Cole MacGrath VS.Alex Mercer

[ZephyrosOmega]

Potentially a stomp, but I'm interested. Let's see.

Cole MacGrath:

Alex Mercer:

Inconclusive:

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Which cole is this, if its infamous 1 cole this is incon cause cole cant bypass mercers regen and the power gap means he one shot, alex gets up do to regen and this repeats infinitely leading to an incon.

 

[ZephyrosOmega]

idk, InFamous 2 and Prototype 2?

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Then cole oneshots and bypasses his regen and this is a stomp.

 

[DeathNoodles]

Unless this is Beast Cole, the result is going to be the same as this match:

Link.

That is, the result is one of the lamest inconclusive matches ever, and I doubt the key with Cole having higher AP and more AP-based abilities is going to change that.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Actually death is correct I thought for some reason cole gained more abilities to bypass alex regen in the second key but thats not the case, second game he got ice and fire right? Also vampirisim, problem is he doesn't have absolute zero nor the power to atomize

 

[DeathNoodles]

Also vampirisim, problem is he doesn't have absolute zero nor the power to atomize

The Vampire Cole key isn't canon though.

Edit: And yeah, aside from new tricks with his electrical powers, he just got some fire and ice abilities mixed in.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Well I figured but vampire cole still cant bypass his regen my point was outside the beast cole can't win....

edit as death said very dissapointing incon

 

[DeathNoodles]

Well, it's either the lamest inconclusive ever or a stomp, so...

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

yup

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

Result's the same. A stomp thinly veiled as a 'tie' due to a screenshot feat.

 

[Schnee_One]

InFAMOUS 2 What? Evil Cole? Good Cole?

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

From what i can tell it doesn't matter nothing short of the beast can bypass alex regen unless cole can atomize....

 

[Schnee_One]

Yes

Which is Evil Cole

Hence the question

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

So this either a stomp or incon.....

 

[Schnee_One]

I'm not a fan of us considering extremely onesided stomp matches like this inconclusive but meh.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

I don't disagree but cole cant keep mercer dead for twenty four hours so its incon, its not the first nor will it be the last time a character only "Technically" Inconned due to being unable to defeat there opponent for twenty four hours

Edit I think cole should be considered the victor as well but thats not the sites ruling on such things. So this match is either incon or stomp depending on the presence of beast cole

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

I talked it over with an admin cole couldn't even technically win when alex had low high regen, cause he lacks feats of disintergration on superhuman opponents (pretty sure he doesn't disintergrate regular humans either) and no teir gap exist that lets a character disintergrate without showings...Much like atomization so this would be an incon even if alex only had low high regen.

 

[Schnee_One]

Which Admin? Cole has enough AP to do that.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

No to disintergrate your average human would require 6b for superhumans you need feats much like atomization dark dragon medusa specifically

 

[Schnee_One]

Err.....

Vaporization beats Low High though

So no, it's no where near that high.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

It does but to vaporize a regular human would require six b ap even then its not accepted since superhuman characters throw it off. Much like atomization there is no gap that allows for vaporization without showings

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

"Well still, there is no official AP gap required to vaporize and/or atomize a character with high durability. There's nothing to really calc for those feats. Character A vaporizing/nuking character B with a KI blast for instance would just be a plain in simple Character A is stronger than Character B. There's no way to calc an exact AP difference alone." -DarkDragonMedeus

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Cole would need feats of vaporizing his enemies looking over gameplay he doesn't seem to vaporize enemies regardless of the attacks he uses even on regular humans., even alex low high regen was to much for cole pre beast....

edit sorry was using vaporization and disintegration interchangeably even though I know they're not

 

[Schnee_One]

Saying someone who's millions of times over the requirement For Vaporozatio needs to have feats of vaporizing is utterly ridiculous.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

You'll notice atomization is there as well, theortically possible but only if cole has feats for vaporizing his superhuman opponents which he cant do.

 

[Schnee_One]

This isn't about atomization, it's about vaporization.

Cole doesn't need feats to vaporize something he, by our own calculations, has far more then enough AP to do so.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Vaporization: Applied when the matter that was destroyed was vaporised during the attack. Much like for Pulverization, we usually use this value when we see no remains of the matter that was destroyed in the attack, but in addition there has to be a considerable amount of visible vapor and/or character statements that imply vaporization, usually the latter. The value is 25700 (j/cc).

The value I was talking about was the energy/ap required to vaporize a full human body.

So when has cole vaporized a person, let alone a superhuman one? If he hasn't he can't beat low high....

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Ill double check but Im pretty sure thats the case.

 

[DeathNoodles]

I mean, that still doesn't change the fact that there is no way to calculate an exact value required to vapourise a character with superhuman durability, just like how there is no way to calculate an exact value required to atomize a character with superhuman durability. The way how most things are calculated for vapourisation/atomisation is through calculating the mass and density of the materials. Vapourisation takes into account of the target's mass, the target's heat capacity, and the change in temperature until the target reaches boiling temperature. Calculation of vapourisation/atomisation only takes mass and density into account, it doesn't take into account of durability that is beyond the object's calculated density and mass.

So calculating the AP value needed to vapourise a planet is different from calculating the AP value needed to vapourise a character with planet-level durability. If we were to try to calculate the AP value needed to vapourise that planet-level character, the concluded value wouldn't have been enough to even harm that character as it only takes their mass and density into account.

 

[Schnee_One]

Yes that is the value, Cole is massively above it.

Seriously, this is like saying soul manipulation can't beat Mid Regenerationn without feats. Cole has the AP to do so and the AoE to beat Low High. Hell he dosintegrated a reaper with a casual shot in the comics, firing Thousands of massive explosions at Alex would absolutely vaporize him.

Of course, this is not the place for this, so let's stop there.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Ill double check with bambu to be sure, but again this seems like the case of atomization where the value can't be calced and thus isn't possible without feats. In the end it doesn't matter as mercer has mid high I just wanted to know how this fight would have gone back with low high

 

[DeathNoodles]

Yes that is the value, Cole is massively above it.

Seriously, this is like saying soul manipulation can't beat Mid Regenerationn without feats. Cole has the AP to do so and the AoE to beat Low High. Hell he dosintegrated a reaper with a casual shot in the comics, firing Thousands of massive explosions at Alex would absolutely vaporize him.

Of course, this is not the place for this, so let's stop there.

You should've brought that feat up before discussing about vapourisation with AP. There are characters in certain fictional settings where higher tiered characters don't even vapourise their targets (more or less just splatter them) with sheer AP, so in-verse demonstration would need to be provided to show that said vapourisation via sheer AP is actually applicable in their setting. At least it seems like Cole actually has feats for that.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Yeah If theres a scan of him disintergrating a reaper fair enough I was just going off what I remembered from the game and couldn't recall a time he actually vaporized someone.

 

[Schnee_One]

Ill double check with bambu to be sure, but again this seems like the case of atomizatio where the value can't be calced and thus isn't possible without feats. In the end it doesn't matter as mercer has mid high I just wanted to know how this fight would have gone back with low high

We're talking vaporozatio not atomizatio if you ask him be clear about this

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

I was I asked what the ap gap was to vaporize a opponent. Im saying I think this is like atomization where no value can be gleaned due to the way its calced

 

[Schnee_One]

@Death Was the feat necessary? That doesn't beat Low High, just High Mid, which you apparently need feats for.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Wait disintergration is different from vaporization...... I guess that feat wouldn't be enough

 

[DeathNoodles]

@Death Was the feat necessary? That doesn't beat Low High, just High Mid, which you apparently need feats for.

It doesn't necessarily have to show that it beats Low-High specifically, just that it actually has on-screen demonstration (or reliable statement) of vapourising superhuman characters via AP being applied. If vapourising a superhuman target/character has been shown via higher AP, then it should be applicable for that character and their setting. There are franchises where a much higher tiered character only splatters their targets with their higher AP rather than vapourise after all.

 

[Schnee_One]

That's fair.

Anyway enough derailing lol.