Austin Theory vs Violet Evergarden

[DivineAura44]

WWE characters do tend to get quite dubious.

 

[RandomGuy2345]

its the size of her body that she swings around like nothing lol its gonna be a lot different to dodge then a usual sword

I can argue that the steel ladders wrestlers use are about as big.

 

[Jackythejack]

Do they wield them with the same efficiency as Violet

are they as heavy as a big ass axe?

 

[RandomGuy2345]

Do they wield them with the same efficiency as Violet

Yes. They have Weapon Mastery on their profiles for a reason lmao

 

[DemonicDude]

Sword vs Axe
Argument needs proper read and it depends on Skill.
Violent has military training, Theory is a professional wrestler he doesn't stick to one style of fighting, He'll lock in a submission or use dirty tactics the moment he gets opportunity and has variety of moves.

 

[Shmooply]

I gotta ask the question because I always do. How strong is Violet's resistance to social influencing.

Considering that the most famous thing about her Violet is bad at speaking with people and can't understand human emotions, Austin's social influencing could work.

I can argue that the steel ladders wrestlers use are about as big.

It's a wide-as-your-mom axe used by a someone whose really skilled at wielding it, not a ladder, so I don't really get your point here.

 

[Bruhtelho]

Yes. They have Weapon Mastery on their profiles for a reason lmao

having Weapon Mastery just means your good with weapons of any type, it doesnt mean that wielding a Steel Ladder =/= wielding a huge battle Axe like a baseball bat

 

[Jackythejack]

you cannot tell me a steel ladder and a big ass axe made to cut and kill are the same thing.

Weapon mastery means jack if they don't show relevant skill feats for the weapon type in question.

 

[Bruhtelho]

btw im voting Violet if that wasnt obvious enough

 

[RandomGuy2345]

Fair point lmao, but...

you cannot tell me a steel ladder and a big ass axe made to cut and kill are the same thing.

Violent in character, prefers not to kill, and doesn't like using lethal weapons.

 

[Jackythejack]

is her main weapon not an axe-

how does that not kill

 

[DemonicDude]

It's a fictional battleaxe it can be as sharp as it wants

If there's no actual statement such as "This is he sharpest blade in the country or the Earth" like most sword using anims does to emphasize of their weapon.
Then it means it doesn't matter how big it is it's still comparable to a standard military battle axe just bigger in size.

 

[Jackythejack]

there seems to be a disconnect and I'm trying to understand it.

Is she a ruthless military killing machine who uses a giant axe to murder people or is she someone who doesn't like to kill and doesn't use weapons

 

[RandomGuy2345]

is her main weapon not an axe-

how does that not kill

I was just stating that in Violet's profile that she doesn't like to kill, or use lethal weapons. I just go off what's said in the profile.

there seems to be a disconnect and I'm trying to understand it.

Is she a ruthless military killing machine who uses a giant axe to murder people or is she someone who doesn't like to kill and doesn't use weapons

Both

In all seriousness, ask someone who's more knowledgeable than me.

 

[Bruhtelho]

there seems to be a disconnect and I'm trying to understand it.

Is she a ruthless military killing machine who uses a giant axe to murder people or is she someone who doesn't like to kill and doesn't use weapons

She doesnt like killing but is more then willing to and due to SBA shes in-character but willing to kill so she'll use her weapons just as she did during the War

 

[Jackythejack]

Ah in that case that makes things a lot more simple lol.

I was going to say that she could potentially be disarmed but they both have the same LS so that's not really going to happen easily.

Violet seems stronger overall, and the pain tolerance and her experience with lots of murder I think put her over the edge. So like, I'd vote for her.

 

[DemonicDude]

That's it ! I'm making Drew McIntyre's profile

 

[RandomGuy2345]

Alright.

I'm about to make a big ass explanation as to why I think Theory wins more often than not.

Give me a bit.

 

[DivineAura44]

Theory gets spooked by the Axe, asks her to calmly put it down and they become best friends. The End.

 

[Jackythejack]

Just remember both sides get oneshot by a twelve year old

 

[Shmooply]

Just remember both sides get oneshot by a twelve year old

RPGMaker Chads once again get another W.

 

[Jackythejack]

there's probably some RPG maker characters you can put against these WWE guys

 

[Shmooply]

there's probably some RPG maker characters you can put against these WWE guys

brad would be good but lets save this for a different thread

 

[Jackythejack]

Brad too strong unfortunately

 

[RandomGuy2345]

Alright, here we go.

Well, for starters, Austin Theory was a bodybuilding champion at the age of 17. Here's an image of him in that bodybuilding competition. Keep in mind he was only 17 at the time. Now that he’s a full time professional wrestler at the age of 24, there’s no doubt in my mind that Theory is in full peak condition, making him physically superior to a lot of the wrestlers in the roster, as well as one of the most athletically gifted.

Theory was stated by commentary to have been blessed with all of the tools an athlete can hope for, and is a true prodigy in the world of professional wrestling. This already shows the massive amounts of potential/skill Theory has.

Theory on his debut NXT match was able to fight on par with Roderick Strong. Strong has over 20 years of experience as a wrestler, and was nicknamed The Master of the Backbreaker, due to his ability to constantly target the opponent's back in wrestling matchups.

Theory's also able to hold his own against the likes of Aleister Black, who was trained in Pencak Silat and Kickboxing from the ages 9 to 15.

Austin Theory defeated Ricochet in only a couple of minutes. Ricochet is notorious for using his absurd levels of acrobatics and quick reflexes to defeat his opponent.

Theory was also able to give AJ Styles a good run for his money. AJ Styles is the same guy who was able to beat John Cena clean. Cena is the same guy who looked like was about to beat Brock Lesnar before getting interrupted. Brock Lesnar was an Amateur Wrestler, as well as a Mixed Martial Artist.

Theory was able to defeat Finn Balor for the United States Championship, becoming the youngest US Champion in WWE history. Now here's where I go talking about Finn Balor's skill.

Roman Reigns has fought against Brock Lesnar on numerous occasions, and has even won 2 of their battles. He's also defeated The Undertaker at Wrestlemania, becoming the 2nd person to do this. Now, let me show you some skill feats for Lesnar and Taker.

The Undertaker is considered the greatest pure striker in Sports Entertainment history. Even the likes of Kurt Angle was scared to take a punch from him.

If ya don't know Kurt Angle, he's notorious for winning a gold medal with a broken neck, who is this skilled, and was named the greatest shoot wrestler ever.

The Undertaker was undefeated at Wrestlemania for 21 straight years, so that also says alot, especially considering that Undertaker defeated some of the best in the business to keep his streak intact (Randy Orton, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, and many more).

The Undertaker also defeated Goldberg (this match was so shit, but just try to ignore that). Goldberg had a winning streak of 173-0 at one point, so even more impressive.

Finn Balor also won a triple threat between Drew McIntyre and Dolph Ziggler, pinning Ziggler.

Ziggler has a great amateur wrestling background. Ziggler set the record for most pins in St. Edward High School with 82 pins. When he was a wrestler at Kent State University, he at one point, held the record for most career wins in the team's history, earning 121 wins (the record was soon broken, but this still says a lot for how skilled Balor is).

Finn Balor also defeated Pete Dunne, who's fighting style revolves around brawling, stiff strikes, submission grappling, and bending of his opponents fingers (Small Joint Manipulation), which will leave someone extremely handicapped in a fight, especially since wrestling is all about striking, grappling and holding, and you can't do that without functioning fingers. Pete Dunne was also the same guy who was able to solo the entire Undisputed Era by himself, and the group has been regarded as one of the most dominant factions in WWE history. The group ended up winning all of the gold in NXT at one point.

To pour more salt into the wound, Andre the Giant was undefeated for 15 straight years.

Hulk Hogan was able to defeat Andre the Giant, breaking his undefeated 15 year streak.

The Undertaker was able to defeat Hulk Hogan on two different occasions.

Might I mention that The Undertaker has had wars with the likes of Brock Lesnar.

Lesnar had a record of 106-5 in his 4 years of college wrestling at the NCAA, as well as winning the NCAA Division I Heavyweight Championship.

Lesnar also had a UFC career. Lesnar also ended the iconic 21-year Wrestlemania win streak of The Undertaker.

Now, I wouldn't say that Finn is quite on this level of skill, but he was able to hold his own against Roman Reigns, who's defeated The Undertaker and Brock Lesnar, who scale to all of this, so he should at best, be comparable to it. Not exactly equal, but for sure comparable. Theory should also be comparable to this level of skill, as he defeated Balor on numerous occasions.

Now that skill is out of the way, let’s argue the advantages Theory has here and how he can utilize them.

• Social Influencing: Has goaded Pat McAfee many times into attacking him. Theory has even stated that he's getting into the head of Pat. His constant taunting in front of Dominik Mysterio caused him to win the match by disqualification. This is extremely useful here, as Theory can goad Violet into attacking him, or he can get in her head to get the upper hand. He can also most certainly convince Violet to drop her battleaxe. His Social Influencing isn't only limited to taunting the opponent. This will have a great effect on Violet, as she is notorious for being bad at speaking to people, and not really understanding human emotions, so when Theory uses it, it’s GG.
• Instinctive Reactions: Theory was powerbombed through a table, he was then able to respond to the 10 count, as well as instinctively hit a forearm strike on his opponent. Theory was able to instinctively put his foot on the rope, which was stated to be instinctive by the commentators. This will come in clutch for Mr. A-Town here. Even when it seems like Theory’s out of it, he will come back and hit you with a move you won’t see coming. He's even shown to completely no sell his opponents moves, and ends up countering it into his own move. Even stunning him won't really work.
• Versatility: Theory holds such a big advantage here it’s not even funny. Here is Theory's moveset. This helps a lot since the fight is taking place in a wrestling ring, where Theory thrives at the most. Theory has many, many ways of ending the fight. In fact, since Violet is holding a big ass battleaxe, Theory’s first thoughts are going to be “This psycho bitch has an axe. I should probably find a way to end the fight as quickly as possible.” Theory can even use the weapons under the ring to even the playing field. Stuff like steel chairs, steel ladders, tables, kendo sticks, baseball bats, literal trash cans, and much, much more. It is also going to be far more likely that Theory uses his finishing moves on Violet to end the match. Also, the argument that Theory is going to struggle disarming Violet doesn’t hold much weight for these reasons below:

1. Theory doesn’t even need to use his LS to disarm Violet. Theory has shown to disarm people with a move as simple as a superkick.
2. Theory without a doubt, can use his LS to disarm Violet. Them being “even,” doesn’t mean a thing. Theory has shown to restrain wrestlers with higher LS than him. It’s a common thing in wrestling. To elaborate, the guy Theory was restraining was Bobby Lashley, the same guy who’s shown to overpower the likes of Brock Lesnar (ignore the shitty quality), who is notorious for using his LS (which is Class 25 btw) to decimate his opponents. If Theory can restrain wrestlers with Class 25 LS, what’s to say he couldn’t disarm someone comparable to him in LS?

Austin Theory's Ataxia, ATL, and A-Town Down are all KO moves. When hit, Violet is done. You can make the argument that Violet can survive one finisher due to her Pain Tolerance, but she is by no means surviving two, and since the AP gap between the two physically is very negligible (nowhere near 2x), it's not looking good for her at all.

TL;DR: My vote is for Theory. All of the reasons I’ve shown here are more than enough proof that he can win this more often than not.

A-Town puts Violet Down! FRA

 

[RandomGuy2345]

I'm going to sleep now. I'll respond to whatever comments are made later.

 

[Bruhtelho]

Now that skill is out of the way, let’s argue the advantages Theory has here and how he can utilize them.

not replying to the massive skill chain that is always posted in WWE matches since its annoying, Violet is no slouch in Combat due to her years of fighting in the military being above anyone else who was trained just as she was even before her training in the military, she was noted to be very proficient in the use of weapons and martial arts, not saying Theory does have the Skill advantage but Violet isnt gonna fall crazily behind to the point she cant make up for it.

Social Influencing: Has goaded Pat McAfee many times into attacking him. Theory has even stated that he's getting into the head of Pat. His constant taunting in front of Dominik Mysterio caused him to win the match by disqualification. This is extremely useful here, as Theory can goad Violet into attacking him, or he can get in her head to get the upper hand. He can also most certainly convince Violet to drop her battleaxe. His Social Influencing isn't only limited to taunting the opponent. This will have a great effect on Violet, as she is notorious for being bad at speaking to people, and not really understanding human emotions, so when Theory uses it, it’s GG.

her being bad at speaking to people and not understanding human emotions could also make the Social Influencing have less effect as she could would likely not understand what hes talking about nor would she really understand how to react to something like that, and Violet also carries other weapons on her other then the Battle Axe from Knifes and if she feels threaten at close range she can easily get back and pull out one of her many guns within her arsenal

Instinctive Reactions: Theory was powerbombed through a table, he was then able to respond to the 10 count, as well as instinctively hit a forearm strike on his opponent. Theory was able to instinctively put his foot on the rope, which was stated to be instinctive by the commentators. This will come in clutch for Mr. A-Town here. Even when it seems like Theory’s out of it, he will come back and hit you with a move you won’t see coming. He's even shown to completely no sell his opponents moves, and ends up countering it into his own move. Even stunning him won't really work.

this is fair, Instinctive reaction is always useful for dodging things

Versatility: Theory holds such a big advantage here it’s not even funny. Here is Theory's moveset. This helps a lot since the fight is taking place in a wrestling ring, where Theory thrives at the most. Theory has many, many ways of ending the fight. In fact, since Violet is holding a big ass battleaxe, Theory’s first thoughts are going to be “This psycho bitch has an axe. I should probably find a way to end the fight as quickly as possible.” Theory can even use the weapons under the ring to even the playing field. Stuff like steel chairs, steel ladders, tables, kendo sticks, baseball bats, literal trash cans, and much, much more. It is also going to be far more likely that Theory uses his finishing moves on Violet to end the match. Also, the argument that Theory is going to struggle disarming Violet doesn’t hold much weight for these reasons below:

Theory versatility comes with CQC moves but Violet holds greater equipment from tons of Bladed weapons (knifes, axes, swords, etc) to longer ranged ones (pistols, revolvers, muskets, and more) her go to is Witchcraft of course but that doesn't mean she doesnt have access to other weapons since SBA states she has access to standard equipment which those are, Theory gets most of his equipment immediately destroyed due to Violets greater strength with her including Witchcraft which'll easily smash apart anything in her path

Theory doesn’t even need to use his LS to disarm Violet. Theory has shown to disarm people with a move as simple as a superkick.
Theory without a doubt, can use his LS to disarm Violet. Them being “even,” doesn’t mean a thing. Theory has shown to restrain wrestlers with higher LS than him. It’s a common thing in wrestling. To elaborate, the guy Theory was restraining was Bobby Lashley, the same guy who’s shown to overpower the likes of Brock Lesnar (ignore the shitty quality), who is notorious for using his LS (which is Class 25 btw) to decimate his opponents. If Theory can restrain wrestlers with Class 25 LS, what’s to say he couldn’t disarm someone comparable to him in LS?

first clip is that he kicked the dude and they dropped their weapon cause of the pain, which isnt happening here cause of Violets insane pain tolerance putting her far above any normal wresters I mean seriously she lost both arms and still kept pushing through it till the end like it was nothing
he can restrain wrestlers of greater strength not disarm them, they are both completely different things and with Violets greater range with her equipment it'll be difficult to get in close for long enough to actually disarm her weapon, him restraining wrestlers with Class 25 is completely different from getting into a grapple battle with them cause if he did he would 100% lose it, you also have to remember that LS doesn't change how much you actually weigh, it can make actually grappling them incredibly difficult but not impossible

Austin Theory's Ataxia, ATL, and A-Town Down are all KO moves. When hit, Violet is done. You can make the argument that Violet can survive one finisher due to her Pain Tolerance, but she is by no means surviving two, and since the AP gap between the two physically is very negligible (nowhere near 2x), it's not looking good for her at all.

TL;DR: My vote is for Theory. All of the reasons I’ve shown here are more than enough proof that he can win this more often than not.

A-Town puts Violet Down! FRA

her pain tolerance is gonna let her survive 1 at most, arguable 2 since she withstood having her arms ripped off and kept fighting despite that, lets not forget she can block his attacks with her prosthetic metal arms which are much more durable then her actual body like nothing and if she gets hit by once of those she'll isnt gonna be stupid and let it happen again after seeing that they hurt a lot more and could instinctively get back from Theory and start gun spamming for her own safety, she doesnt like killing but due to SBA they're willing to kill but are in-character

I still see Violet taking this more times then not when you really think about her she holds greater AP, insane durability alongside pain tolerance making her a incredibly hard to put down, even LS with Austin if not higher since she swings Witchcraft around like it weights absolutely nothing, greater overall equipment options like several guns, bladed weapons, and especially which could instantly end the fight if it hits Theory once since it can pierce his skin and is WAY stronger then his actual durability, and having options incase things get dangerous.

 

[Shmooply]

snip

While this is obviously a really amazing examination of Theory's history and skills, all of this is pretty pointless since Violet won't start with CQC first. The only thing worthy of note here is that he bested a guy that knows Pencak Silat, which is a martial art that actually employs weapons. However, the problem is that according to images and what I dug up, the martial art only employs blunt weapons like staves, and light sharp weapons that can be used with one hand such as kerambits and machetes, which obviously aren't comparable to a giant ****-off battleaxe. To pour even more salt on the wound, Roderick Strong never actually used any weapons against Austin in their fights.

Obviously, his skills aren't completely useless here, as he should know plenty of ways to disarm an opponent, though it'll likely be hard for him to do so on Violet considering she's wielding the giant ****-off battleaxe with a single hand, so she could still counter with her other hand.

 

[DivineAura44]

You forgot to add why Finn Balor scales to Roman...

 

[DivineAura44]

her being bad at speaking to people and not understanding human emotions could also make the Social Influencing have less effect as she could would likely not understand what hes talking about nor would she really understand how to react to something like that, and Violet also carries other weapons on her other then the Battle Axe from Knifes and if she feels threaten at close range she can easily get back and pull out one of her many guns within her arsenal

WWE wrestlers have been shown to convince others without talking.

 

[DemonicDude]

Not even a single "proper" response to Randomguys argument, Skill chain of the most if not "the most" important aspect of any Versus battle debates
A- It tells us how proper the verse is
B-It gives actual combat styles and techniques
C- it gives analysis and in depth ways to determine who has the edge is combat and what do I hear is response ? "They are annoying" oh really now
Without skill chain combat feels incomplete both directly or indirectly skill chain is response for a verse, Military training doesn't teaches you to outright caught and manuver your opponent mid air,
Saying things like "her arms ripped off and kept fighting despite that, lets not forget she can block his attacks with her prosthetic metal arms"
That's not skill that's a desperation move to block an attack and instinctively putting yourself in harm.

Nothing that random has said not even a single thing has been properly countered, Infact the whole Sword vs Axe argument was even scratched the surface, The thread itself is in complete shambles like the women's division on raw You got Austin Theory who is U.S and leagues superior to combat of people on Earth and he'd be struggling to out maneuver Violet, I'm not voting right now but so far bruh like literally try "at the very least TRY" to make a compelling argument until then it's best to wait.

 

[Shmooply]

I gave a proper response on why most of Austin's skills are pointless, though? Please list anywhere why his skills would help him be able to beat someone who's proficient in using a lengthy battleaxe. Even after he disarms her, what will he do now? Nothing's stopping her from getting her axe back, Austin doesn't know how to wield a giant battleaxe (especially the same way she does), she can still use her other weapons, nothing's stopping her from pulling out a pistol and just ending the fight right then and there since Austin would have no idea on how to deal with it. If he somehow does survive all that, Violet would still outlast him and be able to take his hits directly due to her way better stamina and the fact her prosthetics are way durable than her.

 

[Bruhtelho]

Nothing that random has said not even a single thing has been properly countered, Infact the whole Sword vs Axe argument was even scratched the surface, The thread itself is in complete shambles like the women's division on raw You got Austin Theory who is U.S and leagues superior to combat of people on Earth and he'd be struggling to out maneuver Violet, I'm not voting right now but so far bruh like literally try "at the very least TRY" to make a compelling argument until then it's best to wait.

so now you're calling me a bad debater cause I don't like massive skill listing? I was never talking about skill in ANY of my points then, my only point of skill was the very first one which wasn't even me arguing that Violet was more skilled then Theory. I don't like talking massive scaling chains cause they're annoying to me and that's my opinion, it how ever does not make me a bad debater in the slightest. all of my other points are compelling and counter certain things, not one of them went into her skill except the first one. dont start calling other peoples points "bad" when I outright stated multiple things that counter theory, just because Theory is more "skilled" does not mean he is untouchable.

 

[DemonicDude]

When did I ever call you a bad debater. How can you call someone a bad debator when the argument are yet to begin in the first place, That's why I'm not voting yet.

 

[Bruhtelho]

When did I ever call you a bad debater when how can you call someone a bad debator when the argument are even yet to begin in the first place, That's why I'm not voting yet.

"bruh like literally try "at the very least TRY" to make a compelling argument" you're telling me to "try" and make a "compelling" argument as you put it when I literally responded to all of Randoms points with certain things, it seems like your degrading my debating skills since I didnt make a "compelling" argument, I didnt respond to the massive skill listing since its not my cup of tea, simple as that.

 

[DemonicDude]

Yes when I will see a proper and compelling argument then i'll counter react to it, But there is none to begin with all that mentioned so far are feats and that goes for both sides.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Yeah i think that settled it for my side, voting Violet FRA

 

[Jackythejack]

DemonicDude I'm sorry but youre sounding like kinda pretentious rn

 

[DemonicDude]

Jacky I know it seems that way but random did made great points and half of them weren't really addressed well and we're counted with basic military skill, I'll wait for Random for now

 

[RandomGuy2345]

I'll make my refutes a bit later.

Reading some of these points is certainly something...