Average Stats for Touhou

[Yamatohime]

I wanted to make some revisions for Touhou profiles (after all they looked like copies with slightly different abilities) but got confused after reading their profiles on their respective wikias. For example Youmu is mentioned to be slightly above average with magic and really good with sword. Alice is mentioned to be average at everything (but it's probably mistranslation since I found the one where she is called magician without true strong and weak points). Meiling is half-bakedly assumed to be stronger compared to Sakuya in all out battle (but not in duel), additionaly it mentioned that overall she is considered stronger than average youkai.

Suika's talk with Alice confusing too. For example little oni mentioned that Patchouli and Youmu are weak (I doubt that Sakuya, Marisa and Reimu can be considered youkai while Yukari just played with Alice) - hinting that Alice fought battles with those who were weaker than her (and Remilia with Yuyuko stronger than Alice).

So my question is... What is actualy average power level for Touhou (minimum is probably Cirno and maximum probably Shinki)?

 

[Promestein]

Suika said that Alice avoided the really strong youkai, not that she was fighting weak ones.

 

[Yamatohime]

Suika said that Alice avoided the really strong youkai, not that she was fighting weak ones.

But it actualy hints that Alice went to battle only those who can sure win. On other hand Alice accept that she is not as proficient with magic as Patchy though.

 

[Promestein]

Not like Patchouli's magical knowledge is particularly combat-centric, at least in comparison to Alice's and Marisa's, so.

Anyways, I'm curious as to where you got that information on Meiling. I know that it's been stated that she has no particular big strengths or weaknesses as a Youkai, but I've never read anything about her being stronger than Sakuya.

 

[Yamatohime]

I doubt that battle between Alice and Patchy was THE real brawl. I think it was more battle of magical skills. Of course, Alice who fights Marisa almost on daily basis is superior to Patchy who is anemic/asthmatic.

As for Meiling being stronger than Sakuya. It was half-baked winning comment of Meiling in 12.3: that's she is always goes easy when fighting intruders. That's why it's just funny speculation. But Meiling is sure not your average youkai (Suika's winning comment allows to speculate that Meiling just not trained enough).

 

[Promestein]

Hm. Alright.

 

[Yamatohime]

Actualy, thinking about it... Out of all three magicians Marisa is the only one who is combat-centric with her spells. Patchy and Alice are more "scientist" and "craftsman/commander" types.

I wonder... If casual Suika (High 7-A) can be considered as your everyday strong youkai?

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Yeah I'd be good to not have everyone at 7-B from fodder, because that's sad.

Why High 7-A? Pretty sure ripping apart the Youkai Mountain is barely 7-A.

 

[Yamatohime]

Well, I think Suika can rip appart Youkai Mountain without real effort though. And it's not about Suika's real power level but what can be considered the strenght of your strongest Touhou youkai - oni?

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Well not really a good reason for HIGH 7-A.

Also, Onis are kinda top tiers so...Idk if we should scales it to average youkai.

 

[Yamatohime]

Actualy, by the looks of it... Ripping appart Youkai Mountain is not even 7-A at all.

The average at all stats is probably Alice (if we consider her profile from SWR canon). But we should put some kind of ceiling before thinking about average levels.

 

[Yamatohime]

I got some basic ideas about mythology and it probably better to stick to them for awhile. Oni, kitsune and tanuki - are usualy depicted as the strongest youkais. Inugami, kappa, hebi, tengu and sometimes mujina are can be called the middle tiers. Bakeneko and tsuchigumo are below previous youkais. Tsukomogami are probably the weakest and at the same time the most common.

As far as I remember Touhou is currently follow japanese myths in terms of power level.

 

[Promestein]

Kind of difficult to use these things to come to any solid conclusions regarding tiering.

 

[Yamatohime]

Kind of difficult to use these things to come to any solid conclusions regarding tiering.

Well, we have only featless bakeneko (Chen), kappa (Nitori) and wolf-tengu (Momiji) for your average youkais. Tsukomogami is present too.

 

[DontTalk]

I think how far we can really be sure everyone not high/top tier can be just said to be above fodder level for now, except for those that scale to feats already avaiable.

 

[Yamatohime]

Most of the reccuring characters have no problem to deal with fodder but its hardly a feat since we can't scale them this way.

 

[Yamatohime]

I know this is not that type of thread but can somebody explain what did Alice saw during IN?

Maybe you can't tell, but... There are a ridiculous number of full-moon-beams falling on us now.

Kaguya's comment doesn't help...

The pure moon throws its pale illumination upon the pure earth... This light is a memory of an ancient time, forgotten by even the moon races.

 

[Andykhang]

I know this is not that type of thread but can somebody explain what did Alice saw during IN?
Maybe you can't tell, but... There are a ridiculous number of full-moon-beams falling on us now.

Kaguya's comment doesn't help...


The pure moon throws its pale illumination upon the pure earth... This light is a memory of an ancient time, forgotten by even the moon races.

Basically, it's just like the residue light from the star are image of it a few year ago, with some mythology meaning to it.

 

[Yamatohime]

Basically, it's just like the residue light from the star are image of it a few year ago, with some mythology meaning to it.

Phantom-Seeing Power can see through illusions... It's kind of crazy that Alice could see something from the past. And even if it allow to see the past... She should not be able to see separate beam of light descending on her.

 

[Andykhang]

Basically, it's just like the residue light from the star are image of it a few year ago, with some mythology meaning to it.

Phantom-Seeing Power can see through illusions... It's kind of crazy that Alice could see something from the past. And even if it allow to see the past... She should not be able to see separate beam of light descending on her.

You misunderstand. I didn't mean the past, i mean the light of the past, just like how the image of the star is still here even long after it's gone. In this case though, it's meant to be a residue from the past that's still emitting light (probably due to Kaguya's ability)

 

[Yamatohime]

You misunderstand. I didn't mean the past, i mean the light of the past, just like how the image of the star is still here even long after it's gone. In this case though, it's meant to be a residue from the past that's still emitting light (probably due to Kaguya's ability)

Hm... It's more plausible. Alice saw through the False Moon Illusion and found out light from the Moon. Still I kind of doubt that it's Kaugya's powers or otherwise Alice saw something that was frozen in eternity. =_= Which is kind of out of Alice league I think.

 

[Andykhang]

^Kaguya ability is more like the constant reservation of state, as in it's unchange, without the effect of entropy. I suspect Kaguya's ability have more to do with Quanta, the many "frame" of 3D space that make up the 4D Spacetime. By preventing the particle in that particular Quanta from now on to changed, she reserved the state.

 

[Yamatohime]

If we go with this explanation... The light is kind of frozen in 4D spacetime continum and basicaly can't be seen even with illusion nulifying vision.

 

[Andykhang]

If we go with this explanation... The light is kind of frozen in 4D spacetime continum and basicaly can't be seen even with illusion nulifying vision.

Then that would be weird. Maybe we need some other explanation?Though, it's not really "frozen". Just that it state have been reserve to "constanly emit light"... which would break the conservation of energy.

 

[Yamatohime]

Then that would be weird. Maybe we need some other explanation?

Yeah, we need other explanation or with your one... Alice is 4D being which kind of wanking of crazy proportions or if we realy moderate - she has 4D vision...

 

[Andykhang]

Maybe it's simpler to think that stuff would be "stuck" in eternity, only having one state no matter the interation

 

[Yamatohime]

Actualy... Alice told that beams are descending on her and Marisa. So they are not frozen.