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Doflamingo High 7-A Downgrade Thread

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StrawHatArslan

StrawHatArslan

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This is a downgrade for Doflamingo's "possibly High 7-A" key. It's pretty simple, he never harmed boundman Luffy, and only kept him at bay.

Keeping someone at bay /=/ AP
His durability however, should stay due to him taking Multiple of Boundman Luffy's shots.
His High 7-A end should be removed, and the 7-A is where he should be. (for now)


My overall preposition:
  • For Doflamingo, his "possibly High 7-A" key for his ap/striking strength should be removed.
 
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It's pretty simple, he never harmed boundman Luffy, and only kept him at bay.
Click to expand...

This is something I've believed for a long time, and been my major reason for why he shouldn't be scaling to Gear 4 Luffy.

As for the multiple Gear 4 shots he took, three of them completely overwhelmed him and sent him flying/crashing to the ground hard with every hit though he was in a weakened state, and the fourth one almost incapacitated him except for his absurd endurance.

I don't think his durability should be fully scaling to Gear 4, so "At least 7-A+, possibly High 7-A" still seems best to me for his durability.
 
Damage3245 said:
This is something I've believed for a long time, and been my major reason for why he shouldn't be scaling to Gear 4 Luffy.

As for the multiple Gear 4 shots he took, three of them completely overwhelmed him and sent him flying/crashing to the ground hard with every hit though he was in a weakened state, and the fourth one almost incapacitated him except for his absurd endurance.

I don't think his durability should be fully scaling to Gear 4, so "At least 7-A+, possibly High 7-A" still seems best to me for his durability.
Click to expand...
I'm glad we can agree on the High 7-A removal, and 7-A+ is where he should be (for now). I agree, then the possibly High 7-A for his durability should be fine.
 
StrawHatArslan said:
This is a downgrade for Doflamingo's "possibly High 7-A" key. It's pretty simple, he never harmed boundman Luffy, and only kept him at bay.

Keeping someone at bay /=/ AP
His durability however, should stay due to him taking Multiple of Boundman Luffy's shots, and should become a straightforward High 7-A
His High 7-A end should be removed, and the 7-A is where he should be. (for now)


My overall preposition:
  • For Doflamingo, his "possibly High 7-A" key for his ap/striking strength should be removed.
  • His durability should go from "possibly High 7-A" to a normal "High 7-A"
Click to expand...
Damage3245 said:
This is something I've believed for a long time, and been my major reason for why he shouldn't be scaling to Gear 4 Luffy.

As for the multiple Gear 4 shots he took, three of them completely overwhelmed him and sent him flying/crashing to the ground hard with every hit though he was in a weakened state, and the fourth one almost incapacitated him except for his absurd endurance.

I don't think his durability should be fully scaling to Gear 4, so "At least 7-A+, possibly High 7-A" still seems best to me for his durability.
Click to expand...
These look great to me.

Ap, 7-A
Dura, 7-A, possibly High 7-A?
 
1) The fight was almost entirely off-panel, so we have no context. All we can go by is the simple fact that Doflamingo was PRESSURING Luffy by the time we see them after the 20 minute time-skip

2) What we see on panel is Luffy using harmonization of his Haki and DF resistance to block a kick from Doflamingo, and that he was desperately dodging all of his attacks afterwards (that we see). If Luffy couldn't take damage from Doflamingo's strikes, why would the former be scrambling to dodge all of his attacks?

Disagree with the downgrade. If Doflamingo was so much weaker than BM Luffy, he would not have had Luffy on the DEFENSIVE so late into the battle.
 
CinCameron20 said:
2) What we see on panel is Luffy using harmonization of his Haki and DF resistance to block a kick from Doflamingo, and that he was desperately dodging all of his attacks afterwards (that we see). If Luffy couldn't take damage from Doflamingo's strikes, why would the former be scrambling to dodge all of his attacks?
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What we see on panel is Doffy getting absolutely worked....


Where in any of those scans is it presented that Doffy ~ Gear 4th or even semi relative.
 
joshpiece said:
What we see on panel is Doffy getting absolutely worked....


Where in any of those scans is it presented that Doffy ~ Gear 4th or even semi relative.
Click to expand...

Nuff said lol. Not to mention he's not so much weaker than how much Cin states. He's baseline Large Mountain, while doffy is 7-A+. About 2x weaker.
 
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1) We can judge the fight well enough by what is on-panel.

2) Characters dodging attacks that are weaker than they are is nothing new. Doflamingo dodged Luffy's own Gear 2 attacks at one point, despite being obviously superior to Luffy's Gear 2 attacks.
 
Damage3245 said:
1) We can judge the fight well enough by what is on-panel.

2) Characters dodging attacks that are weaker than they are is nothing new. Doflamingo dodged Luffy's own Gear 2 attacks at one point, despite being obviously superior to Luffy's Gear 2 attacks.
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Exactly. You can put this into play on so many different character's when comparing the god tier's in OP who are 6-B to some of the 7-A's - High 7-A's. It wouldn't mean that they scale.
 
joshpiece said:
What we see on panel is Doffy getting absolutely worked....


Where in any of those scans is it presented that Doffy ~ Gear 4th or even semi relative.
Click to expand...

Interesting that you only bring up the points where Luffy lands attacks, but not points where he is on the retreat. But if you really need me to spell it out:

1) Luffy clearly felt the need to defend against Doflamingo's kick with a culmination of Haki and Elasticity to make Doflamingo's Haki infused kick bounce off.
  • What other point would there be for Luffy to use a defense mechanism like this if Doflamingo's attack wasn't going to harm him in the first place? Doflamingo immediately got back up and resumed the fight for an extended period and had the upper hand for parts of what we were able to see.
2) The battle went on for 20 minutes + however long it took for the following scenes to play out (the citizens reacting to the cage enclosure/losing hope, Riku's speech, and some panels of Doflamingo and Luffy fighting). Doflamingo can not be far weaker than Luffy if he's pressuring him for this long of a period.

3) Luffy continuously dodging Doflamingo's waves of threads is proof enough that those attacks are threatening enough to harm him, otherwise, why would he dodge instead of bursting through them like he did later against Doflamingo's shield just before Leo Bazooka?

Damage3245 said:
1) We can judge the fight well enough by what is on-panel.

2) Characters dodging attacks that are weaker than they are is nothing new. Doflamingo dodged Luffy's own Gear 2 attacks at one point, despite being obviously superior to Luffy's Gear 2 attacks.
Click to expand...
1) Luffy landing some blows that did damage, then Doflamingo causing Luffy to retreat and evade nearly all of his attacks? The only one he tanked was a kick (which his Haki and Elasticity resisted against). If Doflamingo was so much weaker than Luffy, the latter would not need to continuously dodge all of his attacks in desperation while trying to look for an opening over the course of 20 minutes.

2) We already have to discuss Haki scaling anyways since there are points supporting the idea that Gear 2nd + Haki Luffy could get partial scaling to Doflamingo's Durability for inflicting damage to him (albeit only via dura negation on a healthy Doffy, and drawing blood on a clearly lethargic and severely wounded Doffy with Haki infused blows)

I still want to discuss the matter of 6-C~6-B Doflamingo but that's a whole topic in itself that I believe you are already heavily against anyways.
 
CinCameron20 said:
Interesting that you only bring up the points where Luffy lands attacks, but not points where he is on the retreat. But if you really need me to spell it out:

1) Luffy clearly felt the need to defend against Doflamingo's kick with a culmination of Haki and Elasticity to make Doflamingo's Haki infused kick bounce off.
  • What other point would there be for Luffy to use a defense mechanism like this if Doflamingo's attack wasn't going to harm him in the first place? Doflamingo immediately got back up and resumed the fight for an extended period and had the upper hand for parts of what we were able to see.
2) The battle went on for 20 minutes + however long it took for the following scenes to play out (the citizens reacting to the cage enclosure/losing hope, Riku's speech, and some panels of Doflamingo and Luffy fighting). Doflamingo can not be far weaker than Luffy if he's pressuring him for this long of a period.

3) Luffy continuously dodging Doflamingo's waves of threads is proof enough that those attacks are threatening enough to harm him, otherwise, why would he dodge instead of bursting through them like he did later against Doflamingo's shield just before Leo Bazooka?


1) Luffy landing some blows that did damage, then Doflamingo causing Luffy to retreat and evade nearly all of his attacks? The only one he tanked was a kick (which his Haki and Elasticity resisted against). If Doflamingo was so much weaker than Luffy, the latter would not need to continuously dodge all of his attacks in desperation while trying to look for an opening over the course of 20 minutes.

2) We already have to discuss Haki scaling anyways since there are points supporting the idea that Gear 2nd + Haki Luffy could get partial scaling to Doflamingo's Durability for inflicting damage to him (albeit only via dura negation on a healthy Doffy, and drawing blood on a clearly lethargic and severely wounded Doffy with Haki infused blows)

I still want to discuss the matter of 6-C~6-B Doflamingo but that's a whole topic in itself that I believe you are already heavily against anyways.
Click to expand...
I’m gonna respond to this tomorrow myself since it’s 5 AM. I just want to mention that I do agree with 6-C Doflamingo, but that it should replace his 7-A+ key, while completely getting rid of the high 7-A key, but I’ll explain my POV tomorrow. Also, if you’re gonna make the CRT, I suggest doing it ASAP.
 
I still want to discuss the matter of 6-C~6-B Doflamingo but that's a whole topic in itself that I believe you are already heavily against anyways.
Click to expand...

Heavily against the previous arguments for it, yeah. If you have something new that could support Country level Doflamingo, I'd be interested in seeing it.
 
Damage3245 said:
Heavily against the previous arguments for it, yeah. If you have something new that could support Country level Doflamingo, I'd be interested in seeing it.
Click to expand...
I don’t agree with country level doflamingo at all myself, but there are multiple ways to get him to 6-C, which I don’t believe have been discussed yet besides the meteor scaling
 
CinCameron20 said:
1) Luffy clearly felt the need to defend against Doflamingo's kick with a culmination of Haki and Elasticity to make Doflamingo's Haki infused kick bounce off.
Click to expand...
I don't think we have any feats for G4 Luffy's bare skin so even if he did harm Luffy's skin there (which we never see so we can't properly say if he could) it still wouldn't reach High 7-A. The High 7-A counts for the armament haki surrounding him which Doflamingo fails to harm in every instance.
 
Man this is laughable... So now dodging is an ap feat ok...
CinCameron20 said:
What other point would there be for Luffy to use a defense mechanism like this if Doflamingo's attack wasn't going to harm him in the first place?
Click to expand...
It didn’t harm him at all... And your acting like It’s not just a property of gear 4th and Luffy consciously used it because it was going to hurt him. None of Doffy attacks on panel did anything.
CinCameron20 said:
The battle went on for 20 minutes + however long it took for the following scenes to play out (the citizens reacting to the cage enclosure/losing hope, Riku's speech, and some panels of Doflamingo and Luffy fighting). Doflamingo can not be far weaker than Luffy if he's pressuring him for this long of a period.
Click to expand...
please show any proof of Doffy pressing gear 4th Luffy.
CinCameron20 said:
3) Luffy continuously dodging Doflamingo's waves of threads is proof enough that those attacks are threatening enough to harm him, otherwise, why would he dodge instead of bursting through them like he did later against Doflamingo's shield just before Leo Bazooka?
Click to expand...
Again DODGING an attack isn’t proof at all you are capable of hurting somebody or being relative in strength with them. Saying why didn’t he just burst through them is clear PIS
CinCameron20 said:
Interesting that you only bring up the points where Luffy lands attacks, but not points where he is on the retreat. But if you really need me to spell it out:
Click to expand...
I’m not cherry picking if anything that’s you. This is nonsense everyone agree with the downgrade but you. Show any proof (not head canon saying if he didn’t dodge this would hurt him!) of Doffy being relative to gear 4th and I’ll happily agree with you.
 
The downgrade is fine, but keep in mind that this does not affect just Doflamingo, but quite literally everyone who scales to High 7-A in Marineford. They will have to be downgraded as well.
 
CinCameron20 said:
The downgrade is fine, but keep in mind that this does not affect just Doflamingo, but quite literally everyone who scales to High 7-A in Marineford. They will have to be downgraded as well.
Click to expand...
As far as I know, literally nobody scales to High 7-A off of Doffy in Marineford.
 
See, i forgot about the changes for 6-B Admirals, and they got High 7-A from Aokiji being threatening to Doffy (before edits). Nevermind
 
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