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Accelerator Vs. Mukuro Rokudo

I do think the best Mukuro could get is an inconclusive, but I also think his illusions can get past the vector shield in some capacity (Maybe not a win condition, but still bypass it).

Also, for what it's worth Mukuro's real body is gaurded by a few 6-C characters (Although, considering their fodder status, Accel probably one-shots)
 
And they would be able to kill him before he notices that they are attacking him?

That would also be a stomp because he would be instantly one-shot
 
No, Accel has reflected things that he hasn't noticed before they interacted with his reflection. In OT 3, one of the Sisters tried to shot him from a distance and he reflected the bullet. He can also deal with attacks in his sleep which says that him noticing an attack doesn't really matter.
 
I will keep this open until all points are answered. But I firmly believe this is a stomp as well
 
I don't think you guys actually understand what I'm saying in regards to illusions affecting Accelerator.

Not once did I say he can't reflect it because he can't see it. I was saying that in order to not be affected by it he would have to null his own senses.

And if he does that it'll be hard to fight.
 
That's not how it works, if it affects the environment it's real, if it doesn't that means it affects his brain and he control over it thanks to his ability (hell he even has sub routines even for when he is unconscious)
 
None of us, once, said it wouldn't affect him He can figure out it's an illusion through the properties of its vectors

Eventually, he finds why the thing isn't dying, finds the real body and destroys it
 
Mukuro's illusions work as a mental attack, and from what most say, Accel can not reflect mental attacks. At best Mukuro can kill Accel, in the worst case he can only incapacitate him
 
Question. Can Accelerator do intercontinental travel/range in his 7-B state? Because Mukuro's real body is in Italy, in Vindicate Prison being guarded by the Vindice. And would Mukuro's Cambio Forma be any help here in figuring out Accelerator's abilities and countering?
 
XDragnoir said:
Mukuro's illusions work as a mental attack, and from what most say, Accel can not reflect mental attacks. At best Mukuro can kill Accel, in the worst case he can only incapacitate him
Click to expand...
Depends on how we treat mental out

His illusions can't beat the choker though

@HST No but he can probably fly there, granted he wouldn't know it's there specifically
 
Mental Out is more like biological manip than mental attacks. Btw, the real body will be in the 4km max range, i think.
 
Unless the illusions can directly affect the brain, let's say like Charles Xaviar, in X-man (Marvel), then the illuisons won't work.

So does Mukuro has any feats of having directly affected the brain? Or does the brain get affected more by what they see through his illusions?
 
Wait so, Accelerator can't reflect illusions that target the brain...?...The exact kind of illusions Mukuro uses...
 
Nah he can protect him self from mental attacks, people clearing field does not work on him and 545 mind corruption dies not work

Especially he has 2 layer of defence vs mental attack, the reflection barrier and his control over his how brain and body in general thanks to vector control (even in the last chap of the manga he got hit by a gas weapon when his choker was off and he just activated it and removed the substance instantly)
 
Schnee One said:
XDragnoir said:
Mukuro's illusions work as a mental attack, and from what most say, Accel can not reflect mental attacks. At best Mukuro can kill Accel, in the worst case he can only incapacitate him
Click to expand...
Depends on how we treat mental out
His illusions can't beat the choker though

@HST No but he can probably fly there, granted he wouldn't know it's there specifically
Click to expand...
>Pre headshot accel being used according to OP

>Choker

Huh?
 
Mukuro's illusions are based on perception manip, so yes, they affect the brain, specifically the five senses, both directly and indirectly.
 
XDragnoir said:
Mukuro's illusions work as a mental attack, and from what most say, Accel can not reflect mental attacks. At best Mukuro can kill Accel, in the worst case he can only incapacitate him
Click to expand...
He was unaffected by Qliphah's madness, which is a mental attack. So, yeah he can reflect or at least resist mental attacks otherwise he would have been affected by Qliphah's madness.
 
XDragnoir said:
Mukuro's illusions are based on perception manip, so yes, they affect the brain, specifically the five senses, both directly and indirectly.
Click to expand...
The thing is what illusion could affect Accel? This is pre-headshot Accel so using the Sisters won't work at this point and Accel isn't the type of guy to fear things. There's not really any illusions that would affect Accel.

Now if this was Post headshot then that's a different story since you can use the illusions of the Sisters. But that could go against Mukuro as Accel's black wings could be unleashed rather than him having a mental block like he did in NT 6.
 
This leads to the second problem, the indirect illusions of Mukuro, such as creating lava, are not physical, so reflecting is impossible, but in Reborn indirect illusions only work if the target believes them to be real, and Accel does not care if he is surrounded by lava, so the illusion should not work, but if he thinks the lava is real then it will work.
 
^True.

Indirect illusions to Accel might serve to throw him off, but I doubt he'd be seriously hurt.

Anyway, what's Accelerator's win condition here? I don't think he'd be able to find Mukuro's real body in a reasonable amount of time.
 
Pre-headshot Accel can even sleep in the mid of a fight and will not die, time is not a problem, and Mukuro's real body should be in the 4km max start range, he is a fighter after all.
 
XDragnoir said:
This leads to the second problem, the indirect illusions of Mukuro, such as creating lava, are not physical, so reflecting is impossible, but in Reborn indirect illusions only work if the target believes them to be real, and Accel does not care if he is surrounded by lava, so the illusion should not work, but if he thinks the lava is real then it will work.
Click to expand...
Accel has control over his body he can check scan and modify as he wants if something is affecting him he can just override it with his powers

Btw to anyone that pointed out xeviar, isn't his power signal based and that's why the helmet blocks it ? That should be reflected
 
XDragnoir said:
Pre-headshot Accel can even sleep in the mid of a fight and will not die, time is not a problem, and Mukuro's real body should be in the 4km max start range, he is a fighter after all.
Click to expand...
What?
 
@XDragnoir

Time in reference to SBA, iirc once the battle goes on for a certain amount of time...it's ruled to be inconclusive...,actuallly I'm not sure on that.

Also...I don't think that's how range rules work here, the actual fighter fighting would be an illusion which would start within 4km; but Mukuro's real body doesn't have to be within 4km because it's not the one actually fighting.

It's like saying that a character with type 8 immortality reliant on an object must have the object within 4km.
 
no he is not reliant on the objects he creates illusions, in this case is like saying a mage does not have to fight the fireball does it for him
 
Malox1696 said:
no he is not reliant on the objects he creates illusions, in this case is like saying a mage does not have to fight the fireball does it for him
Click to expand...
I'm confusion.
 
YungManzi said:
I'm confusion.
Click to expand...
is the illusion him or does he create illusions, is the illusion like a clone that think for itself or just like a golem ?

it's like saying a summoner should be outside of the battle
 
From a quick read it seems like 7B Accelerator won't be able to do much if he doesn't know where the mortal body is, and can't really win by definition. Also Espers cannot fight indefinitely, even pre-headshot Accelerator would have some limit before, if under constant attack (I'm assuming this is pre-Angelic version), he would get worn down (especially if he's actually trying to fight back).

He would win easily if he knew about the body and where the prison was, all of the abilities that would let him do that are however something he only worked out/got help learning around NT21. And mindlessly cracking the planet wouldn't really do him much good. And early Accelerator wouldn't really have much idea of what was even going on considering it's magic based.

It's either a stalemate if both need time to recover or a loss for Accelerator if Mukuro can keep fighting without needing to take breaks and without actually sufferring from fatigue or draining some resource that needs time to regenerate (like mana). I don't know if that is the case or not.

I think the only version of Accelerator that could beat him is, unfortunately, the absurdly powerful one, which is definitely not his early version.
 
@Notstn

Mukuro has no way to bypass reflection so Accel doesn't even need to fight because he would just let his reflection do the work.
 
Scrlk666777 said:
@Notstn
Mukuro has no way to bypass reflection so Accel doesn't even need to fight because he would just let his reflection do the work.
Click to expand...
If Accelerator passes out from fatigue, it should be possible to suffocate him, I think there are other options as well since he won't be able to reactively alter how his shield operates while passed out. Unless he decides to flee and hide before passing out which for all intents and purposes counts as a loss for him. With angelic forms that's when his "failsafe" would kick in, but since he didn't have it at that point in LNs, it's possible that he would just die.
 
He doesn't need to alter his shield. There is nothing that Mukuro could do that would bypass reflection. It doesn't matter if Accel is passed out, awake, asleep he will reflect whatever Mukuro throws at him.

There is literally nothing that Mukuro can really do to Accel.
 
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