If you ask me, I'd call this an outlier. Because if you were to scale Baraggan's 1-armed Bankai, Soi Fon, it would be like putting BG9 above Grimmjow.
I didn't open Kisuke's CRT anyway
I see what you mean. There will be arguments that haven't been used before in the Espada CRT (or at least not in this wiki). So there won't be things like "Aizen ranked Baraggan number 2 to bully him", "Halibel ranked him number 3 because she's pretty", "Grimmjow ranked low because he's disrespectful".
BG9 would decimate Grimmjow, mid diff.
Unless there’s evidence for that being contradictory, that’s not an argument.
Meninas considers Base Grimmjow's GRC to be lethal. This clearly indicates that Grimmjow > BG9. BG9 also takes damage from Soi Fon. Soi Fon is clearly weaker than Byakuya. Byakuya feels the need to activate his bankai to defeat Robert. Meninas has been stated to be stronger than Robert.
Ayyyyy, a fellow Cass enjoyer! Best character indeed, she’s still here despite the higher-ups trying to sabotage her.
Would recognize that panel anywhere. Goated taste, best character in comic book history.
No it doesn't.
Meninas was stated to be more powerful than robert where? Also byakuya consistently uses his bankai for many reasons other than the power level of his opponent. It is more like he used the Bankai to end the fight quickly than Robert being stronger or that he was trying to blitz him and his bankai was fast enough to stop him.
Okay? What's this supposed to prove? Because I don't get this argument.
They use their arms to summon him, ayon doesn't scale to them so their base forms weakening him isn't an argument unless there is evidence to believe so
It is already accepted in her profile that she is stronger than Robert.
Byakuya doesn't use his bankai against anyone who doesn't require it. We know this from the SS arc. He even stated that he used Senkei against two people, the second being Ichigo.
Even if Vollstandig opens, I think Grimmjow can also switch to Resurrection. Even if Vollstandig opens, the gap between them won't close.
The arms of their Resurrection forms are stronger than those of their base forms. Summoning Ayon with a stronger arm makes them stronger in every way. Simply put, they're using an arm with more reiatsu. Blood loss weakens arrancar abilities. After taking too many hits and shedding blood from Quilge, they summoned Ayon.
You know when i asked this i was not expecting an answer from someone who im fairly certain would be against the full respira scaling chain iirc.
I'm pretty sure we don't, especially since Barragan implies he was at his strongest in the Fake Karakura Town arc, if I recall correctly.
Barragan doesn't even scale to the stronger versions of Ikomikidomoe since they only fought before the latter went on a rampage through the Soul Society and the Royal Palace (and Ikomikidomoe explicitly gets stronger by consuming stuff).
Fair.
Robert required it but it wasn't because of strength, it was to end the fight quickly and the fact that he was trying to blitz him. I never said byakuya doesn't use his bankai on those that don't require it don't strawmann me.
Senkei is a technique of his bankai not his bankai itself these are two different things. The same SS arc he used Bankai on a shikai ichigo while initially having the belief of Ichigo being weaker than him. That very arc negates your argument. He doesn't use Senkei unless he doesn't have a choice but he uses bankai very quickly.
The same byakuya has more stamina than characters who can fight or work for days to even weeks without rest. I think his stamina is fine.
They are already have daten on byakuya already lol, byakuya has literally used his bankai more than anyone in the series besides ichigo at this point. They have more than enough information about it and byakuya himself knows this already.
I never said he stated that, but he was already dominating a regular voltstanding robert without Shikai even while fighting the other two. I only said because it is strong possibility rather than blatant relativity.
He didn't start bankai against robert either.
And none of those fights made him use bankai because they were on his level according to byakuya believes.
Based off what reasoning.
Again, Ayon doesn't scale from or to them so this speculation is invalid and has no evidence.
Ayon's power doesn't come from them, summoning ayon doesn't mean their combined reaitsu is on his level
Knowing what we learned about Starrk, I feel like this is... interesting. We know his stronger, pre-split self was so strong, Aizen didn't want to face him. Pre-Hogyoku Baraggan could clapped by Aizen, Gin, and Kaname. Now, pre-split Starrk is leaps and bounds above the Starrk we actually saw, but it's still kinda interesting.
Nah, we do because Baraggan doesn't do that, at least privately speak though. The wiki doesn't have a tabber for a hypothetical "prime Baraggan" or accepted scaling regarding that.
So, is there any proof that Ayon is stronger than before? Even if he's not losing weight as I think he is, it can't be proven that he's gotten stronger either.
Ayon couldn't even kill strong vice captains with a cero in FKT and in TYBW he is fodderizing with his bare hands Voll + Blut Quilge who no sold a serious GT from fullbring Shikai Ichigo to the neck.
Not being able to kill isn't an anti-feat. In most fictional series, even if their AP is much higher than their opponent's durability, they will exceed their durability, but a character whose durability is exceeded doesn't always die. This isn't always an anti-feat for someone who can't kill.
Ayon had Quilge's neck do a dab. if it was a shinigami, it would be 100% dead.
His feats are proof
Think about this hypothetical:
Ya'll are forgetting how strong Fullbring Shikai and Bankai are. I'm gonna have to do a respect thread on them or something, lol.
This is 100% an Anti-Feat, what the f*ck??? His cero doesn't even cut through a lieutenant. A cero from segunta etapa ulquiorra cut cut a hole through Ichigo, and TYBW Ayon would bite SE Ulquiorra's head off.
According to what exactly: Ayon>Ulquiorra
Yhwach also couldn't kill Liltotto. By your logic, is this an anti-feat for Yhwach? A character's inability to kill another character can't be an anti-feat for AP. Not being able to overcome their Dura is an anti-feat. As long as the story writer wants them to remain alive, the character won't die anyway.
How was he not interested in fighting? Where is the evidence of that.
No, because Yhwach was asleep and was toying with them that logic doesn't apply to Ayon who is a raging beast that was actively trying to kill them.
It depends on the context of the situation, in Ayon's case it does. And also, you speculate a lot from what I have seen and you seem to have the idea that we need to prove Ayon isn't on the same strength level but we don't. You on the other hand need to prove otherwise.
Now, you know the thing I mentioned earlier about stamina dropping when surprised. Yhwach is surprised when Ichigo's Blut Vene activates, and after being surprised, he takes damage from Ichigo.
What about Starrk's example? His ceros are powerful enough to damage Love and Rojuro. But he stated that his ceros couldn't kill them, so he felt compelled to use wolves.
Momo didn’t die from Lille Barro’s attacks. Lille Barro is definitely Momo level.
His attacks didn't fail to pierce Liltotto. If you punch through someone, and they survive being punched through that's one thing.
Ayon scales to FB Bankai and he scales to Urahara.
We already adressed this argument, and proved it's wrong. We know for a fact that Jugram doesn't scale to that level, and Ichigo just received the beating of his life at that point, he's cooked. That's not regular Ichigo.
I know, Ichigo by that point is already a monster and is near Yama level.
I think what you're thinking of is that we don't treat other series as being able to resist Spiritual Pressure by being physically strong.
Simply having greater stats doesn't protect you from the RC and Spiritual Pressure, right?
Pretty much.
Being physically stronger won't help you to avoid Spiritual pressure, fair enough. I assume you need to have something similar to Bleach spiritual power to counteract pressure. Some powerful deities with correspondingly divine Soul would resist, isn't? And spiritual pressure wouldn't work on soulless being, or can it?
Thanks.
Nope. We are waiting for TYBW cour 4 to finish to properly establish the new scaling. So mid 2026 at the earliest i would say.
Kenpachi vs Ichigo is pretty straightforward in terms of explaining more Reiatsu = more everything.
The characthers being able to resist their own reiatsu pressure is another. We see or know what happen in the few case they don't, like SS arc bankai ichigo being crushed by his own RC overtime, Yama could die just by being in bankai too long and bankai Zaraki can't handle his own pressure and **** up his body.
