Black is Strong

[Testarossa002]

Premise
Upgrade Nyx and the Protogenos to 5-A or something

Mind you, they already scale by default to Possibly High 4-C through the Olympians but this thread hopes to give them a solid rating.

Nyx should be rated as being at least as powerful as a black hole.
Her sheer existence is referred to as a black hole.

No!’ he cried as he was yanked backwards across the garden, then spun around to find himself face to face with her. Up close, her visage wasn’t just dark and indis inct. Except for those piercing eyes, it was a churning void, a black hole devouring all light and matter. It was pure hopelessness made real.

The Sun and The Star; Chapter 17

‘Yes,’ he said, wishing it wasn’t true. Suddenly it didn’t seem like such a bad thing to be drawn into the black hole of Nyx’s gaze, to be crushed into nothingness by her gravitational pull. It might hurt less than seeing the world like this: nothing but swarms of dark, ravenous bugs, pushed into whatever patterns pleased the goddess of night.

The Sun and The Star; Chapter 18

Nyx spread her wings wide, and the void on her dress grew. The impenetrable darkness swelled and lashed out from her body, and Nico watched in horror as skeletal bushes and stones were sucked up into it. She had be come an enraged black hole, and she was heading right for them.

The Sun and The Star; Chapter 45

To potentially seal the deal, she's straight up referred to as the greatest force of darkness. Black holes are, well, dark

But nothing happened. Nyx threw back her head in a laugh. ‘Oh, Nico, you really should have read my brochure,’ she said, then cackled more. ‘I mean, it literally spells out that there is no greater force of darkness in the world than me. Did you think your paltry trauma and your brooding gothic sensibilities were any match for this?’ On the last word, her wings extended.

The Sun and The Star; Chapter 41

Mind you, all these were done in her physical manifestation.
I really should be pushing for 3-A but I don't have the bandwidth for that debate currently
That should be all

 

[Nierre]

Anybody who says otherwise is racist /s

 

[KingTempest]

Skeptical on how literal all of these are. Neutral for now

 

[Testarossa002]

Skeptical on how literal all of these are. Neutral for now

What other evidences would you require?
Maybe I can dig it up

 

[Armorchompy]

Only the first one doesn't feel like some kind of metaphor, and even then I'd like to see the full context. Black holes are also just not necessarily High 4-C, in fact they need to be pretty big for that

 

[Testarossa002]

I'll try and get a more voluminous quote for the first one
What about the last quote?

What's the rating for black holes?
It'll still be an upgrade from the full 6-A rating they current scale to

 

[Testarossa002]

This should be long enough as context

Nico stayed as still as possible. The archway he’d entered was only a few steps away. Maybe, if he sprinted, he could get through it, back up the path and into the forest.
He never got to find out. Tendrils of smoke wrapped around him and abruptly lifted him into the air.
‘No!’ he cried as he was yanked backwards across the garden, then spun around to find himself face to face with her.
Up close, her visage wasn’t just dark and indistinct. Except for those piercing eyes, it was a churning void, a black hole devouring all light and matter. It was pure hopelessness made real.
‘Now, who are you?’ Her supernova eyes seemed to be peeling back Nico’s soul layer by layer. Her swirling debris-cloud of darkness held him fast, but Nico didn’t struggle – he suddenly didn’t want to. He was paralysed.
‘I asked you a question,’ she said, and her voice had gravity, as if it might pull the answers right out of his skull.
‘Mother, leave him alone,’ said Hypnos with a tired sigh. ‘It’s clear that he’s harmless.’

 

[GraveDigger84]

Even if it's accepted that Nyx is/contains a black hole, why should that make her scale to high 4-C if her black hole has been shown to be much weaker?

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

What was the CRT that got Artemis upgraded? And why weren't Atlas' and Athena's profiles upgraded as well?

Any why are Artemis and Atlas only Class T? They held the atmosphere up afterall, and I'm sure other gods could do the same

 

[The_Fiend888]

What was the CRT that got Artemis upgraded? And why weren't Atlas' and Athena's profiles upgraded as well

Those upgrades were decided in two separate CRTs: Keeping Up with Olympians 2 and 3. They probably didn't upgrade them because they simply forgot.

Any why are Artemis and Atlas only Class T? They held the atmosphere up afterall, and I'm sure other gods could do the same

The atmospher feat did not considered a physical feat by some staff as it is said to require the courage of a hero's heart (or something like that) to lift it. It's also an outlier because their best lifting feats are throwing mountains and flipping islands.

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

I added this note to Annabeth's, Percy's, Atlas', and Artemis' pages

Notes:

• Avoid attempts to upgrade this verse based on characters holding up the sky, that is deemed an outlier due to requiring the courage of a hero's heart to lift it and more consistent lifting feats show characters throwing mountains and flipping islands.

Although should I be given the thread link(s) where the sky feat was considered an outlier? And was there any scans of characters throwing mountains and flipping islands?

 

[SeijiSetto]

Only the first one doesn't feel like some kind of metaphor, and even then I'd like to see the full context. Black holes are also just not necessarily High 4-C, in fact they need to be pretty big for that

(for reference, a baseline High 4-C blackhole needs to be ~33km in diameter)

 

[The_Fiend888]

I added this note to Annabeth's, Percy's, Atlas', and Artemis' pages

Although should I be given the thread link(s) where the sky feat was considered an outliers? And was there any scans of characters throwing mountains and flipping islands?

Riordanverse Lifting Strength Revision. Both mountain-throwing feats from the Percy Jackson's Greek Gods. The first one is from the Zeus Kills Everyone chapter and the second is from the Poseidon Gets Salty chapter.

 

[KingTempest]

I added this note to Annabeth's, Percy's, Atlas', and Artemis' pages



Although should I be given the thread link(s) where the sky feat was considered an outliers? And was there any scans of characters throwing mountains and flipping islands?

"An outlier because it's not an outlier, it just requires a different mechanic other than regular lifting strength"

What?

 

[Testarossa002]

Even if it's accepted that Nyx is/contains a black hole, why should that make her scale to high 4-C if her black hole has been shown to be much weaker?

The black hole existence is more like a supporting statement for the last quote about her being the greatest force of darkness or something

Although should I be given the thread link(s) where the sky feat was considered an outlier? And was there any scans of characters throwing mountains and flipping islands?

It's not really an outlier as it's not stat based in the first place (or so the wiki accepts)

(for reference, a baseline High 4-C blackhole needs to be ~33km in diameter)

Bummer then
Nyx is only 30 feet tall in partial manifestation
Although we could just use the size of the biggest black hole that ever or is existing currently and scale her above as per the last quote in the OP

---

Been busy with the demigods stuff so this hasn't had my full attention
Are you guys convinced now or need more stuffs?
This is going to be an upgrade for the Protogenos regardless of how this thread goes as they'll simply scale above the Olympians.
Just advocating for a higher solid rating

.

.

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

Nyx is only 30 feet tall in partial manifestation

That does translate to a 5-A black hole

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

The atmospher feat did not considered a physical feat by some staff as it is said to require the courage of a hero's heart (or something like that) to lift it.

I can get this being the case for Demigods, but what about for Gods or Titans? Does Atlas have the "courage of a hero's heart"? He's the one who holds the sky up the most

 

[Testarossa002]

I can get this being the case for Demigods, but what about for Gods or Titans? Does Atlas have the "courage of a hero's heart"? He's the one who holds the sky up the most

He's kind of cursed to do so
It's not like he has another choice

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

He's kind of cursed to do so
It's not like he has another choice

Does the same apply to Artemis?

Edit: also too, the curse shouldn't really have any affect on Atlas' physical stats, if he was cursed to hold the sky up forever and didn't have the LS, then he'd get crushed and everyone would die

 

[The_Fiend888]

I found the quote about curse of Atlas how the sky can be lifted.

"If it were so easy, he would have escaped long ago. No, my son. The curse of the sky can only be forced upon a Titan, one of the children of Gaia and Ouranous. Anyone else must choose to take the burden of their own free will. Only a hero, someone with strength, a true heart, and great courage, would do such a thing. No one in Kronos's army would dare try to bear that weight, even upon pain of death."

 

[The_Fiend888]

Also, that Tartarus travel brochure Nyx mentioned never existed. So neither Percy nor Annabeth nor any other demigod had written anything about Nyx being the most powerful force of darkness in the world. This was just something they made up so they could escape Nyx's house without being eaten alive.

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

I found the quote about curse of Atlas how the sky can be lifted.

What's the source for this quote?

 

[Testarossa002]

Also, that Tartarus travel brochure Nyx mentioned never existed. So neither Percy nor Annabeth nor any other demigod had written anything about Nyx being the most powerful force of darkness in the world. This was just something they made up so they could escape Nyx's house without being eaten alive.

You misunderstand
The brochure was made after taking Percy/annabeth's suggestions

Nico di Angelo,’ said Nyx, before Nico could answer Will. ‘You succeeded in bringing me another demigod! The brochures must have worked!’ Nico raised an eyebrow. ‘The what?’ ‘The travel brochures!’ she said. ‘The last set of demigods who came through here said I wasn’t advertising enough, so Hyp nos helped me design some to spread through out the Underworld!’ Hypnos drifted forward and held out a few leaflets.
Nico took one. Across the front of it were the words SO YOU’RE THINKING OF VISITING TARTARUS …

 

[The_Fiend888]

What's the source for this quote?

Titan's Curse, Chapter 19: The Gods Vote How to Kill us

 

[The_Fiend888]

You misunderstand
The brochure was made after taking Percy/annabeth's suggestions

Sorry, it's been a while since i read The Sun and the Star. I guess I forgot part of it.

 

[Testarossa002]

Bump

 

[AnimesFreak2]

If the black hole stuff is legit wouldn't the baseline be like 5-A rather than just automatically assuming it's High 4-C?

 

[Testarossa002]

Yeah yeah
Nyx in her regular form is 30ft tall

That does translate to a 5-A black hole

I'll edit the OP
So the Protogenos will be 5-A, Possibly High 4-C

 

[Armorchompy]

She's just not a legit black hole man

 

[Testarossa002]

That's one part of the conclusion
Either she scales by virtue of being a black hole
Or she scales by virtue of being more powerful than a black hole (refer to the last quote in OP)

 

[Armorchompy]

That's just empty hype, especially with the general showing of black holes not being portrayed realistically to begin with.

 

[Testarossa002]

That's just empty hype, especially with the general showing of black holes not being portrayed realistically to begin with.

I disagree with that being just empty hype.
Protogenos by default are various fundamental aspects of reality

‘A protogenos,’ said Nico. ‘A primordial goddess, born before the Olympian gods or even the Titans.’ ‘They are the constants of our existence,’ added Shriek-Vibes.
‘The fundamental powers of the cosmos!’ Hiss-Majesty said.
‘They are really awful!’ said Clack-Jones.

TSATS Chapter 15

The statement was made by a God (Hypnos) who is a few millennial years old and corroborated by another God (Nyx) who is far older than that.

There's no way calling someone who embodies darkness on a fundamental level "the greatest force of darkness" is just empty hype.

I'm not sure what to make of the other parts of your message.

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

Zeus is powerful enough to create storms that flood the Earth, isn't that High 6-A+?

 

[Testarossa002]

I could have sworn it was 6-A when I made the CRT
Can you make a CRT to change it?
It's just a value change
The feat is already accepted

 

[Testarossa002]

Go big or go home
The OP has two ends
1. Nyx is a Black Hole (Somewhere in Tier 5)
2. Nyx is the most powerful force of darkness
Regarding the latter, I've discovered that there are black holes that tier up to 4-A

Conclusion
Nyx is 5-A or Nyx is 4-A

 

[Armorchompy]

no

 

[SeijiSetto]

Go big or go home
The OP has two ends
1. Nyx is a Black Hole (Somewhere in Tier 5)
2. Nyx is the most powerful force of darkness
Regarding the latter, I've discovered that there are black holes that tier up to 4-A

Conclusion
Nyx is 5-A or Nyx is 4-A

the black hole at the center of the phoenix cluster (if someone was to theoretically create it or "scale above it") would only be 569.3 MegaFOE, 4-B.
also using the phrase "most powerful force of darkness" to scale someone above the strongest black holes in the universe just because black holes are also dark is pretty flimsy reasoning IMO.

 

[Testarossa002]

also using the phrase "most powerful force of darkness" to scale someone above the strongest black holes in the universe just because black holes are also dark is pretty flimsy reasoning IMO.

When the someone in question embodies darkness on a fundamental level and is a fundamental existence to the universe?

 

[The_Fiend888]

Also the individual in question has been repeatedly referred to/described as a black hole, has a starry whip and her rage described as rage of of dying stars. Black holes, stars and the like are an important part of her characterization, design and so on.

 

[Testarossa002]

I don't even know what else to say
I mean, look

Percy grabbed Annabeth and backed away from the edge as a presence emerged from the void – a form so vast and shadowy he felt like he understood the concept of dark for the first time.
‘I imagine,’ said the darkness, in a feminine voice as soft as coffin lining, ‘that she meant Night, with a capital N. After all, I am the only one.’

ANNABETH HAD NEVER BEEN SCARED OF THE DARK.
But normally the dark wasn’t forty feet tall. It didn’t have black wings, a whip made out of stars and a shadowy chariot pulled by vampire horses.
Nyx was almost too much to take in. Looming over the chasm, she was a churning figure of ash and smoke, as big as the Athena Parthenos statue, but very much alive. Her dress was void black, mixed with the colours of a space nebula, as if galaxies were being born in her bodice. Her face was hard to see except for the pinpoints of her eyes, which shone like quasars. When her wings beat, waves of darkness rolled over the cliffs, making Annabeth feel heavy and sleepy, her eyesight dim.

This is not just a someone