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BILL CIPHER(PHYSICAL FORM) VS GALACTUS(EXTREMELY WELL FED)

I think I already made a topic about this. Even with the Ultimate Nullifier, Galactus probably loses.

Also, stop avatarposting. It's not funny.
 
with ultimate nulifier doesnt galactus stomp? also vegehan be productive and express your thoughts instead of just saying wank...
 
Bill Cipher is rated at least low 2-C, so he could be possibly higher. In addition, he has a hax advantage. So if the UN isn't allowed, Bill should be able to win this one, albeit with difficulty.

Ultimate Nullifier, Galactus stomps.
 
Yeah....Ultimate Nullifier which is 3-A to 2-A is only Galaxy level.....

yeahhhhhhhh nope

It depends on who's wielding it. Galactus is the true wielder of the weapon so it's always 2-A under him while someone like Reed Richards can only manage Low 2-C level power at most.
 
Well Bill Cipher is low 2-C (same tier as Galactus without the Ultimate Nullifier) at a bare minimum but his level does say "at least low 2-C." Unfortunately we never got to see any feats from him in the show beyond low 2-C, although it was heavily implied that his power was far more "godlike" than even what was shown. For example, the hints of his awareness and knowledge spanning ALL realities, including that of the audience watching the show (there is actually a secret message from Bill in the show directed at the audience, saying "I'm watching you, nerds"). Moreover there's the implication that he can eventually resurrect from having his existence completely erased (which is basically beyond even being killed, it would seem) with a certain incantation. And his magical and reality-warping powers are SUPER haxx, probably even moreso than Galactus' reality-warping with the Power Cosmic. Bill was able to easily one-shot and vaporize a being like Time Baby (a likely low 2-C himself!) who controls all of time and even controls causality and reality on such a level as to grant "time wishes" that can completely alter the past in any way, create infinitely regenerating pizza-slices, etc.

So in the end I think the biggest factor is the levels of their reality-warping. Bill's seems to be of such a level that it's nearly at the point of actual metaphysics-manipulation or low-level conceptual-manipulation. After all, what he actually did in the Weirdmageddon arc, rather than simply warping reality, was materializing the subconscious realm of nightmares, the "mindscape" of all sentient beings, into physical reality, and he in fact was a being who had come to dwell and exist within that purely-conceptual mindscape. So his reality-warping is definitely nearly at the point of low level conceptual-manipulation. I don't think Galactus can beat that level of reality-warper without the Ultimate Nullifier.

With the Nullifier, Galactus would stomp though, since we've seen that true existence-erasing attacks work on Bill ;) However, since it would seem Bill has an incantation allowing for mid-Godly level Regenerationn, he'd eventually somehow return to challenge Galactus again, even after having his very existence erased by the Nullifier. So. . .there's that. . . .I mean, unless Galactus went to the trouble of erasing the entire universe or multiverse with the Nullifier just to make sure to erase Bill once and for all, then yeah, he could truly defeat Bill with the Nullifier.
 
Dude, i was ASKING.


Bill has done something like equal the feat of pizza, he created a page on startup, it regenerated temporally and back like it was before.

And I really think Time Baby goes far beyond low 2-C, I really think he can manipulate the space-time around Multiverse, but only mention that he will reign over the whole future is somewhat theoretical.

Bill has said he can fake realities too.

And the ullifier could exterminate the existence of a being who lives in a state of quantum uncertainty, which is what all he is, he is not too?

since we've seen that true existence-erasing attacks work on Bill ;)

Ford: Bill's only weak in the mind space.

Bill could be erase just in the mind space, as far as we know.
 
BillCipher326 said:
Dude, i was ASKING.

Bill has done something like equal the feat of pizza, he created a page on startup, it regenerated temporally and back like it was before.

And I really think Time Baby goes far beyond low 2-C, I really think he can manipulate the space-time around Multiverse, but only mention that he will reign over the whole future is somewhat theoretical.

Bill has said he can fake realities too.

And the ullifier could exterminate the existence of a being who lives in a state of quantum uncertainty, which is what all he is, he is not too?

since we've seen that true existence-erasing attacks work on Bill ;)

Ford: Bill's only weak in the mind space.

Bill could be erase just in the mind space, as far as we know.
Click to expand...

You REALLY like Bill Cipher, don't you? Can tell from your username, haha. NO problem with that, he's an AWESOME villain. However: We have no reason to believe from the show that any of your claims are true. No real evidence that Time Baby is anywhere above Low 2-C, and no real evidence that Bill can ONLY be erased in the Mind Space. In fact, are you forgetting the Ten Zodiac Symbols ritual? It would seem there ARE magic and reality-warping attacks that can defeat Bill inside of actual physical reality.

We have EVERY reason to believe that any true existence-erasing attack, working via high-level reality-warping (such as the Ultimate Nullifier in the hands of Galactus) should be able to defeat Bill. After all, what they did to Bill inside the mindspace was take ADVANTAGE of the NATURE of the Mindscape in order to conceptually-erase him. That indicates taht ANY attack which erases beings down to a conceptual/thoughtform level, regardless of being in the mindscape at the time, should be able to erase Bill. The thing is that the characters in the show simply did not have access to such reality-warping firepower outside of the Mindscape, which is why they had to lure Bill into the mental realm.

The fact is that Bill is a Reality-Warper, and higher level reality-warping than his own should be able to destroy him. Although he MIGHT be as high as 2-A or even Tier 1, there is unfortunately NO EVIDENCE IN THE SHOW that Bill is that high a tier. The most we have evidence for is for him having reality-warping at Low 2-C. So based on feats we have actually see, the Ultimate Nullifier, which erases the existence of things with a tier of 2-A, should be more than capable of defeating Bill. And that's how this wiki works, man; we have to go based on feats that have actually been demonstrated in the series. So again, while Bill MAY very well be Tier 2-A or 1-C, he has never exhibited feats on that level in the canon material for his fictional verse, and thus for the purposes of this wiki according to its rules we can only consider him as a Tier 2-C.

It doesn't matter though I guess, since the original conditions of the fight were Bill vs. Well-Fed Galactus with just his own powers, NOT Bill vs. Galactus with the Ultimate Nullifier. In that case, as I said before, Bill should win, as the more potent reality-warper. There's also the issue of stamina--Galactus' is limited, and as he fights and takes and regenerates from damage and uses up energy he has to feed on more planets with life-force in order to replenish that energy. Bill, on the other hand, seems to be able to summon basically endless energy simply by thinking about it. There's no evidence whatsoever that he has any limit to his stamina even when pulling off feats at universe-level and above. If Galactus starts to run out of stamina and energy, I highly doubt Bill would give him the OPPORTUNITY to go eat more planets to replenish it.
 
I did not claim that Time Baby is beyond 2-C. I said I think.

Zodiac did not work, and all that was said is that theoretically could only reverse his weirdness.

It was never shown he being erased while with his physical form, he was shown being erased in mental space. Therefore it can not be considered as an argument something that has not been proven.

What they did in mindscape were to take advantage of their greatest weakness. Also because Stan came back with his memories.

Yeah, I agree with 2-A and 1.

I did not question the Nullifier would not delete it, just fix you saying about the mental plane and made a brief question.


Yeah, i really think Bill win this.
 
But you could give me some scans with feats of Above Universal Nullifier, please?

Because I almost never saw much of the Null, I remember seeing some scans that Reed said he could destroy a galaxy, therefore I questioned..
 
My point is though it doesn't matter what tier we THINK Bill is. We have to go by feats in shown in the show, becauase that's how VS Battles works. And the best feats shown for Bill in the actual series of Gravity Falls were Low 2-C reality-warping feats. The Ultimate Nullifier, in the hands of Galactus, is shown in-cano able to perform existence-erasure AND recreation (through reality-warping) of up to Tier 2-A AT LEAST, as it was shown as able to repair the metaphysical existence of Multi-Eternity (a Multiversal extension of the universal entity and a TIER 1-B, seriously). Thus, the in-canon level of reality-warping feats shown for Galactus-wielding-the-Ultimate Nullifier are two tiers higher than the best feats SHOWN for Bill Cipher. Meaning that Galactus, with the Nullifier, is many levels of multiversal scale beyond Bill Cipher as far as the rules of this wiki are concerned because we have to go by feats that are demonstrated. In terms of SCANS of the Nullifier having the 2-A feat of repairing Multi-Infinity when wielded by Galactus, I have no idea where to find any online, sorry. But it totally happened.

Anyway then at that point you have to consider how Bill's powers work. All his other powers are an extension of his reality-warping, including his immortality, Regenerationn, and deathlessness. Meaning that a higher-level reality-warper could, yes, erase him.

That's why the original question was Bill vs. Low 2-C Well-Fed Galactus, NOT Bill vs. Galactus With the Nullifier. The latter battle would be unbalanced by a whole two tiers, and so isn't even worth tallking about by the standards of these forums.

The INTERESTING battle would be Bill vs. Low 2-C Well-Fed Galactus WITHOUT the Nullifier, because then we're talking about characters that are in the same tier in terms of feats shown. At that point I think it comes down to the difference in potential "depth" of reality-warping abillity (since Bill's seems to reach to the actual metaphysical and low-conceptual level while I do not believe Galactus' does) between the two characters, as well as the stamina-difference. Galactus needs to feed to maintain his stamina, while Bill was never once shown having to consume any kind of matter or energy for sustence and being able to grow without limit in size and perform feats seemingly without limit despite never requiring sustenance.

Again: We are only allowed to consider Bill as being a low 2-C, no matter what, for the purposes of battles on here, because he was never SHOWN having feats beyond that. It's too bad we never got to see what would happen if he'd managed to conquer the entire universe, as he LIKELY would have then shown high-multiversal feats. But we never WERE shown such a scenario, so he HAS no such feats.
 
Yeah, i know Mult Eternity.

I really think that the battle is not with the Nul, as it does not mention anywhere.

It was not the universe that he was winning, but all the 3rd dimension. (Ok, the universe too, orever)

That's because he was as powerful as he was arrested without his unlimited power due to the anti insanity globe, and yet he has all those feats.

Imagine he free throughout the 3rd dimension with his real infinite power. Besides Ford have said that more time passes, more stronger Bill is.

Bill off the globe and free around the universe, would get an immeasurable power..

(Sorry for my eglish if there some words wrong)
 
The most Galactus can do without the Nullifier is devouring an entire 4D universal spacetime continuum, everything there is from beginning to end in one universe. Not sure about Bill Cipher since I never watched the show.
 
Natse said:
The most Galactus can do without the Nullifier is devouring an entire 4D universal spacetime continuum, everything there is from beginning to end in one universe. Not sure about Bill Cipher since I never watched the show.
Click to expand...
Scans?
 
Best I got at the moment. Descriptions of the event he was in involved a time bubble that he created that prevented time travel to the past or the future, implying that he was not only consuming the entire universe but also the entire spacetime of one.
 
Natse said:
Best I got at the moment. Descriptions of the event he was in involved a time bubble that he created that prevented time travel to the past or the future, implying that he was not only consuming the entire universe but also the entire spacetime of one.
Click to expand...
Hmmmmmm, nice. Upon entering into and taking over a universe, Bill Cipher can do way more than just destroy it (although doing that would be easy for him as he has complete control over matter and energy). He can "kill time," for one thing, meaning he can actually render the entire concept of time meaningless throughout a universe, and does so completely casually. Because manipulating the entire 4 dimensional spacetime of a universe like our own in any way he sees fit (when fully unleashed, that is) is apparently child's-play to him, that is why he is considered low multi-universe, i.e. low 2-C. However the other thing that makes him so dangerous is the actual potency of his reality warping not just in terms of the scale of the effects but also, I don't know how to describe it except really the "depth" to which he can alter reality. It goes beyond just making up laws of physics and into the realm of making ANY CONCEPT HE WANTS into physical law even if it makes no sense at all from the standpoint of ANY possible universe's laws of physics. For example, he can create "bubbles of pure madness" where, when people enter them, they are converted into living conglomerations of deli-meat, or weird angular shapes, or anime characters. He can even create bubbles in which animated characters become real-world people!!! Just watch this clip and you'll see: HILARIOUSNESS

Feats of manipulating reality down to the level of making-concept-real like those bubbles are apparently completely casual to Bill (he creates those "madness bubbles" with like, NO effort, seriously). What he did upon actually entering the physical universe was to actually materialize the realm of nightmares themselves into the physical world. Inanimate objects started coming to life and eating people, those bubbles appeared in which not just the laws of physics are altered but the very underlying concepts of reality are altered, and more.

It's for that reason, that ability of his to warp reality on the level of what approaches conceptual-manipulation (and for thsoe who are not aware, conceptual-manipulation is like, pretty much the MOST haxx power in fiction, in terms of its potential usage), that I believe Bill Cipher has reality-warping with more "depth" than Galactus' powers, even though in terms of scale they are both right around the same level of low 2-C. And that's why I think Bill would win. I don't think Galactus' reality-warping powers have even been that focused on compared to his other abilities, and I'm almost positive he has never exhibited feats of concept-based reality-warping on the level of ones that Bill has. However, I could be wrong--if someone can think of any such feats that Galactus has exhibited, please point them out, because that could change this battle greatly and give Galactus a chance.
 
Uh... just because he did it to one 4-D being, doesn't mean he can do it to all @Bill
 
SomebodyData said:
Uh... just because he did it to one 4-D being, doesn't mean he can do it to all @Bill
Click to expand...
  • sigh* exactly. I've been having a hard time today convincing this guy that as far as this wiki and forum and its standards are conerned, Bill is NOT some kind of all-powerful cosmic god capable of beating anything.
That being said I do still think a full-power Bill would have no problem beating Galactus although I doubt he'd be able to do it nearly as easily as he could kill Time-Baby, Galactus does have crazy cosmic feats and the Power Cosmic is super-duper formidable.
 
@Bill I can beat up a girlscout with no difficulty. A girlscout is a 3rd dimensional entity. So is Goku. Could I beat Goku since both are 3-D? Absolutely not. That is pretty much the logic you are using comparing Time Baby and Galactus since both are 4-D.
 
Ryukama said:
@Bill I can beat up a girlscout with no difficulty. A girlscout is a 3rd dimensional entity. So is Goku. Could I beat Goku since both are 3-D? Absolutely not. That is pretty much the logic you are using comparing Time Baby and Galactus since both are 4-D.
Click to expand...
All we mean by 4-D in this case, by the way, is that they exist in time non-incrementally, i.e. the dimension of time is to them like a spatial-dimension would be to us, they can move freely back and forth in it. They are not spatially 4-D beings. If they WERE, they would be a significantly higher tier since anything that has finite volume in 4 Dimensions must be infinite in 3 Dimensions, meaning a character with any degree at all of 4-Dimensional (again, spatial dimenions) energy/power would have literally infinite power in three dimensions. Yes, the four-dimensional equivalent of something like a bacterium or amoeba would have infinite mass as far as our three-dimensional universe is concerned. So funky to think about :p

Time-Baby's power though has to be of a tier around 2-C considering he is described multiple times as a "Multiversal Overlord" and that he casually controls all of the time-dimension and causality (and thus can change any chain of events in universal history, for the most part, with ease) of an entire universe of size equivalent to our own. Moreover he is able to grant "Time Wishes" that not only are able to alter past causality and history but also have reality-warping powers able to violate the laws of physics (creating an infinitely-regenerating slice of pizza, for example). It's a testament to just how haxx/potent/deep Bill's reality-warping power is that he was still able to very easily vaporize Time Baby even while the scale of his power's growth was still apparently being restricted by the "bubble" around Gravity Falls. You also gotta love how him killing Time Baby triggered him and his friends to have a crazy dance party, woooo! Hahahaha Bill is such a psycho, dang.
 
BillCipher326 said:
You know what Bill makes with 4D entities?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lx2XvcvqzzU
Click to expand...
Your logic is literally very bad here. Just because he one-shot a 4-D being, Time Baby, doesnt mean he can literally one-shot ALL 4-D beings with no difficulty at all.

Do you think a 22nd dimensional being can one-shot other 22nd dimensional beings? Of course not, since they both are literal equals and if such a battle would take place, it would always be a stalemate.
 
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