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Bleach Top tiers Downgrade....Again

TataHakai

VS Battles
Retired
2,519
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I hate to keep making these threads but honestly it seems to keep coming back to bleach with bad accepted calculations where i have to be the one who points out their flaws, this is going to be a pretty long post so strap in.

In the latest showings, bleach mid tiers are Sub-Rel+ with another flawed calculation full of contradictory assumptions and fallacies

The calc is this one

(https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...otto_diverts_from_the_thunderbolt_of_Candicce)

I was actually going to make this thread a month or two ago but got sidetracked by exams so here it is i suppose

There are a few glaring problems with the calculation, let's talk about them but before we do we should see and dissect the two pages used for this calculation, here they are.

Cand
Cands


What the calc assumes happened

1) Candice shot out her attack before Liltotto even moved a single centimeter away from candice

2) Liltotto travelled the assumed distances (2 meters, 4 meters and 6 meters) before Candice's lightning reached the spot that Liltotto was previously in, despite the fact that the page that they use to scale Liltotto's final distance has her nearly a dozen meters away but the lightning is several meters to her sides which means it's gone far beyond where Lilttoto originally was

WHY THIS IS FLAWED

1) There is absolutely nothing to suggest the timeframe is ok, it pretty much assumes that Candice shot out her attack before Liltotto began moving for one thing, if we look at the bottom right of the first page Candice has a boot in her face with no indication of preparing an attack, generally before Candice attacks her lightning manifests in her hand or around her before she does, as we can see here there is absolutely nothing on or around her and in fact she looks taken aback in that instant. There's literally nothing in one page and the entire area is full of lightning in the next, the assumption is far too big and vague for it to be acceptable.

2) The assumed distances are based on literally NOTHING and when i mean Nothing, i mean nothing

The assumption is that " we know she had to move at least enough not to be hit by Candice's lightning. "

But why would she need to move 2 or 6 meters to not be hit by it? The OP assumes that Candice's lightning was shot out when Lilttoto was already 33 centimeters away from Candice, since Candice's lightning originates from her and her hands then Lilttoto could move at the same speed and still outrun it

To put this into context, imagine you're in a race with a car and you can both move at 60mph, but you get a 33 centimeter headstart, who's going to win the race? You

This is the same situation here, Candice could move at the same speed as the lightning and still not be hit by it since she already has a headstart, meaning the distance assumption is not only baseless but flawed in its only pillar.

Anyways i don't want to keep rambling

This would mean anyone scaled off her Sub-Rel+ calc would need to be downgraded back to MHS+ or whatever is the next best feat they have.

Thank you for listening here's a cookie for your time ƒì¬
 
Ha. I made a thread about this exact feat recently.

It was agreed the calc was too flawed to use currently.

I guess they updated it to try and mitigate those flaws, but I agree with you that it still looks wrong.
 
Damage3245 said:
Ha. I made a thread about this exact feat recently.
It was agreed the calc was too flawed to use currently.

I guess they updated it to try and mitigate those flaws, but I agree with you that it still looks wrong.
Yeah i realised USK changed the way he got the distance because the old method was pointed out to be flawed

But it's still flawed regardless, it's just warped to try and make it look like a feat exists.
 
The current scaling is just flawed..but we have like 3 other sub-rel calcs that they will scale to

Profiles are just outdated
 
The only other one i'm aware of that's Sub rel is the Auswahlen dodge one, mind linking the other two calcs?

And if that's the case then i guess this can be used as a clean up thread instead
 
The scaling would place most of the verse at Sub-Rel+ the way the profiles are now. We've just never done that because people are busy and we need to review it.
 
Besides Liltotto dodging Auswahlen the rest look fine to me from a glance

Is the auswahlen one the only one that Liltotto and the rest scale from? Because that calc also has the same problems as this one from a quick glance
 
Liltotto isn't on the panel when the distance to the Auschwalen is called
 
Multiple problems, one that Damage pointed out

But more so that the calc assumes that Liltotto started moving and got to her place in the next page at the same time that Auswahlen moved from its previous location to its place on the next panel

Read the car example i used and apply it to the same scenario with Auswahlen.

Anyways the rest are fine i suppose, better than that Ichigo calc that for some reason is still accepted.
 
Uhhh, I don't really see the issue.

1. She's talking to robert.

2. She notices he gets instantly killed and is shown reacting to the situatio.

3. She saves herself and Giselle in the next panel.

We know this feat took but a mere moment for the beam to travel that distance, so clearly she'd have to act quickly after just seeing robert get fked. The beam also clearly lands where she was standing and she dodges and also saves her friend.

What do you think happend that would change the result?
 
Tata makes sense here, but to the best of my knowledge and from what others in the thread say, nobody's profile seems to be scaled from this feat?

If anyone's profile does rely on this feat, definitely remove it, the problems are too numerous to accept the calc in good faith as pointed out.

I do, however, think that stating the same issues with the OP calc are 1-to-1 comparable with the Liltotto Auswahlen-dodge would need much better quantification than the assertion itself.

My two cents.
 
Calculating Liltotto, I basically used the old one, but I made some adjustments. But anyway, even if this dodging calculation is wrong, Liltotto will climb by deflecting from Auswahlen, so I do not think that much changes.
 
Which calculation are you using instead then? I would appreciate if you update the profiles accordingly.
 
Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
Uhhh, I don't really see the issue.
1. She's talking to robert.

2. She notices he gets instantly killed and is shown reacting to the situatio.

3. She saves herself and Giselle in the next panel.

We know this feat took but a mere moment for the beam to travel that distance, so clearly she'd have to act quickly after just seeing robert get fked. The beam also clearly lands where she was standing and she dodges and also saves her friend.

What do you think happend that would change the result?
The problem is that Liltotto doesn't NEED to move that far to dodge it she'd only need to avoid the initial point of contact which was a few meters, and when you're making an assumption you pretty much have to prove that it's the only valid argument to make

But if she did deflect Auswahlen like USK says then i suppose her scaling to it will be fine
 
TataHakai said:
The problem is that Liltotto doesn't NEED to move that far to dodge it she'd only need to avoid the initial point of contact which was a few meters, and when you're making an assumption you pretty much have to prove that it's the only valid argument to make

But if she did deflect Auswahlen like USK says then i suppose her scaling to it will be fine
That's a good point..except that there isn't any assumptio here

Literally in the same panal where the auswhalen hits the ground,we see how far Lillito have travelled

as she also wanted to grab gisele "her friend i or something" to safety
 
But that isn't when Auswahlen hits the ground

Auswahlen has ALREADY hit the ground when Liltotto is in that location, the calc assumes Liltotto had to be in that location the second that Auswahlen hit the ground which isn't necessarily necessary. We know that Auswahlen doesn't hit the ground and instantly disappear, it lingers and stays for a while which only adds further to my point.
 
actually it's,or else why would kubo draw that specific scene with "boom"

as well as her powers that started disappering immediatly after that scene..you can't ignore all that with a baseless head canon

Lil dodging.j3123pg2
 
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