Ben Tennyson vs The King of Curses

[Reiner04]

And I vaguely remember that 11-year-old Ben had access to Clockwork, I just don't remember why he had access.

But if activated at the same moment your omnitrixes might synchronised.

 

[MintyBoi1]

So I guess I’ll just vote Ben for now, seems he has the win cons and survivability get the win

 

[Arkenis]

I’d assume he’d start with Four Arms, Diamondhead, XLR8, or Heatblast here. They’re all small town, but some have abilities that can bypass the gap like fire hotter than Jogo and Diamond sharpness. I think Heatblast is Ben’s best easy win con, he just has to avoid long enough to get a quick fire blast in and it should be a wrap. I think the strategies mentioned above should also get past Domain once Ben realizes he’s being cut.

Yeah he'd have to go HB cuz the rest if they have no way of dodging or intang or regen then Sukuna just cuts them in one dismantle. I wouldn't say HB can do much either, Sukuna release his own arrow at HB's fire attack and overpower it or dodge or use a shikigami as a block.

start absorbing cuts since they’re energy.

the cuts are not energy.

What is Ben's win cons besides HB vaping?

 

[Reiner04]

the cuts are not energy.

What is Ben's win cons besides HB vaping?

Sleep manp?

 

[Arkenis]

Sleep manp?

how

 

[Reiner04]

how

Wildvine can release sleep gas bombs or smth, maybe sound manp as well can be regarded as wincon? Since Benwolf has it.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Yeah he'd have to go HB cuz the rest if they have no way of dodging or intang or regen then Sukuna just cuts them in one dismantle. I wouldn't say HB can do much either, Sukuna release his own arrow at HB's fire attack and overpower it or dodge or use a shikigami as a block.


the cuts are not energy.

What is Ben's win cons besides HB vaping?

I doubt Sukuna’s fire can really match Heatblast, so that’s still a good win con. Ben also has sleep bombs with Wildvine and can escape Domain with Four Arms or XLR8. It says energy projection for Dismantle on Sukuna’s profile, he should use that since Ben has no Cursed Energy.

I’m wondering if Ben has Ghostfreak since this is after he trapped him. He has soul manipulation, invisibility, and possession for dealing with Sukuna.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Doesn't Sukuna need his mouth and hands to use his techniques?

 

[Reiner04]

I’m wondering if Ben has Ghostfreak since this is after he trapped him. He has soul manipulation, invisibility,

Sukuna has resistance towards soul manp.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Sukuna has resistance towards soul manp.

So Ghostfreaks a no go, was unlikely Ben would use him anyways but it was worth a shot

 

[Reiner04]

But Ghost freak has durability negation with which he can hurt enemies internal organs or hurt their brains or whatever this shit is:

 

[MintyBoi1]

Sorcerers have non phys and Sukuna’s profile says if you possess him you get your soul destroyed so he’d likely just swipe Ghostfreak

 

[Reiner04]

Actually, Ben fra.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Eye Guy also could overheat a nuclear reactor with his lasers and has fire that should compare to that, otherwise what’s the point? So another Ben win con

 

[Reiner04]

Sorcerers have non phys and Sukuna’s profile says if you possess him you get your soul destroyed so he’d likely just swipe Ghostfreak

Durability negation is not exactly possession of any sorts, it's phasing through body and hurting internals.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Durability negation is not exactly possession of any sorts, it's phasing through body and hurting internals.

Yeah but non phys gets around that I’d imagine since he can respond unlike the Circus Freaks

 

[MintyBoi1]

Snare-oh has High-Mid regen, so he can actually contribute here, completely surviving a Domain.

 

[Arkenis]

Yeah Ben FRA. Has too many win cons that can be done far easier than Sukuna's

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Yeah Ben FRA. Has too many win cons that can be done far easier than Sukuna's

Just wait until JJk hax downgrade is accepted.

 

[MintyBoi1]

They’re making it Supersonic right?

 

[Popbum]

Would ditto split if hit by sukuna slashes or does it not work like that?

 

[MintyBoi1]

Would ditto split if hit by sukuna slashes or does it not work like that?

I think he has to actively clone himself, either way he’s completely useless

 

[Popbum]

I think he has to actively clone himself, either way he’s completely useless

Animo’s bird pulled him apart and ben had no idea how the alien worked.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Guess you’re right then. Ben could pull a Buggy and just stop cutting killing him

 

[Uzukeas]

Mid regen is enough to take bisection/decapitation, unless Sukuna cuts him down to basically nothing before he escapes, Wildvine should endure. There’s also the fact Master Control would let Ben keep swapping between aliens. Wildvine + Diamondhead could very well work. Four Arms can also jump street blocks which are at least a few hundred feet, while Sukuna’s Domain only covers 200 meters. He could tank it for a few seconds with regen of other aliens and escape or potentially just escape before even that long using the high end of 700 feet/213 meters.

The range of Malevolent Shrine can cover up to 200m, and Ben wouldn't know about the binding vow which makes it cover 200m, I don't see him figuring out that Malevolent Shrine has a range.
Also, how fast is wildvines regen speed? Because Mid regen can endure malevolent shrine, but thats until he lets out a fire arrow, and malevolent shrine does exceed all of his aliens durability, along with fire arrow.

How fast are Domains in canon, they take a while but that may be cinematic timing. If Ben sees Sukuna summoning this gigantic thing, he should respond in time.

Instant

Mahoraga likely gets killed since Ben can just keep changing to a different one so I don't think Maho will be important here. Sukuna's domain can be withstood by just having good regen above mid.

I'm leaning to Ben but what aliens does he have in this key? What are his go to aliens?

Mahoraga exceeds all of Bens aliens AP, and wouldn't get killed in this fight easily.
His original 10 aliens, arctiguna and feedback are his main aliens, and those are his go to aliens.

If ben has master control then he'll have access to all Aliens of the Universe through codon stream.

Ben needs knowledge of these aliens to transform into them, which he doesn't, and wouldnt transform into something like Humongousaur.

Lava is only up to about 2200 Fahrenheit. Heatblast’s feats here should far surpass that.

Requires supernova heat which requires prep time.

Wildvine can release sleep gas bombs or smth, maybe sound manp as well can be regarded as wincon? Since Benwolf has it.

Shouldn't he resist that since those would be poison which sukuna has a resistance to?

Yeah Ben FRA. Has too many win cons that can be done far easier than Sukuna's

Counted

Doesn't Sukuna need his mouth and hands to use his techniques?

No.

So I guess I’ll just vote Ben for now, seems he has the win cons and survivability get the win

Counted

 

[Arkenis]

Mahoraga exceeds all of Bens aliens AP, and wouldn't get killed in this fight easily.

He gets haxxed by several of them. HB would vaporize him and the wheel as well. Its like if Ben doesn't go to HB and goes to a different one then just pulls out HB its over for Maho.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Ben may not have knowledge of Domains, but escaping the cutting should be a priority for him. Also Snare-oh High-Mid regen. And I believe Heatblast should scale to/above Eye Guy in terms of heat who could overheat a nuclear reactor. Afterall in a different version of the same movie, Heatblast was the one who overheated it, so he’s hotter than Sukuna’s fire. Also don’t think sleep bombs are resisted as poison would be, and if they are, Heatblast.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

No.

Pretty sure he does for some of them, some techniques require a chant or hand sign and him having more hands and mouths than others gave him a huge advantage.

 

[Arkenis]

Yeah Sukuna needs his arms to do his ct. He almost always points at others when doing dismantle or cleave. Domains require handsigns too.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Actually, Ben fra.

Ben FRA
Master Control + Sleep manipulation is enough.

These need to be counted

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Stinkfly shoot his goo at Sukuna's mouth and arms, or Upchuck eat Sukuna and Maho.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Ben may not have knowledge of Domains, but escaping the cutting should be a priority for him. Also Snare-oh High-Mid regen. And I believe Heatblast should scale to/above Eye Guy in terms of heat who could overheat a nuclear reactor. Afterall in a different version of the same movie, Heatblast was the one who overheated it, so he’s hotter than Sukuna’s fire. Also don’t think sleep bombs are resisted as poison would be, and if they are, Heatblast.

Just a small comment, I don't think High-Mid regen is enough to recover from Malevolent shrine. Even a regular cleave from him turned someone into small square meat chunks which I think High-Mid can cover:

However, Malevolent Shrine literally turns buildings into a fine powder/dust that seems smaller than grains of sand.

I think that'd fall into mid-high:

Mid-High: The ability to regenerate from having all biology completely incinerated. This includes being reduced to ash, dust, smoke, vapor, or plasma.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Just a small comment, I don't think High-Mid regen is enough to recover from Malevolent shrine. Even a regular cleave from him turned someone into small square meat chunks which I think High-Mid can cover:

However, Malevolent Shrine literally turns buildings into a fine powder/dust that seems smaller than grains of sand.

I think that'd fall into mid-high:

It looks more like a buildup of debris from the rapid destruction, maybe a screenshot from the anime would be better for clarifying this.

 

[LaserPrecision]

It looks more like a buildup of debris from the rapid destruction, maybe a screenshot from the anime would be better for clarifying this.

I suppose? But the anime DRASTICALLY changes EVERYTHING about this fight. In fact, I think outside of what the Domain did to Mahoraga, it downgrades Malovelent Shrine. In the anime, Mahoraga was reduced to literal red mist, and even the red mist was starting to get chopped up. Yet somehow normal buildings were only being broken down into huge chunks?


But the wiki currently accepts the Malevolent shrine turning those buildings into dust as shown in the manga. That's why in the last panel I linked you to, there's nothing around Mahoraga, because it was just dust that blew away from the wind. No regular build-up just looks like dust and gets blown away by the wind unless they're literal dust particles.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Ok so maybe Shrine can bypass regen, still in that time Ben can escape with Snare-oh, Four Arms, or XLR8

 

[LaserPrecision]

Ok so maybe Shrine can bypass regen, still in that time Ben can escape with Snare-oh, Four Arms, or XLR8

Does speed equalize them, or no? Either way, I think It'd be pretty damn hard to escape considering in Domain Expansion, the attacks literally don't exist until after they spawned on someone. And with how Sukuna turns buildings into dust, I imagine he's cutting things literally millions, billions, trillions, if not quadrillions of times a second (from his perspective). And with a 200 meter radius, they'd have to run a decent distance while dealing with being cut into ribbons. If worst comes to worst, Sukuna can also create a closed domain to make escape impossible.

 

[Arkenis]

This is assuming Ben doesn't meet his win con before Sukuna decides to domain. Sukuna's pretty hesitant to domain unless the other domains or he can't beat in a h2h and considering he can I doubt he'd even domain, especially with him having TS to use instead.

 

[SeijiSetto]

Just a small comment, I don't think High-Mid regen is enough to recover from Malevolent shrine. Even a regular cleave from him turned someone into small square meat chunks which I think High-Mid can cover:

However, Malevolent Shrine literally turns buildings into a fine powder/dust that seems smaller than grains of sand.

I think that'd fall into mid-high:

doesn't the damage sukuna does with his cuts vary depending on the target's toughness? i vaguely remember him mentioning something along these lines when he diced the finger-bearer more finely than he intended to (5 cuts instead of 3?) and something similar happening with ryu.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Does speed equalize them, or no? Either way, I think It'd be pretty damn hard to escape considering in Domain Expansion, the attacks literally don't exist until after they spawned on someone. And with how Sukuna turns buildings into dust, I imagine he's cutting things literally millions, billions, trillions, if not quadrillions of times a second (from his perspective). And with a 200 meter radius, they'd have to run a decent distance while dealing with being cut into ribbons. If worst comes to worst, Sukuna can also create a closed domain to make escape impossible.

Yeah they’re equalized, so Ben is around Supersonic-massively hypersonic. That should be enough to cover 200 meters with XLR8’s speed and Four Arm’s jumps. Plus Ben is far more durable than those buildings. Mahoraga took plenty of cuts there, even if he’s tougher than Ben, Ben can compensate with regen and Diamondhead toughness plus swapping between aliens.

 

[Arkenis]

doesn't the damage sukuna does with his cuts vary depending on the target's toughness? i vaguely remember him mentioning something along these lines when he diced the finger-bearer more finely than he intended to (5 cuts instead of 3?) and something similar happening with ryu.

Yeah. But he chooses how many times he wants to slice you, here it seems he decided to dice them up a lot. On someone stronger or his level he wouldn't be able to.