not applicable in others?

And?

You said that Wolverine doesn't physically scale to its claws. I explained to you what the "Claws" key meant

Okay? It's just piercing damage. It's inconsistent in American comics and is never meant to be taken seriously in any metric. We have rules against this in our Powerscaling and PIS pages.

Different contact area. Why, then, do we use body area when trying to find strength through explosion? After all, the authors did not think about these when they drew an extra half meter between the characters.

At the same time we're not gonna downgrade Batman from 9-A because piercing damage.

There was not a word about it. I don't understand why you said that.

Said conventions get nuked completely once you read the underlying verse logic. So they cannot serve as examples. PERIOD.

Ignore these examples, lol. I wrote that some of them can be explained by the conventions of the verse, but are used to describe the situation.
However, it seems like you specifically decided to make a show of it.

Because more often than not it's more so the property of the metal being strong that grants this? Or the blade actually has consistent feats of harming Tier 6 characters?

The strength of the metal allows the bullet not to collapse, but to enter the body. However, it still enters the body more easily because it is a small piece of metal flying at high speed. It cannot scale to the full durability of the character.

 

[Shmooply]

sees thread title
sees tags and verses brought up

OP what are you on about?

Dante doesn't just fight random animalistic demons like Cerberus, are you just completely forgetting the existence of Vergil and Sparda? Or many of the other humanoid enemies who have literal military ranks like the angelos and that first boss-guy-whatever from DMC4.

Kratos was an accomplished war veteran of ******* SPARTA before becoming Ares' puppet, and he's shown to be quite capable of using his daggers and other weapons he gains throughout the series.

Musashi Miyamato is literally the soul of one of the most popular Real Life Japanese swordsmen.

Atomic Samurai is from a verse where plenty of guys fight using different kinds of melee weapons including bats and other swords, and is literally a member of a group of swordmasters that train with eachother.

This is legitimately a troll thread.

 

[NikHelton]

Finite measurements, multiplying piercing power to potentially infinite higher-dimensional degrees. Do you see the problem here?

Yes, that's why I pointed out that some examples are... examples?

This thread is not made to downgrade specific characters.
This is just a discussion of the pitfalls.

 

[Serlock_Holmes]

That is indeed correct.

Adamantium is considered to be a "virtually indestructible" steel alloy as per the official Marvel page. The claws are also stated to be capable of piercing almost anything solely due to adamantium and its strength. Not because "omegalol piercing damage".


This too. Infinity divided by anything is still infinity.

Kengan revision (attempt number 2)

why does the guy even scale to the energy the whale outputs? even if the whale jumps and hits him with it's full body weight, he would only tank a fraction of the actual energy due to the inverse square law being a thing do we know how he killed it to begin with? what even is the assumption...

vsbattles.com

I believe I can shed some light here. The op participated here where his arguments were shot down by Armor and other participants and it seems he tried to apply this logic in other verses.

 

[KLOL506]

Why is this applicable in some cases, but not applicable in others?

Because such metals don't show realistic properties like Adamantium in Marvel Comics does? Or Amazonium in DC? Or Olympian Steel in GoW? Or Demonic Steel in DMC?

You said that Wolverine doesn't physically scale to its claws. I explained to you what the "Claws" key meant

Yeah, he doesn't. His claws do. That simple.

Different contact area. Why, then, do we use body area when trying to find strength through explosion?

Explosions are quantifiable. Fictional metals that can murk High 1-B people, aren't.

After all, the authors did not think about these when they drew an extra half meter between the characters.

The authors don't think about a lot of things like how we rate Tier 2 and 1, but we don't care about that because the source material stands above everything else.

There was not a word about it. I don't understand why you said that.

Because this is where this logic leads.

Ignore these examples, lol. I wrote that some of them can be explained by the conventions of the verse, but are used to describe the situation.
However, it seems like you specifically decided to make a show of it.

Because the moment you use the term "conventions" and still include those examples, you give away your nature to deceive the audience and perform a shadow-downgrade or throw shade at those verses. Kindly refrain from such acts, you already tried your hand in this once in the Baki threads and failed. Do not repeat the same mistake.

The strength of the metal allows the bullet not to collapse, but to enter the body. However, it still enters the body more easily because it is a small piece of metal flying at high speed. It cannot scale to the full durability of the character.

IDK what to tell you bruv, but that's not how any of the source material describes it. You're fighting a losing battle against the story itself.

 

[KLOL506]

Kengan revision (attempt number 2)

why does the guy even scale to the energy the whale outputs? even if the whale jumps and hits him with it's full body weight, he would only tank a fraction of the actual energy due to the inverse square law being a thing do we know how he killed it to begin with? what even is the assumption...

vsbattles.com

I believe I can shed some light here. The op participated here where his arguments were shot down by Armor and other participants and it seems he tried to apply this logic in other verses.

So it's a blatant case of whataboutism and spite. Gotcha.

 

[Serlock_Holmes]

So it's a blatant case of whataboutism and spite. Gotcha.

While I have yet to read the whole thread and only saw parts of it, the main issue was someone harpooning the whale and scaling to as if he did it with his fists. Thought not too sure about that. The main problem was that the use of the weapon made the feat much less impressive.

 

[KLOL506]

While I have yet to read the whole thread and only saw parts of it, the main issue was someone harpooning the whale and scaling to as if he did it with his fists. Thought not too sure about that. The main problem was that the use of the weapon made the feat much less impressive.

Piercing damage arguments like ordinary harpoons against 9B whales that follow IRL rules would fall under this.

Wolverine, Kratos, Dante and other mooks armed with supernatural metals? Not so much.

 

[NikHelton]

OP what are you on about?

Dante doesn't just fight random animalistic demons like Cerberus, are you just completely forgetting the existence of Vergil and Sparda? Or many of the other humanoid enemies who have literal military ranks like the angelos and that first boss-guy-whatever from DMC4.

Kratos was an accomplished war veteran of ******* SPARTA before becoming Ares' puppet, and he's shown to be quite capable of using his daggers and other weapons he gains throughout the series.

Okay, I shouldn't have given the example of Dante and Kratos. However, this does not change the subject.

Musashi Miyamato is literally the soul of one of the most popular Real Life Japanese swordsmen.

Yes, it is. So what? He was completely trampled by Hanayama and Yujiro. He could only deal damage to them using a sword.

Atomic Samurai is from a verse where plenty of guys fight using different kinds of melee weapons including bats and other swords, and is literally a member of a group of swordmasters that train with eachother.

The same as the paragraph above. He only does damage using his weapon.https://onepunchman.fandom.com/wiki/Council_of_Swordmasters

 

[Shmooply]

I don't know how did the first paragraph in the OP not register in my head. I would like to formally apologize for my brain farts.

 

[KLOL506]

Okay, I shouldn't have given the example of Dante and Kratos. However, this does not change the subject.

Too late. You used them for the basis of your thread to deceive the people. Own up to the L.

Yes, it is. So what? He was completely trampled by Hanayama and Yujiro. He could only deal damage to them using a sword.

Take this to a Baki-related thread and not a site-wide downgrade thread involving multiple verses you know little-to-nothing about.

The same as the paragraph above. He only does damage using his weapon.https://onepunchman.fandom.com/wiki/Council_of_Swordmasters

Same advice as above, take this to an OPM thread and see how long you can last against the debaters. If you lose, tough luck, it is what it is, your arguments weren't convincing enough.

But never lump multiple verses in like this with varying mechanisms, powers and context like this in a CRT ever again.

 

[SYPHe5D]

I don't know how did the first paragraph in the OP not register in my head. I would like to formally apologize for my brain farts.

skill issue, nah you good.

 

[KLOL506]

Yes, that's why I pointed out that some examples are... examples?

This thread is not made to downgrade specific characters.
This is just a discussion of the pitfalls.

Not to be a pushover, but your thread is literally named "Downgrade of Weapon users".

Plus, my comment about you wording it to be like a shadow downgrade to throw shade at those characters, as well as your attempt to lump in all these characters with varying degrees of context still stands.

 

[NikHelton]

Because such metals don't show realistic properties like Adamantium in Marvel Comics does? Or Amazonium in DC? Or Olympian Steel in GoW? Or Demonic Steel in DMC?

I have already said several times that this was a conditional example, but you continue to emphasize it. It's just water in your messages

Yeah, he doesn't. His claws do. That simple.

Yes, exactly what I wrote above

Explosions are quantifiable. Fictional metals that can murk High 1-B people, aren't.

Specifically, now I'm talking about levels that can be calculated

Because this is where this logic leads.

No, you just got it wrong.

Because the moment you use the term "conventions" and still include those examples, you give away your nature to deceive the audience and perform a shadow-downgrade or throw shade at those verses. Kindly refrain from such acts, you already tried your hand in this once in the Baki threads and failed. Do not repeat the same mistake.

You are just engaged in slander and demonization. Please refrain from doing so.
What kind of misleading are we talking about if literally in the post itself it is indicated that some examples have conventions and later I wrote this several times in the comments.

Don't make false accusations.

IDK what to tell you bruv, but that's not how any of the source material describes it. You're fighting a losing battle against the story itself.

We still have Musashi Miyamoto, Drax, Demon Slayer and Atomic Samurai.

Some of the examples turned out to be incorrect and I admitted it above. However, this does not change the essence of the thread.

 

[NikHelton]

So it's a blatant case of whataboutism and spite. Gotcha.

What are you talking about? I didn't hide anything.
I relied on the words that were said by one of the administrators and tried to apply them in the thread, because according to this logic, you can influence the entire verse.
I said bluntly that I was relying on words from the discussion.

Before you twist me and put me in a negative light, and then say "gotcha", make sure that I tried to hide it

 

[NikHelton]

Piercing damage arguments like ordinary harpoons against 9B whales that follow IRL rules would fall under this.

Wolverine, Kratos, Dante and other mooks armed with supernatural metals? Not so much.

8-A Leviathans and a man who is able to throw a harpoon with his bare hands with such force as to kill this creature from a depth of 300 to 2000 meters, this fits the IRL rules.

Drax, who with the help of blades pierces a creature with which he has a difference in strength of almost a million times, does not fall under the rules of IRL

Double standards, bro

 

[KLOL506]

I have already said several times that this was a conditional example, but you continue to emphasize it. It's just water in your messages

So you're just going to keep lying about your intent then. Cool. Won't bother with that part then.

Yes, exactly what I wrote above

And? The source material still disagrees with you. You don't get to decide how the mechanisms of these metals work, none of us do. We just roll with what we're given, else it's all headcanon.

Specifically, now I'm talking about levels that can be calculated

Stuff that harms High 3-A people and above can't be calculated. PERIOD.

No, you just got it wrong.

No I'm pretty sure I got it right since piercing damage and anti-feats of this kinda thing are intricately intertwined with each other, but you do you.

You are just engaged in slander and demonization. Please refrain from doing so.

There's no slander or demonization to be talked about after what you did in those threads. I've seen how you reacted in that Earthquake thread for Baki where everyone else disagreed with you and you just kept arguing without any merit.

What kind of misleading are we talking about if literally in the post itself it is indicated that some examples have conventions and later I wrote this several times in the comments.

If they have conventions, they can't be examples to begin with and would automatically be removed from the list.

Nevermind the fact that most of these weapon feats involve Tier 2/1 shenanigans, things we clearly cannot calculate.

We still have Musashi Miyamoto, Drax, Demon Slayer and Atomic Samurai.

Make separate threads for all of them.

Some of the examples turned out to be incorrect and I admitted it above. However, this does not change the essence of the thread.

Kind of does because

1. Case-by-case basis
2. May involve a UES
3. May involve a supernaturally strong metal which renders all attempts at calculating true power null and void.

 

[Serlock_Holmes]

Take this to a Baki-related thread and not a site-wide downgrade thread involving multiple verses you know little-to-nothing about.

For the record I agree with it and think it was his primary aim which is however logical. Though that doesn't mean Musashi is human without weapons.