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Black Clover: Revisiting Black Divider Scaling

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CloverDragon03

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I find it very ironic that after proposing a discussion rule on the topic, I'm the one that's about to downgrade Black Divider. However, this is still well within the discussion rule as this is new information that I'm surprised no one has brought up. So, here we go.

So, what's the evidence? New stuff in the Elf arc? Perhaps some info on devils themselves? No, actually. This comes from the Spade arc, and it comes from Megicula of all devils. So, Gaja does a big attack and completely vaporizes Megicula's body. Then, we get this. Noelle at this point is stuck in her base form and still tries to finish off Megicula, and we get a few things from this short thought process.

1. The devil's heart is considered a weak point. Why would the heart be more durable than the rest of the body if it was considered a weak point? Now, you could say it still makes sense to be a weak point given that destroying it kills the devil. However, that's where the next point comes in.
2. Noelle firmly believed that a Saint Stage attack, even if it was weak, would be enough to destroy Megicula's heart. This aligns with the devil's heart being a weak point, and it contradicts the idea of the devil's heart being more durable than the body.
3. Compounding all of this is Noelle referring to the heart as an "exposed weak point" after Gaja vaporizes it. This point is somewhat less solid, but basically when she says this, it directly flashes back to when Licht used Conquering Eon to destroy Zagred's body and it exposed his heart. It basically shows that the attack didn't destroy his heart for the sole reason that it simply destroyed his body and just left the heart exposed. Basically, Licht really should've gone for the kill.

Now, I know the obvious counter-argument here: "Noelle isn't a reliable source about devils." To that I would say, you're correct. However, Loropechika is. She's the one that fully explained how these devils work, including how only arcane stages (and saint stages but Undine revealed that one since she never told Loropechika) can defeat a devil. Given the knowledge Loropechika passed, it doesn't make sense for Noelle to try and finish off Megicula's heart. Moreover, it makes even less sense for Gaja to send out a signal (which is heavily implied to be for Noelle to go finish off Megicula once her heart is exposed, given the context of it all and the fact that he would know even more than Noelle since he's been with Loropechika longer)

On top of that, why would Gaja try to sacrifice his life if he knew no one was capable of finishing Megicula off? And this is after Noelle's Spirit Dive ran out.

Now, I've established the downgrade. What do we do from here? It's very simple. Scale him to Low 6-B via scaling to Zagred, as he could damage him just like Yuno did with Spirit of Zephyr. And no, this is not a combined attack by our standards of one. Also, we'd need to remove the "Low 6-B+ for his heart" on Zagred's durability. Nothing else changes because Dark Triad scaling means no one relies on Black Divider for scaling anymore.

Now that I've said my piece, what are you guys' thoughts?
 
Yeah I can definitely agree with this, Dragon makes some very convincing arguments for the proposed downgrade so you can consider me on board with this.
 
Like don't get me wrong i still think that BD is above conquering eon, but without the devil hearth scaling i don't think it is good enough to be on the profiles
 
What is the reason Licht didn't one shot Zagred then? Do we just consider his Ultimate Magic not arcane? I'd argue that isn't that out of place.

Why is Zagred Low 6b again?
 
What is the reason Licht didn't one shot Zagred then? Do we just consider his Ultimate Magic not arcane? I'd argue that isn't that out of place.

Why is Zagred Low 6b again?
1. Well he did. His body, at least. Given the callback to Licht's attack in Noelle's small monologue, it's possible that wide-ranging nuke attacks like those completely destroy the body but don't do the same to the heart. Think of it like two layers. The body is one layer, the heart is another. Conquering Eon destroyed the first layer. I guess slashing attacks are more effective because they just cut through anything in sight.

2. Scaling to Lumiere, who scales to Demon Licht
 
If I'm not mistaken Licht's ultimate magic is almost four times above Zagred durability. and to me it seems that Licht's ultimate magic hit Zagred heart 1,2,3.
After Zagred regenerates he states that they cannot kill him, when he said that, there were atleast three people in that room that are as strong as he is and are affected by the underworld to my knowledge. Why would he say that if his heart weren't more durable than his body?
Durability of Zagred heart should stay as is now.
 
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To be honest, I'm actually reconsidering if Licht's Ultimate Sword Magic even is arcane stage. Yeah, he was affected by the underworld and can destroy Zagred's underworld spells, but Yuno did that with Spirit of Zephyr and he's still just Stage 0 at the time. Plus, after Zagred says "You can't kill me," he also thinks to himself "not with magic from this world." That implies that Licht's magic isn't actually arcane stage.
 
Honestly I've always interpreted it as Licht's magic got affected by the underworld to the point where he can now affect Zagred's magic but it wasn't enough to make his magic fully arcane stage which was why he failed to kill Zagred with Conquering Eon.
 
Honestly I've always interpreted it as Licht's magic got affected by the underworld to the point where he can now affect Zagred's magic but it wasn't enough to make his magic fully arcane stage which was why he failed to kill Zagred with Conquering Eon.
This is what I was thinking. It seems to make more sense given the info we have.
 
Will this change anything for Black Divider since now it won't be scaled above Licht's Ultimate Magic
Now, I've established the downgrade. What do we do from here? It's very simple. Scale him to Low 6-B via scaling to Zagred, as he could damage him just like Yuno did with Spirit of Zephyr. And no, this is not a combined attack by our standards of one. Also, we'd need to remove the "Low 6-B+ for his heart" on Zagred's durability. Nothing else changes because Dark Triad scaling means no one relies on Black Divider for scaling anymore.
 
I agree. i think what we need to evaluate right now is if Licht's magic was arcane stage because , the wording OF "cant" seems like it wasn't
 
I don't think it is. I think it's in a similar position to Yuno's Spirit of Zephyr, as it took in Licht's magic yet Zagred said it can't destroy his heart.
 
And then Zagred makes that comment of "magic from this world," I'm really just not getting it.
 
Saint stage isn't only about strength it can also purify a devil so it's not surprising that she only needed a one hit and it's enough (Maybe purification is like existence erasure to DH lol) and not like we can tell all devils heart had the same tier.
And then Zagred makes that comment of "magic from this world," I'm really just not getting it.
That statement is before litch use his ultimate magic.
 
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Off topic but why lucifero doesn't have an intangible and concept manipulation on his profile? Morris stated several times that the reason why his magic can interfere with knowledge, dream, laws and concept is because of lucifero power.
 
Saint stage isn't only about strength it can also purify a devil so it's not surprising that she only needed a one hit and it's enough (Maybe purification is like existence erasure to DH lol) and not like we can tell all devils heart had the same tier.

That statement is before litch use his ultimate magic.
He says this as he's regenerating from Licht's Ultimate Magic, and he says that Yuno's magic can't pierce his heart even though it took in the properties of Licht's and Lumiere's magic.
Off topic but why lucifero doesn't have an intangible and concept manipulation on his profile? Morris stated several times that the reason why his magic can interfere with knowledge, dream, laws and concept is because of lucifero power.
Irrelevant to the topic, so please don't go into that here.
 
He says this as he's regenerating from Licht's Ultimate Magic, and he says that Yuno's magic can't pierce his heart even though it took in the properties of Licht's and Lumiere's magic.
He just said "You can't kill me" he didn't say that in manga version but in anime version he did iirc and Yuno wasn't just powerful enough at that time.

Say does saying all devils out there even the lowest one can easily smash the heart of a high ranking devil sounds right to you? It doesn't sound right at all.

Noelle is different her saint stage can purify devil it's not just an AP but a hax.
 
Saint Stage is in the same position as Arcane Stage, calling it hax is completely baseless.
 
Not all arcane works the same anyhow her saint stage can purify devil while litch ultimate magic can't while although his magic power can affect devil he is just not powerful enough to damage zagred HD. Besides by this logic every devils even the lowest one can easily smash a supreme devils heart which i strongly disagree.
 
It needs to be strong enough, yeah, but the threshold for being "strong enough" isn't as high as we're assuming
 
It needs to be strong enough, yeah, but the threshold for being "strong enough" isn't as high as we're assuming
So you change your mind and agree that the devil heart ain't no fodder then? Cause this shit DON'T make any sense at all since by this logic though a lower ranking devil can **** a supreme devil as long as their magic was akin to Dainsleif or Dimensionsal slash or something that ignore physical layer and before someone say they would just dodge it NO I'm sure the majority of high ranking devil out there acted like Dante they won't bother dodging shit from someone who are far weaker than them and besides if the heart was really weak as y'all claimed i don't see any reason why the supreme devil such as lilith, namaah, megicula and the supreme devil of 2nd layer to be afraid of him since all they needed was to touched his heart and it's over.
 
So you change your mind and agree that the devil heart ain't no fodder then?
All I said was yes, it needs to be strong enough to destroy it (Noelle even says this in her small monologue), but no it's not as durable as you may think. Especially since it's considered a weak point
 
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