Ben 10 General Discussion Thread

[Ommf_Deity]

I have a group of friends who are Ben 10 fans. But they think Alien X created only one universe and haven't quite grasped the concept of Timelines. You guys are an expert on Ben 10. How can I explain these details to my friends, who are also Ben 10 fans but don't know much details, in the simplest way possible?

Refer to them the parallel paradox comics, Where Paradox confirmed Ben created the time there. You can also use Maltruant not being able to manipulate time.

 

[GeneralSol16]

Is anyone in the thread willing to calculate the Mechamorphs and Helix’s durability from this feat (if possible)?

Btw forgot to mention it before, but thanks @GeneralSol16 for this list! Sometime later I think I’ll put this stuff plus some other relevant feats into a sandbox or something to make it easy to find.

Are there more tier 5 feats or scaling, that you know?

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Are there more tier 5 feats or scaling, that you know?

The characters could downscale from Way Big’s Conquest Ray feat, he completely overpowers it so it’s good support for planetary. They could also (down)scale to Anodite Gwen being over Highbreed warships if you either scale OV cast to her or scaled her relatively to UA Way Big. Those are the only two I can think of for now. Edit: Ultimate Aggregor’s statements might put him above both of these weapons considering how they’re worded.

Aside from main tier 5 feats, there’s also the Talpaedans’ High 6-A asteroid belt statement and Goop’s High 6-A feat of stabilising Piscciss.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

The characters could downscale from Way Big’s Conquest Ray feat, he completely overpowers it so it’s good support for planetary. They could also (down)scale to Anodite Gwen being over Highbreed warships if you either scale OV cast to her or scaled her relatively to UA Way Big. Those are the only two I can think of for now. Edit: Ultimate Aggregor’s statements might put him above both of these weapons considering how they’re worded.

Aside from main tier 5 feats, there’s also the Talpaedans’ High 6-A asteroid belt statement and Goop’s High 6-A feat of stabilising Piscciss.

So the total feats, alongside who scales (only mentioning the base cast or characters the base cast downscale from):

Spoiler

1. Highbreed fleet destroys Galvan Prime (High 5-A; 1.46 Quettatons): Anodite Gwen and Ultimate Aggregor scale to this.
2. Ascalon is used by the Incursean Warrior to accidentally destroy their home planet (High 5-A; 701.6 Ronnatons): Ultimate Humungousaur and Way Big (from Eatle) scale to this.
3. The Great One survives the destruction of planets (High 5-A; 118.28 Ronnatons): base cast and Ultimate Aggregor scale to this.
4. The Petrosapien Back-Up Crystal is used by Vilgax to destroy Petropia (5-A; 1.61 Ronnatons): Ascalon and arguably AF Vilgax scale to this.
5. Incursean Conquest Ray destroys Pluto and threatens to destroy Earth (5-A; 89.129 Yottatons): Way Big and Ultimate Aggregor scale to this.
6. The Galvanic Mechamorphs reconstruct Galvan B (Low 5-B; 1.82 Zettatons each): base cast scale to this.
7. The secondary Helix threatens to destroy Galvan B (5-C; 29.6 Exatons): base cast scale to this.
8. Talpaedans turn their planet into an asteroid belt (High 6-A; 6.21 Exatons): base cast scale to this.
9. The Sub Energy is stated to be 20x the power of the sun and capable of blowing up a continent (High 6-A; 1.82 Exatons): base cast scale to this.
10. Goop stabilises planet Piscciss (High 6-A; 1.6 Exatons): base cast scale to this.
11. The Galvanic Mechamorphs and Helix survive the destruction of Galvan B (calc needed): base cast scale to this.

If a name is underlined, it means they either only scale due to out of series statements or because the base cast gets their downscaling from out of series statements. It’s not that I think out of series statements are bad or anything especially not when they add consistency to the series, it’s just in case other people have issues with them.

Later I’ll put this into a sandbox or something, alongside the relevant scans and evidence for characters scaling. This is just a very brief summary.

 

[Apollonir.Scale]

Isn't the aggregate already 4-B? Or are we removing 4-B scaling?

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Isn't the aggregate already 4-B? Or are we removing 4-B scaling?

I don’t like the 4-B scaling, but I probably won’t be attempting to remove it myself because then I’d have to edit so many profiles if it passed lol

This is half just for my personal scaling, and half a group of replacement feats for if the 4-B rating ends up getting removed by someone else.

 

[GeneralSol16]

So the total feats, alongside who scales (only mentioning the base cast or characters the base cast downscale from):

Spoiler

1. Highbreed fleet destroys Galvan Prime (High 5-A; 1.46 Quettatons): Anodite Gwen and Ultimate Aggregor scale to this.
2. Ascalon is used by the Incursean Warrior to accidentally destroy their home planet (High 5-A; 701.6 Ronnatons): Ultimate Humungousaur and Way Big (from Eatle) scale to this.
3. The Great One survives the destruction of planets (High 5-A; 118.28 Ronnatons): base cast and Ultimate Aggregor scale to this.
4. The Petrosapien Back-Up Crystal is used by Vilgax to destroy Petropia (5-A; 1.61 Ronnatons): Ascalon and arguably AF Vilgax scale to this.
5. Incursean Conquest Ray destroys Pluto and threatens to destroy Earth (5-A; 89.129 Yottatons): Way Big and Ultimate Aggregor scale to this.
6. The Galvanic Mechamorphs reconstruct Galvan B (Low 5-B; 1.82 Zettatons each): base cast scale to this.
7. The secondary Helix threatens to destroy Galvan B (5-C; 29.6 Exatons): base cast scale to this.
8. Talpaedans turn their planet into an asteroid belt (High 6-A; 6.21 Exatons): base cast scale to this.
9. The Sub Energy is stated to be 20x the power of the sun and capable of blowing up a continent (High 6-A; 1.82 Exatons): base cast scale to this.
10. Goop stabilises planet Piscciss (High 6-A; 1.6 Exatons): base cast scale to this.
11. The Galvanic Mechamorphs and Helix survive the destruction of Galvan B (calc needed): base cast scale to this.

If a name is underlined, it means they either only scale due to out of series statements or because the base cast gets their downscaling from out of series statements. It’s not that I think out of series statements are bad or anything especially not when they add consistency to the series, it’s just in case other people have issues with them.

Later I’ll put this into a sandbox or something, alongside the relevant scans and evidence for characters scaling. This is just a very brief summary.

This is what I call consistency lmao

 

[BlastX]

Shouldn't 11 Year Old Ditto be stronger than his 10 year old Self for hurting Eon a little bit? At the very least that's better than what he did in OS.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

A quick question: what things are closest to the 4-B Aggregor feat? I know about Element X and Ma Vreedle’s rocket, but is there anything closer?

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

A quick question: what things are closest to the 4-B Aggregor feat? I know about Element X and Ma Vreedle’s rocket, but is there anything closer?

It's in 4-B upgrade thread

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Genuinely what was Vulkanus’ plan when he was trying to put Element X into the molten iron in the Galactic Enforcers episode? Not only does OV confirm that the explosion happens immediately (something already implied in the OS episode), but it also shows Vulkanus’ body getting completely obliterated by an imperfect bonding of the two elements. If Vulkanus and SixSix succeeded they would’ve died lol

 

[BlastX]

They wanted to go out in a bang.

 

[GeneralSol16]

So according to Paradox, Clockwork 10K and Way Big had enough power to destroy the Hands of Armageddon throughout space and time, every version.

Could this be a High 3-A feat?

 

[Ghengiroo115]

So according to Paradox, Clockwork 10K and Way Big had enough power to destroy the Hands of Armageddon throughout space and time, every version.

Could this be a High 3-A feat?

I thought about this, but it gets weird since Jetray ends up seemingly singlehandedly (pun intended) destroying all the Hands later on. Unless of course he didn’t destroy them all, as it’s never explicitly stated he did and you’d presumably need some space-time power like Clockwork to actually achieve a feat like that.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

As an aside I wonder how durable the Hands is while its defences are activated. iirc there’s a pop-up trivia statement that says the Hands are defenceless while they’re active (this explains inconsistencies in both RAT and UA).

 

[GeneralSol16]

As an aside I wonder how durable the Hands is while its defences are activated. iirc there’s a pop-up trivia statement that says the Hands are defenceless while they’re active (this explains inconsistencies in both RAT and UA).

So, UA Way Big and Clockwork would output enough power to destroy them across space and time, while Jetray and Wildmutt just a defenseless HoA? Even then, shouldn't Jetray still scale to that?

 

[BlastX]

Do we take Ben's Aliens getting stronger as the series goes on? Like Diamondhead went from doing Zero damage or flinching Vilgax with his crystals in Secrets to knocking him off his ass with them in Back With a Vengeance, Four Arms got his ass beat by Kevin 11 to knocking Technorg on his ass while Kevin was unable to make him flinch without combining his powers.

 

[GeneralSol16]

Do we take Ben's Aliens getting stronger as the series goes on? Like Diamondhead went from doing Zero damage or flinching Vilgax with his crystals in Secrets to knocking him off his ass with them in Back With a Vengeance, Four Arms got his ass beat by Kevin 11 to knocking Technorg on his ass while Kevin was unable to make him flinch without combining his powers.

Yeah, Ben's aliens should definitely get Accelerated Development

 

[Hellformer]

Idk about Map of Infinity (where does that even scale?), but he should be above Eon and Ben has that “create any universe he imagines” statement using the power of both Ascalon and Dagon. Ascalon also has statements of being able to tap into the primal/fundamental forces of the universe, if that’s worth anything. I think the statements from Vilgax and Azmuth about Dagon destroying the universe are too vague and could be argued to be an over time thing, but there are other ways for him to reach universal and higher.

Map of Infinity should be at least 1-B given there's a statement that suggests it can bend "all of space and time"

 

[Hellformer]

Btw something I noticed: the base characters scale to 1.04226 TeraFoe while Ultimate Aggregor scales to 9.475086 TeraFoe, but Greg’s durability is explicitly 6-7x the level of these characters (depending on whether you treat P’andor’s suit as a separate thing or not) which should make their stats 1.57918 TeraFoe or 1.35358 TeraFoe.

Edit: realised the problem. The 1.04… rating comes from scaling initial Ultimate Kevin to Ultimate Greg and then adding 1/10th of Ultimate Greg’s power to him. Ultimate Humungousaur is then scaled to Kevin, and base cast are made to be 1/10th Ultimate Hugh. The problem is that Kevin is not comparable to Greg, he completely stomped him. The 1.57… or 1.35… ratings make more sense when considering Kevin’s power.

The thing is, we don't know how high he was as compared to Greg when he absorbed the ultimatrix, so he is at least >= greg.
Then he becomes equal to ult hum when he absorbs greg, that's how the calc is made.

 

[DemonicDude]

i did it !!!!

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:DemonicDude/Ben_10_Ultimate_Alien_Cosmic_Destruction_(DS_Version)_Evil_Way_Big_got_blased_to_the_Moon_by_Potis_Altiare_amped_Way_Big

 

[Lort15]

i did it !!!!

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:DemonicDude/Ben_10_Ultimate_Alien_Cosmic_Destruction_(DS_Version)_Evil_Way_Big_got_blased_to_the_Moon_by_Potis_Altiare_amped_Way_Big