- 532
- 102
I was saying both forms should have different scaling chain. It should be a must if the value is unknown right?
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion
- Thread starter Zoro21043
- Start date
- 18,821
- 27,395
Nope he is explicitly talking about start of second invasion. But you can interpret it as universal, adding consistency if you think Yama is overtiming the Soul Society universe and if you think Gremmy is like galaxy to universal
Hellscream
He/Him- 1,725
- 832
- 6,875
- 1,319
- 871
- 646
Hill level
- 10,920
- 19,010
- 18,821
- 27,395
Send the other one, no balls
- 11,987
- 5,410
hey guys who wanna join me
- 15,801
- 12,066
Both of who's forms?
- 15,801
- 12,066
Lock this man up and throw away the key.hey guys who wanna join me
- 11,987
- 5,410
lads hop on rangiku feet hangout
- 871
- 646
mods, crush his skull, thank you
- 1,053
- 1,098
Sometimes i regret things such as:Not being blind,being part of this thread,existing in the same timeline as Robo.
- 78
- 25
i have the clash between zaraki and hikone. it seems to me that the relativity in bleach is confirmed and that from what i know to stop time you should go speed of light following the relativity. hikone vs zaraki basically did this now my question is one does this not bring the verse to limits sol? fire force is an example. i'm just asking because i really don't know how to refute it
- 10,920
- 19,010
Special Relativity existing in Bleach doesn't then imply everything with the theory is fully appropriated to the fictional setting if we have due reason to believe otherwise. If you want to argue against that interpretation without addressing the Physics claim itself, just argue on the Hasty Generalization being made by providing evidence(s) of characters within the series approaching or surpassing the speed of light without causing Time Dilation to occur, substantiated by calculations and logical argumentation.
Fire Force literally doesn't matter here. It has its own weird verse-specific mechanics that are completely non-analogous to anything in Bleach. In Bleach, approaching or surpassing the speed of light doesn't allow you to traverse throughout time, while in Fire Force it does. If you want to address these arguments, you can't appeal to separate verses when dealing with verse-specific situations, like we have here.
Fire Force literally doesn't matter here. It has its own weird verse-specific mechanics that are completely non-analogous to anything in Bleach. In Bleach, approaching or surpassing the speed of light doesn't allow you to traverse throughout time, while in Fire Force it does. If you want to address these arguments, you can't appeal to separate verses when dealing with verse-specific situations, like we have here.
- 78
- 25
thank you for answering me. I wanted to know a valid reason not a valid reason but an argument that would make me say "ok I understand" because I was in the balance to understand if it had a limit or not. thank you
- 78
- 25
I didn't understand some points. so if we have a character that goes at speeds close to that of light and time spreads out, would that mean there is a limit? I have poor english so I might have misunderstood. but hikone and zaraki going at relativistic speeds weren't we stopping time? I repeat, I have bad english so I might have misinterpreted your message
- 532
- 102
I mean in general.
For example ichigo that fought quilgie is massively weaker (unquantifiable) than enraged ichigo.
So both of these Shouldn’t scale to each other. Both form should have completely different scaling chain.
Do you get my question now?
Last edited:
- 532
- 102
Exactly.
In this fictional sphere it should mainly mean the verse considers time the higher dimensions
- 11,504
- 3,074
Any predictions for next episode?
I have two predictions.
1. Episode will focus on Yhwach building up the Walwehrt, Shinigami building the gate and ends with Kenpachi losing to Pernida. Setting up Mayuri vs Pernida.
2. I’m crossing my fingers to see Grimmjow attack Ichigo to test his new power and show him being close in power to Ichigo just like Uryu did. Before getting tame by Nel. Lol
Please
hoping for a Grimmjow vs Ichigo fight next episode even if it’s a minute long.
I have two predictions.
1. Episode will focus on Yhwach building up the Walwehrt, Shinigami building the gate and ends with Kenpachi losing to Pernida. Setting up Mayuri vs Pernida.
2. I’m crossing my fingers to see Grimmjow attack Ichigo to test his new power and show him being close in power to Ichigo just like Uryu did. Before getting tame by Nel. Lol
Please
hoping for a Grimmjow vs Ichigo fight next episode even if it’s a minute long.
ReaperAndBlues
He/Him- 3,091
- 3,051
Aizen lowkey would probably smell like shit rn. He was locked up in Muken for 2 years with no way of doing literally anything, no showers, no bathroom, no grooming. I don't think his passive aura comes from Reiatsu, it's probably coming from the sheer stink.
- 10,920
- 19,010
No because, as I said, just because Time Dilation exist in Bleach doesn't inherently mean it abides by our real life specific measurement of time and how it coincides with the speed of light, which is why I said a good way to address this claim is by showing that, while yes Special Relativity in Bleach does exist, we have due reason to believe it doesn't fully appropriate all temporal effects the theory explains.
Basically, in simpler terms, we have no reason to believe Hikone's feat means Bleach's speed is capped to anything below light speed because nothing has been proven that Special Relativity is itself accurately depicted in this case, while we have reason to believe otherwise.
Also, and I could be wrong as I'm no Physicist, but I don't believe Time Dilation itself has a specific value required to cause an observer's perception of time to dilate and still, as Time Dilation is, seemingly, based on the observer's velocity in relation to everything around it, so technically you can be millions of times FTL and still have Time Dilation has described by Special Relativity occur. But I will allow someone like Arc to explain this better if he so desires as I'm not knowledgeable enough to continue on this line any further.
No, perché, come ho detto, solo perché la dilatazione del tempo esiste in Bleach non significa necessariamente che segua la nostra misurazione specifica del tempo nella vita reale e come essa coincida con la velocità della luce. Ecco perché ho detto che un buon modo per affrontare questa affermazione è dimostrare che, mentre sì, la relatività speciale in Bleach esiste, abbiamo buone ragioni per credere che non appropri completamente tutti gli effetti temporali che la teoria spiega.
Fondamentalmente, in termini più semplici, non abbiamo motivo di credere che l'impresa di Hikone significhi che la velocità in Bleach sia limitata a qualsiasi cosa sotto la velocità della luce, poiché nulla è stato provato affinché la relatività speciale sia rappresentata accuratamente in questo caso, mentre abbiamo motivi per credere il contrario.
Inoltre, e potrei sbagliarmi dato che non sono un fisico, ma non credo che la dilatazione del tempo abbia un valore specifico necessario per causare la dilatazione della percezione del tempo di un osservatore. La dilatazione del tempo, apparentemente, si basa sulla velocità dell'osservatore in relazione a tutto ciò che lo circonda, quindi tecnicamente puoi essere milioni di volte più veloce della luce e avere comunque la dilatazione del tempo come descritta dalla relatività speciale. Ma lascerò che qualcuno come Arc spieghi meglio questo punto se lo desidera, dato che non ho conoscenze sufficienti per continuare su questa linea.
Fondamentalmente, in termini più semplici, non abbiamo motivo di credere che l'impresa di Hikone significhi che la velocità in Bleach sia limitata a qualsiasi cosa sotto la velocità della luce, poiché nulla è stato provato affinché la relatività speciale sia rappresentata accuratamente in questo caso, mentre abbiamo motivi per credere il contrario.
Inoltre, e potrei sbagliarmi dato che non sono un fisico, ma non credo che la dilatazione del tempo abbia un valore specifico necessario per causare la dilatazione della percezione del tempo di un osservatore. La dilatazione del tempo, apparentemente, si basa sulla velocità dell'osservatore in relazione a tutto ciò che lo circonda, quindi tecnicamente puoi essere milioni di volte più veloce della luce e avere comunque la dilatazione del tempo come descritta dalla relatività speciale. Ma lascerò che qualcuno come Arc spieghi meglio questo punto se lo desidera, dato che non ho conoscenze sufficienti per continuare su questa linea.
- 578
- 27
I dont know why Yhwach bring Nianzol to Soul King palace . Yhwach refuses to take anyone below elite stenrriter level to go with him so is Nianzol elie level ? Or strongest non elite quincy ? But funny how he get no diff by clone base Senjumaru.
Bastolan27
He/Him- 987
- 1,012
Wasn't Quilge a combat instructor for the Sternritter (or is that just headcanon)? If he was, it would make sense why he’s so abnormally powerful compared to the regular Sternritter. Plus, he was the only Sternritter with a position in the military hierarchy of the empire, aside from being a Sternritter, which has always set him apart as an anomaly compared to the others.
Bastolan27
He/Him- 987
- 1,012
didn't I answer this a few days ago?
But yeah, as Deceived said, relativity in Bleach isn’t the same as relativity in the real world, so it doesn’t matter.
ReaperAndBlues
He/Him- 3,091
- 3,051
He was. Klub Outside confirms that.
- 532
- 102
Yes. Kubo confirmed he was their instructor
- 532
- 102
Objectively can any nonelite sternritter even land any hit on him?
Gremmy is an obvious exception
- 578
- 27
Was Kubo comfirm Gremmy is elite stern before he get killed and Askin take his place ? Or just head canon ?
- 532
- 102
No. Nothing. But he has statement and acknowledgement from other characters to be strongest sternritter.
He also has better feat than rest of the sternritter aside from uryu, jugram (with anime addition) who should narratively be stronger anyway. Nobody comes close to outerspace feat aside from uryu scaling to senjumaru. I'm still iffy about this since he one shotted paralyzed shutara.
I find gerard to be stronger too since he overcame zaraki's shikai. Though it's tough to find justification for gerard due to his hax.
Last edited:
ReaperAndBlues
He/Him- 3,091
- 3,051
Horrific outlier.
- 532
- 102
Is there no strict rules about outlier?
I think people use it pretty open as a convenient excuse.
Didn’t she use her hax to do so?
ReaperAndBlues
He/Him- 3,091
- 3,051
There is absolutely no narrative that supports her being anywhere close to that tier. We already have shitass profiles and rankings as is (like Base Yhwach being slower than Base Lille, Oetsu being slower than Liltotto, or Jugram having lower AP than Bambietta), and this feat just has no place in the scaling. Her being able to beat the dog shit out of Gerard would be ridiculous. Plus, Ichigo was also offguard.
It's an outlier because it makes no narrative sense. Especially when even among the Bambis she's not the strongest either, so her being above everyone else is stupid. Of course this could just be bait.
Last edited:
