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Chainsaw Man discussion thread

Btw, is there any chance the top tier characters can become High 7-C like the DB put them in or is it one of those weird values they get through unknown means?
 
Idk why anyone would scale to the Typhoon Devil in that way since CSM doesn't have a UES, so uh me no thinks so
 
Epiccheev said:
Btw, is there any chance the top tier characters can become High 7-C like the DB put them in or is it one of those weird values they get through unknown means?
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There's a better chance of them hitting 7-A actually, from the Gun Devil's KE, crossing like 500km in ~2s.
 
Also, just wanted to mention here... I think Makima's physical AP & Dura should be Unknown. I don't think we should scale weakened Pochita to Denji's Chainsaw form just because they look similar, and weakened Pochita still outsped and one-shot all of the Weapon Hybrids.
 
But he one-shots all of them (3 at once at one point) and he only takes damage from Spear Man (who also impaled Black Pochita) & Bow Devil Quanxi (who herself never actually gets proper feats to scale to anyone).
 
Zabazab said:
Also, just wanted to mention here... I think Makima's physical AP & Dura should be Unknown. I don't think we should scale weakened Pochita to Denji's Chainsaw form just because they look similar, and weakened Pochita still outsped and one-shot all of the Weapon Hybrids.
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Honestly, i just see them as glass canons in the sense that most of them use slashing/piercing damage and can cleave through eachother pretty easily. (Like Katana Man breaking Denji's chainsaws but getting split in half when surprised, Denji cutting through his own brain through the reinforced chainsaw head with no problems Spear Hybrid being able to pierce Pochita's armor while being considered stomp worthy weaker, etc.)
Just being faster like Quanxi was already enough for her to trade killing blows with Pochita.
 
I'm having a bit of trouble understanding your contentions, @Zabazab. If he one-shot them, that should be grounds for an upscale (albeit to a significant degree). I don't believe we rate characters as Unknown for such a thing

And like @Epiccheev, he was using cutting attacks so honestly, using the term "one-shot" might be a bit weird to describe what happened.
 
The current scale is


- Full Power Chainsaw Devil ( No reasoning needed )

- Weakened Graveyard Pochita ( Could physically overpower and kill Makima multiple times though eventually lost )

- Act 2 Denji ( Clearly stronger than Act 1 since he accidently one shot the Bat Devil who nearly killed him before at BOS )

- Act 1 Denji ( No reasoning needed )


Come to think of it...why don't we give Graveyard Pochita his own key?
 
Zabazab said:
I think Makima's physical AP & Dura should be Unknown. I don't think we should scale weakened Pochita to Denji's Chainsaw form just because they look similar, and weakened Pochita still outsped and one-shot all of the Weapon Hybrids.
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The High 8-C feat (and eventually 8-A feat) most characters scale to is Chainsaw Denji's durability for withstanding the Bat Devil's Fus Roh Dah. In Makima's case she was able to blow holes through his body with her punches, wich is even more reason to scalegiven CSM is very drastic in how it treats piercing/slashing damage. (Aki piercing through Katana man with his stake, Gunshots being able to damage Hybrids when not hitting their blades/armored parts. Hybrids beating eachother with one weapon strike.)
Even if Pochita ChainsawMan is > Denji Chainsawman she would just upscale.
 
The issue I had is mostly just that we only get told that Cemetary Pochita was "significantly weaker than before", but we still see he still both outspeeds and bodies the Weapon Humans, so it felt more presumptious that they would be close enough in power to scale. If my take isn't very popular then it doesn't really matter though.
 
Zabazab said:
There's a better chance of them hitting 7-A actually, from the Gun Devil's KE, crossing like 500km in ~2s.
Click to expand...
Someone should work on getting that 7-B kinetic energy calc for the Gun Devil accepted

It's pretty clearly portrayed that the Gun Devil just bulldozes his way through the cities he goes through with the action lines we see on panel

That's be the only upgrade I think has a chance of going through
 
I can agree on the speed part, since Cemetary Pochita was >= to Quanxi who's shown to stomp other weapon hybrids through sheer speed. AP and Dura being different from Base Denji is a bit hard to say, since Hybrids can easily finish eachother with a single well placed blow (wich would happen if you can blitz), but at the same time he has armored arms and can control his chains as extra limbs, wich might mean he still was a bit stronger. (even if the latter might just be an experience issue with Denji.)
 
AnimesFreak2 said:
Come to think of it...why don't we give Graveyard Pochita his own key?
Click to expand...
That's what I've been saying 💀
Honestly Pochita should have his own page since he has several forms that are distinct from Denji. I was thinking something like:

Pochita | Weakened | Hero of Hell
At least 9-B (should be superior to a normal chainsaw. Can easily cut apart weaker Devils) | 8-B (considerably superior to beginning-of-series Denji and to most of the Weapon Hybrids) | Low 7-C, likely far higher
 
Are we sure that Denji got stronger by Part 2, or is it that the Bat Devil just got weaker? It looks like the Bat Devil wasn't at its full potential compared to before. It appears to have lost most of its intelligence and doesn't display any of the same abilities that it did during its fight with Denji. Instead, it just goes around mindlessly rampaging. I think the Bat Devil had only recently arrived from Hell and was thus much weaker than its first battle with Denji. So I don't believe Denji killing the Bat Devil on accident is strong evidence that he's gotten stronger.

Also, regarding this AP calc, I feel that violent fragmentation should be kept instead of pulverization. Granted, I'm not a calc person on this site and I don't know all the formulas used to make those calculations, but it seems more reasonable to assume the air blast merely pushed the other debris away. The anime gives more credence to the idea of violent fragmentation since far more chunks of the concrete are visible. I also feel like 8-A would be more of a stretch because there aren't enough supporting feats that match 8-A. For example, Reze's got some 8-C–High 8-C calcs, though I could easily be mistaken on this. Again, you can ignore me on this if you can, and it's probably the wrong thread to make this argument, but that's just my two cents.

On another note, I agree with the idea of making a separate page for Pochita. By now, he's got at least three different forms: his weakened dog form, his weakened form impersonating Denji, and his true form.
 
CiscoTheSoto said:
Also, regarding this AP calc, I feel that violent fragmentation should be kept instead of pulverization. Granted, I'm not a calc person on this site and I don't know all the formulas used to make those calculations, but it seems more reasonable to assume the air blast merely pushed the other debris away. The anime gives more credence to the idea of violent fragmentation since far more chunks of the concrete are visible. I also feel like 8-A would be more of a stretch because there aren't enough supporting feats that match 8-A. For example, Reze's got some 8-C–High 8-C calcs, though I could easily be mistaken on this. Again, you can ignore me on this if you can, and it's probably the wrong thread to make this argument, but that's just my two cents.
Click to expand...
Pushing the debris away is only “more reasonable” according to you because it may yield a lower result because there sure isn’t any indication such thing happened. The main impact center which I focused on is simple gone upon impact with no indications of it being pushed away anywhere.

Also, in such case kinetic energy would fit much better, not violent fragmentation as you are implying they got launched at incredibly high speeds to the point they basically just vanish. Would you like me to take a shot at it? I’d rather not but it might yield higher results.

And using the anime you can see the expansion wave outside of the main center kept expanding and even affected the building to the side with violent fragmentation. Outside of the anime you can see that the large chunks are from the surrounding AoE which violently fragmented and fell apart downwards. There is no way for the center to be violent fragmentation with as clean of a deletion as this is.

And I don’t think that is really how it works if we have no anti feats for 8-A.

I am also probably gonna get decent results from the justice devil surviving the skyscraper drop from the fall devil (he was way too large to evade the hit like Denji did)
 
PhantomØ4 said:
Pushing the debris away is only “more reasonable” according to you because it may yield a lower result because there sure isn’t any indication such thing happened. The main impact center which I focused on is simple gone upon impact with no indications of it being pushed away anywhere.

Also, in such case kinetic energy would fit much better, not violent fragmentation as you are implying they got launched at incredibly high speeds to the point they basically just vanish. Would you like me to take a shot at it? I’d rather not but it might yield higher results.

And using the anime you can see the expansion wave outside of the main center kept expanding and even affected the building to the side with violent fragmentation. Outside of the anime you can see that the large chunks are from the surrounding AoE which violently fragmented and fell apart downwards. There is no way for the center to be violent fragmentation with as clean of a deletion as this is.

And I don’t think that is really how it works if we have no anti feats for 8-A.

I am also probably gonna get decent results from the justice devil surviving the skyscraper drop from the fall devil (he was way too large to evade the hit like Denji did)
Click to expand...
Like I said, calculations are not my forte. I’m sure more feats are gonna show up in the near future and the characters are going to be upgraded regardless. All I care about is consistency with what’s presented on-screen.

I guess in general, it always bothers me when feats that only affect certain areas are upgraded to a higher tier. Like here, an attack that only affects a building is used as justification for 8-A. Or with MHA: because 5% Deku destroyed a pillar of steel not much larger than himself, that’s used to justify base Deku and all the other characters as 8-A, even though attacks that span such a distance are never shown by any of the U.A highs schoolers. Authors don't have any knowledge about things like fragmentation, violent fragmentation, pulverization, or vaporization, and attacks that affect entire city blocks are never shown. It's that disconnect with what's presented vs the AP value that's calculated which has always bothered me.
 
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Epiccheev said:
I can agree on the speed part, since Cemetary Pochita was >= to Quanxi who's shown to stomp other weapon hybrids through sheer speed. AP and Dura being different from Base Denji is a bit hard to say, since Hybrids can easily finish eachother with a single well placed blow (wich would happen if you can blitz), but at the same time he has armored arms and can control his chains as extra limbs, wich might mean he still was a bit stronger. (even if the latter might just be an experience issue with Denji.)
Click to expand...

Nah he is clearly far superior seeing how even after being mega weakened further from being jumped and burned alive and gutted he casually one shot her before going down

Also him slicing up Makima multiple times is more than enough to further show this ( same Makima who could "endure" several attacks from Darkness )
 
So, just took a look at Quanxi's profile the hell is a type 3 martial arts
 
She's also still 9-B in base lol, should've been 9-A at the time & now should just scale to Hybrids in base.
 
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