Cosmology instant death Revision

[Ihsjihahxu]

,,,,,i'm back again,,,,

Celestial Foundation

To talk about such a thing, an explanation of Celestial Foundations is necessary.
In simple terms, a Celestial Foundation is the vessel for a world, and
could be considered the world in and of itself. On top of these foundations are
placed the numerous things making up that world, and that is where
intelligent life forms live. This is of course on a conceptual level, so, for
example, in the world that Yogiri and Tomochika originally came from, one
can say that space was laid on top of that foundation. In the world they are
currently in, the land and sea are laid directly on top of the foundation
instead. In short, the Celestial Foundation is what an observer would refer to
as the base of the world.
There are countless Celestial Foundations, all floating in a space known as
the “Sea.” The individual foundations are like bubbles in this Sea. By the
way, as we are comparing it to the ocean, the Sea also has a depth. If
foundations are at the same relative depth, traveling between them is simple.
Moving to a foundation at a lower depth is even easier, but moving up in the
Sea is much more difficult. Doing so requires an enormous amount of energy.
That is one of the reasons it is not so easy for Yogiri and Tomochika to return
to their own world.
Now that you know about Celestial Foundations, let’s talk about the
Foundation Eaters. They are creatures inhabiting the Sea, also referred to as
“Deep Sea Fish.” They can move freely throughout the Sea, and feed off the
foundations. In short, they are beings that eat worlds.
For some worlds with higher-level intelligences like gods, the situation is
different, but in most cases the residents of those worlds have no way of
perceiving the Foundation Eaters. The worlds those creatures consume are
immediately destroyed, broken down, and digested all at once.

The abyss

It was, in a literal sense, a world in a different dimension. Call it the Astral Plane, the Spirit World, or the Abyss. It went by any number of names, but to put it into simple terms, it was a world where length, width, and height were supplemented with an additional fourth dimension.

The man could move freely between that dimension and three-dimensional space. It was an incredibly powerful ability. By passing through that dimension, he could go anywhere he wished and avoid any attack. As he had demonstrated, he could even use it to bypass any sort of defense and destroy an opponent from within. On top of that, ordinary humans couldn’t perceive this dimension, making it impossible for them to fight back.

Hm. Allow me to correct one misunderstanding. I cannot appear anywhere. I can only operate through places where this dimension and that one overlap. Of course, since your people have no way of telling where such places are, the fact that you are helpless against me is no different.” This man, calling himself a king, seemed to be the personification of self-centeredness. It appeared he couldn’t be satisfied without making everyone else aware of how incredible he was.

Within this space, things mixed together to create a truly chaotic vision. Multiple locations overlapped, indicating where it was possible for him to interact with three-dimensional space. He searched for the lowest level of the research facility, a feat possible with his senses attuned to this additional dimension. It didn’t take much time to find it. Warping space, he approached the appropriate coordinates by drawing his desired destination closer to himself.

The sea

There are countless Celestial Foundations, all floating in a space known as the “Sea.” The individual foundations are like bubbles in this Sea.


The canopy separated the world from the infinite space known as the “Sea.” With that canopy gone, the rest of the world easily collapsed. The world was frail and couldn’t bear the harsh environment of the Sea.


By the way, as we are comparing it to the ocean, the Sea also has a depth. If foundations are at the same relative depth, traveling between them is simple. Moving to a foundation at a lower depth is even easier, but moving up in the Sea is much more difficult. Doing so requires an enormous amount of energy. That is one of the reasons it is not so easy for Yogiri and Tomochika to return to their own world.

Higher universe

They were in a sea of stars. It was not the “sea” that contained the celestial foundations that housed their worlds, but a different space ruled by different laws. It was a universe beginning with a big bang. It was a world where planets revolved around stars, stars gathered into constellations, constellations mixed with nebulae to form galaxies, galaxies came together to make up clusters, and clusters were organized into superclusters. That was the kind of world it was.
“You seem to be a higher-level being than I first thought. I did not expect something like this,” the UEG called out to him.
Touichirou headed to a universe governed by entirely different laws and immediately erased the one he had just come from along with all the parallel universes connected to it.

“Honestly...I fail to understand what you are attempting to do in destroying all the parallel universes like that.” The UEG appeared behind him, calm and composed.

“I don’t want to hear that from you.”She had followed him from an entirely different world first, so it was no surprise she could follow him here as well. Now what would follow would be even greater tragedy. They would both leap between universes, trying to predict their opponent’s moves and erase their destination before they made it there. They would attempt to jump out of the dimensional space occupied by their opponent and destroy it from the outside. As they did, their opponent would jump to an even higher level universe and attempt the same thing.

There should have been no end to the cycle, but suddenly there was. Touichirou’s attack had erased the universe containing the UEG.

“Is it over?” They had erased numerous universes. He was naturally exhausted at this point and was starting to feel fed up with the whole situation.


There really was nothing here. Finally realizing it, she started to feel the beginnings of fear. No matter where she went, there was nothing. Beyond that, she couldn’t teleport.

“I-In that case, I will incinerate everything! Time! Space! The universe itself! The higher-level universe that encompasses this one!”

The UEG unleashed her power in full force. But that power, which should have annihilated everything, vanished into the darkness. It hadn’t made the slightest change in her surroundings.

The UEG couldn’t accept the words he was saying. They were incomprehensible to someone like her, who believed herself to be the most powerful being in existence.

“Some of us believe in a theory like this: There are universes contained inside larger universes and so on. Why has that total collection of universes survived? If space and time are infinite, then there is a possibility that eventually an ultimate being would emerge, one that could wipe out all universes on a whim. If the possibility isn’t zero, then given infinite time, it is guaranteed to happen. But it hasn’t. From what we’ve been able to observe, once gods reach a certain threshold of power, they disappear. So there must be someone out there erasing them, right? There must be some sort of limit or criteria being applied.”

Ultimate ensemble world

Worlds existed within Celestial Foundations, and these Foundations
existed within the “sea.”The sea was enormous, containing countless such
Foundations, but it was not hard to imagine the existence of worlds outside
of it. There were worlds, the space outside them, and another place beyond
all of that. Worlds with different fundamental laws all existed nested within
each other. That was apparently the structure of the universe. “Apparently,”
because it was impossible to observe the entire thing.
That said, there were some who treated this as all that existed, since it
comprised the entirety of the territory perceptible to the most intelligent life
forms on these worlds. For convenience, the term “Ultimate Ensemble
World” referred to this collection of worlds. Many of them followed similar
laws, while many more followed entirely different ones. No through line
could be established that applied to all of them.
In short, what counted as rare and exceptional in one world was
perfectly natural in another, but there were still things that counted as
exceptional in all worlds. These were referred to as “exceptions.” The name
was nothing special, only enough to evoke the intended meaning within the
proper context. There were few enough such phenomena that they needed
no special name. None were particularly impressive on their own, notable
only for having a characteristic that was applicable across all worlds.


referred to this collection of worlds. Many of them followed similar
laws, while many more followed entirely different ones. No through line
could be established that applied to all of them.
In short, what counted as rare and exceptional in one world was
perfectly natural in another, but there were still things that counted as
exceptional in all worlds.

As seen in Volume 14, all worlds and all existences are completely encompassed within the Ensemble.
It includes all possible worlds, whether it be the Celestial Sea, the Sea of Stars, the Outer Worlds, or the hierarchical structure of the universe.

you can do against it.
Anything that threatens its existence as Yogiri Takatou gets erased.
Completely removed from the world.
Oh, not just the world he’s in. I mean the Ultimate Ensemble World. I
mean, just the word “world” isn’t quite enough. You’ll have people asking
about the area beyond the boundaries of the world, or other dimensions, or
parallel worlds. So when we say the “Ensemble World,” we mean literally
everything that exists. I hope you understand.

In Volume 15, we will once again receive confirmation regarding the god at the pinnacle of V-road, the Strongest in the Ensemble World.
It encompasses all existence, as previously mentioned—everything, including parallel worlds, other dimensions, spaces beyond dimensions, the Sea, and the higher hierarchical structure of the universe.

"Hm? What is it? What is its true form? I don’t know if there’s really an answer for that. In the same way I’m me, and you are you, it is it.
It’s probably been around since the very beginning of the Ensemble World.
It’s one of the rules governing the Ensemble World’s creation and a being that helps regulate it.
It’s the Ensemble World’s limit, its end, and a stopper for it.”

It is quite clear that a higher-level universe corresponds to a higher-level spacetime in any context of UEG, which encompasses all possible worlds. Thus, it is evident that it refers to "All possible dimensions space."



1. Ensemble World is a world that encompasses all possible dimensions, regardless of how many there are or how vast they may be. It includes all possibilities—worlds, Celestial Foundations, the Sea, higher-level universes—encompassing the entire dimensional structure of all possibilities. Everything exists within Ensemble World.

2. Yogiri is the governing principle that controls the creation of Ensemble World. He controls the foundations of all possible worlds—destroying, creating, and serving as the existence that halts the foundations of all possible worlds.




Case 1. Ensemble world is H1-A+ Type 2

Case 2. Ensemble world is Low1-A

Case1
Agree
Disagree : @SweetDao
Neutral

Case2
Agree
Disagree . @SweetDao
Neutral

 

[SweetDao]

No.

 

[TWILIGHT-OP]

@Dark_Soul20189 , @SweetDao I think you guys might be interested in this

 

[SweetDao]

@Dark_Soul20189 , @SweetDao I think you guys might be interested in this

I am interested, but not for the good reasons... Like, what can I even say? The proof doesn't even correlate whatsoever with the results.

Thank you for the ping tho, even if I was already there

 

[Velvian_can]

I don't see anything that grants both cases the demanded tiers so naye

 

[Ihsjihahxu]

No.

Why? You said no?

Ensemble world
It is quite clear that a higher-level universe corresponds to a higher-level spacetime in any context of UEG, which encompasses all possible worlds. Thus, it is evident that it refers to "All possible dimensions space."

Low 1-A: Low Outerverse level
Characters whose power is on the level of the Von Neumann Universe. That is, they either encompass, or can affect structures which encompass, the collection including all possible dimensional spaces.

As a general rule-of-thumb, statements of being "above dimensions" and the like, whenever validly indicating a superiority over higher dimensions, fall under this tier without further context. See here for more information.

 

[SweetDao]

Ensemble world
It is quite clear that a higher-level universe corresponds to a higher-level spacetime in any context of UEG, which encompasses all possible worlds. Thus, it is evident that it refers to "All possible dimensions space."

1 : It's not a higher-level spacetime, it's just a universe encompassing another.
2 : We don't grant a tier via a name
3 : Nowhere does it say it encompasses all possible worlds in the way you could grant it High 1-A+. It's simply saying "Yeah the Ultimate Ensemble is the whole cosmology" which is evident.

 

[Humanitus_Primevilus888]

I see no reason why the ultimate ensemble world is High 1-A+ without any significant or relevant contents of why is that tier in the first place not to mention this where it said:

Hm? What is it? What is its true form? I don’t know if there’s really an answer for that. In the same way I’m me, and you are you, it is it.
It’s probably been around since the very beginning of the Ensemble World.
It’s one of the rules governing the Ensemble World’s creation and a being that helps regulate it.
It’s the Ensemble World’s limit, its end, and a stopper for it.”

The limit’s it what make me oppose High 1-A+ or low 1-A since there is no statements of how many higher dimensions until it reaches that limit not to mention the ultimate ensemble world has no alignment that can be said is equivalent to a Von-Neumann’s Universe

 

[SweetDao]

The limit’s it what make me oppose High 1-A+ or low 1-A since there is no statements of how many higher dimensions until it reaches that limit not to mention the ultimate ensemble world has no alignment that can be said is equivalent to a Von-Neumann’s Universe

It's talking about Yogiri acting as a safeguard to regulate the cosmology.

 

[Humanitus_Primevilus888]

It's talking about Yogiri acting as a safeguard to regulate the cosmology.

I get your point, but my point in this CRT here is how he claims that the ultimate ensemble world is high 1-A+/low 1-A from this statement of his:

It is quite clear that a higher-level universe corresponds to a higher-level spacetime in any context of UEG, which encompasses all possible worlds. Thus, it is evident that it refers to "All possible dimensions space.

Like where he get the “all possible dimension space” and “ all possible worlds” stuff from like where is the 3 laws of thoughts?

 

[SweetDao]

Like where he get the “all possible dimension space” stuff from?

Headcanon, yeah. I was just explaining the context of the sentence above so that you could understand it, but ultimately, yeah, there is nothing suggesting such a level.

Without even mentioning people within that cosmology who can bypass the UEW laws without being tier 0

 

[Hirotoswnn1x]

สุดปัง

 

[Ihsjihahxu]

1 : It's not a higher-level spacetime, it's just a universe encompassing another.
2 : We don't grant a tier via a name
3 : Nowhere does it say it encompasses all possible worlds in the way you could grant it High 1-A+. It's simply saying "Yeah the Ultimate Ensemble is the whole cosmology" which is evident.

“I-In that case, I will incinerate everything! Time! Space! The universe itself! The higher-level universe that encompasses this one!

Ueg said is Higher level space time , higher universe
She mean is higher universe ( higher dimensions level)

I hope your don't forget about hierarchy world or Multiverse As mentioned in the story And I know you won't forget. You remember better than I do.

I see no reason why the ultimate ensemble world is High 1-A+ without any significant or relevant contents of why is that tier in the first place not to mention this where it said:

The limit’s it what make me oppose High 1-A+ or low 1-A since there is no statements of how many higher dimensions until it reaches that limit not to mention the ultimate ensemble world has no alignment that can be said is equivalent to a Von-Neumann’s Universe

I didn't expect high 1-A+.

Completely removed from the world.
Oh, not just the world he’s in. I mean the Ultimate Ensemble World. I
mean, just the word “world” isn’t quite enough. You’ll have people asking
about the area beyond the boundaries of the world, or other dimensions, or
parallel worlds. So when we say the “Ensemble World,” we mean literally
everything that exists.

As stated by the strongest god, one of those who protect the Ensemble World from everything:

He said that it encompasses everything in the story—every possibility across dimensions, whether it be the ocean world, the outer world, or other dimensions or parallel world , both high and low. It also encompasses the hierarchy of the multiverse, which is structured from lower to higher levels. This structure follows the concept of a universe set, where a lower universe is merely a part of a higher one—just as 1, 2, and 3 are merely numbers within the power set P(A).

 

[SweetDao]

“I-In that case, I will incinerate everything! Time! Space! The universe itself! The higher-level universe that encompasses this one!

Ueg said is Higher level space time , higher universe
She mean is higher universe ( higher dimensions level)

I hope your don't forget about hierarchy world or Multiverse As mentioned in the stor

Nowhere did she say it was a space-time. She said she was going to destroy time and space, that's all.

I'm not forgetting it, there is no higher-dimensions regarding the "higher-level universe", anyone with a bit of sense should be able to deduce this at that point.

He said that it encompasses everything in the story—every possibility across dimensions, whether it be the ocean world, the outer world, or other dimensions or parallel world , both high and low. It also encompasses the hierarchy of the multiverse, which is structured from lower to higher levels. This structure follows the concept of a universe set, where a lower universe is merely a part of a higher one—just as 1, 2, and 3 are merely numbers within the power set P(A).

He never said this.

Also, you're using Ultimate God as a way to scale, but would you kindly not forget that he himself isn't sure he can detect and comprehend every world? The guy who supposedly give you an argument is the same guy who says he isn't sure about it.

 

[Ihsjihahxu]

Nowhere did she say it was a space-time. She said she was going to destroy time and space, that's all.

I'm not forgetting it, there is no higher-dimensions regarding the "higher-level universe", anyone with a bit of sense should be able to deduce this at that point.



He never said this.

Also, you're using Ultimate God as a way to scale, but would you kindly not forget that he himself isn't sure he can detect and comprehend every world? The guy who supposedly give you an argument is the same guy who says he isn't sure about it.

I know and I understand that he himself is not very sure, but what he observes and follows to understand it, He does not understand every world, but what he understands about the ensemble world is that it encompasses everything. This aligns with what the narrator also says—that it encompasses everything.

Worlds existed within Celestial Foundations, and these Foundations
existed within the “sea.”The sea was enormous, containing countless such
Foundations, but it was not hard to imagine the existence of worlds outside
of it. There were worlds, the space outside them, and another place beyond
all of that. Worlds with different fundamental laws all existed nested within
each other. That was apparently the structure of the universe. “Apparently,”
because it was impossible to observe the entire thing.
That said, there were some who treated this as all that existed, since it
comprised the entirety of the territory perceptible to the most intelligent life
forms on these worlds. For convenience, the term “Ultimate Ensemble
World” referred to this collection of worlds. Many of them followed similar

 

[SweetDao]

I know and I understand that he himself is not very sure, but what he observes and follows to understand it, He does not understand every world, but what he understands about the ensemble world is that it encompasses everything. This aligns with what the narrator also says—that it encompasses everything.

He can't understand it encompasses everything if he's not even sure of the worlds within it. Be logical.

The quote you gave is irrelevant. We know that the UEW is "Everything" but that's not a structure in an on itself. It's like if I said "reality is everything", reality is just a wording to say "everything that exist", that's the same here. Also, mind you, the quote is explicitly talking about "space outside of space" which, mind you, has zero relevance regarding Low 1-A or High 1-A+. It's not because there is a universe outside a universe, or a multiverse outside a multiverse, that it is a qualitative or quantitative change whatsoever.

I translated that very same quote some time ago, and it was even more self-evident it was dealing strictly with spatial component.

RAW : 界は天盤の中にあり、天盤は〝海〟の中にある。〝海〟は広大で、そこには無数の天盤が存在しているが、さらに外側の世界があることは想像に難くない。　世界の外には、さらに外があり、それらを含む外も存在する。基本的な法則すら異なる世界が複雑に絡み合う入れ子構造。そんなものが世界全体であるらしい。　らしいというのは、全てを確認できるわけもないからだ。

MTL : The world exists within the Celestial Foundation, and the Celestial Foundation exists within the "Sea."


The "Sea" is vast, containing countless Celestial Foundation, and it is not difficult to imagine that there is an even greater world beyond.


Outside the world, there is yet another outside, and beyond that, even more. A nested structure where worlds intertwine, each with fundamentally different laws. That, it seems, is the entirety of existence.


"Seems"—because verifying everything is impossible.

Using MTL because it's not terribly relevant, so don't take the quote too much to heart either.

Mind you, the "seems" also, but whatever.

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Not this again... Hard disagree....

 

[sukuna171]

It's talking about Yogiri acting as a safeguard to regulate the cosmology

Although I disagree with the trend, I believe Yogiri should scale to UEW.

 

[SweetDao]

Although I disagree with the trend, I believe Yogiri should scale to UEW.

In range? Sure. In AP? I highly doubt it.

 

[sukuna171]

It is referred to as the end and the stopper of UEW by the ultimate god, and Aoi stated that if it were denied, no existence would be permitted.

 

[SweetDao]

It is referred to as the end and the stopper of UEW, and Aoi stated that if it were denied, no existence would be permitted to exist.

Yeah, the "end" and "the stopper" as in, he regulates the UEW, not as in he can "destroy it". I mean, the fact that some people operate outside the laws of the UEW is enough to show that Yogiri wouldn't be able to kill everything that exist in the first place.

Aoi stating something is highly irrelevant, she's a random in the grand scheme of things.

 

[sukuna171]

Yeah, the "end" and "the stopper" as in, he regulates the UEW, not as in he can "destroy it". I mean, the fact that some people operate outside the laws of the UEW is enough to show that Yogiri wouldn't be able to kill everything that exist in the first place.

Aoi stating something is highly irrelevant, she's a random in the grand scheme of things.

can I have proof that are some people immured to yogiri ability

 

[SweetDao]

can I have proof that are people immured to yogiri ability

“That sort of thing is just a marking. Since the rules only said it ‘cannot be destroyed’, so there’s no need for me to abide by them.”

“It can’t be…… the principles of the ‘world’ are absolute……”

“How should I express it……? It’s impossible for you to beat me so long as you are trapped in that ‘world’. I just don’t think you can win against me, let alone a middle echelon of the Demon World, you know?”

Ishtar became speechless.

All phenomena are shifting on the “world”.

For that reason, if something is recognized by the “world” as constant, there would be no method to reverse it.

Such is the basic premise and the law of the “world”.

Yet this Great Demon King was exercising her impact/strength without the need of going through the “world”.

 

[sukuna171]

I still do not consider that as evidence that paella could survive the end. However, I respect your opinion.

 

[SweetDao]

I still do not consider that as evidence that paella could survive the end. However, I respect your opinion.

So, someone stating that they can bypass the laws of the UEW while possessing a strength that is independent of said UEW is not enough to show she would not care, at all, about Yogiri?

Yogiri isn't some special rule or anything, it's just one designed with a single purpose, regulating stuff while having practically the same description as the Immutable Law protecting the Gods.

 

[sukuna171]

is it stated what the rules are and if they are all equal

 

[SweetDao]

is it stated what the rules are and if they are all equal

It's actually the opposite, why wouldn't all the laws not be equally absolute ?

The law of immutable characteristics for Gods
The law Yogiri's incarnate
The law Yogiri created (without him noticing)

All of the above were equally impossible to counter, beside of course for the likes of Paella.

 

[sukuna171]

I'm still not sure if I agree with the, but you make a good point.

 

[SweetDao]

I'm still not sure if I agree with the, but you make a good point.

Well, in any case, that's not really the topic, we'll have plenty of time to discuss this at one point in another thread, probably.

 

[Vesxpura]

Strongly Disagree on Both Cases. Theres just not enough ironclad evidence to suggest it would fall under those ranges

 

[The_golden_and_silver_house94]

Disagreed

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Question, Are the votes gonna be added or are we doing staff only for counting votes?

 

[Ihsjihahxu]

Question, Are the votes gonna be added or are we doing staff only for counting votes?

I won't add anyone's votes. I don't know if it's against the rules or not, but "I lost a debate to Sweetdoa. " I'll add him in the "disagree" section.

 

[Reiner04]

I won't add anyone's votes. I don't know if it's against the rules or not, but "I lost a debate to Sweetdoa. " I'll add him in the "disagree" section.

You will have to add votes of everyone who disagrees after providing a reason to it, unless u are only counting staff votes.

 

[Hjdjdhf]

I think Celestial Foundation is low2C.

“Foundation Eater. Her true form is large enough to swallow a Celestial Foundation (universe) whole. Although she originally ate entire worlds all at once, after hundreds of years, she has come to develop a preference for certain flavors.
VOLUME 8 CHAPTER 5”

You can argue Celestial Foundation Eater is low2c first.Because volume 8 mentions Celestial Foundation is universe.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

If I had been here only when this topic was opened, I would have easily refuted all the opposing people's comments.

 

[Re5yh]

Yeah, I agree with SweetDao, I should disagree with the thread

 

[Cipher72]

Can someone close this for Necro