Combat intelligence statistics and optional continuity sections in verse pages

[Antvasima]

Hello everybody.

Two community announcements here, one very late, and the other one new:

Our character intelligence sections should no longer mention specific combat skill intelligence statistics, just explain how accomplished a character is in this area, as previously in this regard.

So if, for example, a character currently has the following text in their page: "Genius in combat (Astoundingly skilled. Can defeat 10 opponents of similar physical capacity at the same time.)", it should simply be changed to: "Astoundingly skilled in combat. Can defeat 10 opponents of similar physical capacity at the same time."

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Intelligence?diff=9003472&oldid=8891109

https://vsbattles.com/threads/establishing-combat-skill-requirements.171982/

Also, you can now add optional (well-structured, accurate, and preferably well-referenced) canon/continuity sections to our verse pages if you wish and it is warranted:

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Standard_Format_for_Verse_Pages?diff=9308004&oldid=9308000

https://vsbattles.com/threads/continuity-section-for-verse-pages.165656/

 

[MSahla]

Ask, What about the profiles that already have combat intelligence statistics? Should they be changed or left alone because its already too late.

 

[Dalesean027]

Ask, What about the profiles that already have combat intelligence statistics? Should they be changed or left alone because its already too late.

Changed to fit new standards if possible

 

[DavidTPPM]

I have a small question.

I get combat skill like "is a master of all martial arts" or "can beat 10 people with equal stats" but what about analytical feats that should logically extend to general intelligence? For example if a character can decipher and understand extremely complex abilities after a single glance would that no longer belong in the intelligence section?

Because technically it's combat related skill/IQ but I feel like it should also just apply to general intelligence. So would these still belong to the intelligence section or is it strictly only for non-combat related IQ?

 

[Eficiente]

When I think of combat intelligence statistics in our wiki, I can only think of profiles that misrepresent those stats. Even if the reason to remove those has nothing to do with that, it's interesting to see that being removed. I was already not listing combat intelligence statistics anyway, leaving the feats do all the talk.

 

[Dalesean027]

I have a small question.

I get combat skill like "is a master of all martial arts" or "can beat 10 people with equal stats" but what about analytical feats that should logically extend to general intelligence? For example if a character can decipher and understand extremely complex abilities after a single glance would that no longer belong in the intelligence section?

Because technically it's combat related skill/IQ but I feel like it should also just apply to general intelligence. So would these still belong to the intelligence section or is it strictly only for non-combat related IQ?

that's listed on the changes for the intelligence page

General intelligence CAN be influenced by combat intelligence so like strategy, planning, etc. do double as general intelligence since it does require some level of smarts to do any of that.

"These factors can also influence a character's general intelligence rating. For example, skills like strategy, rapid learning or the ability to predict an opponent's moves could contribute to a high intelligence rating. However, for many characters, it's useful to separate combat skill from general intelligence. This distinction is particularly important when a character is highly skilled in combat but lacks academic or intellectual prowess."

so some can be used for general intelligence, Like you need to have combat skill in its own section that doesn't get its own named intelligence rating but that said general intelligence can be influenced by combat stuff but that's mostly just in regards to skills like strategy, rapid learning or the ability to predict an opponent's moves from sheer intelligence but otherwise those are like the exceptions otherwise most everything else would need to get relegated to a skillbox or separate section like in the above example

 

[Dalesean027]

So in the case of your example that first bit its just skill but like the latter half is general intelligence

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

if someone's rated "dumb normally, supergenius in x" would they be changed to supergenius outright? you did put the genius in combat under quotations and didnt add it in the new line

 

[Dalesean027]

if someone's rated "dumb normally, supergenius in x" would they be changed to supergenius outright? you did put the genius in combat under quotations and didnt add it in the new line

Be more specifc and no? Ifs its combat it doesn't get rated at all in this new style it would just be put in its own feat section for combat intelligence

 

[Antvasima]

Only combat intelligence statistics such as "Gifted", "Genius", "Extraordinary Genius", etc. should be removed, not the descriptions that used to justify them.

 

[Antvasima]

Also, thank you for helping out here, Dalesean.

 

[Dalesean027]

Also, thank you for helping out here, Dalesean.

No problem

 

[First_Witch]

I have a small question.

I get combat skill like "is a master of all martial arts" or "can beat 10 people with equal stats" but what about analytical feats that should logically extend to general intelligence? For example if a character can decipher and understand extremely complex abilities after a single glance would that no longer belong in the intelligence section?

Because technically it's combat related skill/IQ but I feel like it should also just apply to general intelligence. So would these still belong to the intelligence section or is it strictly only for non-combat related IQ?

Combat applicable intelligence feats are intelligence feats whose existence usually do not automatically result in a skill feat but have been demonstrated in combat, making them therefor a skill feat. I.e knowing human anatomy very well would be undoubtedly a intelligence feat, but not a skill feat unless said knowledge has been applied mid combat. Vice versa, a skill feat should not be applied to raw intelligence unless said feat has been demonstrated in a non combat way, i.e analyzing the body language of your opponent to predict their attacks can be a intelligence feat if it was used in intelligence "measurable" way, such as using said analytical capability to manipulate opponents better or to analyze the performance of a car for example and be able to make engineering adjustments based on that.

I see no issue with listing them in both sections if similar examples occur.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Be more specifc and no? Ifs its combat it doesn't get rated at all in this new style it would just be put in its own feat section for combat intelligence

let's say there is a characters who's normally dumb, his school grades are ass and he's considered very stupid but his combat intelligence are incredibly high and tiered separately from his normal intelligence, how would we change that?

 

[Dalesean027]

let's say there is a characters who's normally dumb, his school grades are ass and he's considered very stupid but his combat intelligence are incredibly high and tiered separately from his normal intelligence, how would we change that?

As said you would just list those feats separately from regular intelligence and it simply would not have any named tier, basically just put in its own skill section

 

[First_Witch]

let's say there is a characters who's normally dumb, his school grades are ass and he's considered very stupid but his combat intelligence are incredibly high and tiered separately from his normal intelligence, how would we change that?

If his general intelligence rating was high due to combat skill then he would need to be adjusted down based on his demonstrated intelligence.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

If his general intelligence rating was high due to combat skill then he would need to be adjusted down based on his demonstrated intelligence.

Dale already answered for me but this is what I meant

 

[MSahla]

Only combat intelligence statistics such as "Gifted", "Genius", "Extraordinary Genius", etc. should be removed, not the descriptions that used to justify them.

Ahh i did not know that, i already removed the descriptions too
Sadge

 

[thetechmaster36]

Do we have any written examples for how the Canon/Continuity section for verse pages could be formatted? I get that this is something that was just introduced, but having a catch-all example to give other users a blueprint would be very helpful, especially for verses with huge pools of content - canon or otherwise - that would require a lot of explanation for a regular passerby to understand.

 

[Dalesean027]

Do we have any written examples for how the Canon/Continuity section for verse pages could be formatted? I get that this is something that was just introduced, but having a catch-all example to give other users a blueprint would be very helpful, especially for verses with huge pools of content - canon or otherwise - that would require a lot of explanation for a regular passerby to understand.

Are you putting skill sections on the verse page of series you work on? Bit confused by this because thats not normal practice to do

 

[First_Witch]

Are you putting skill sections on the verse page of series you work on? Bit confused by this because thats not normal practice to do

D-dale, this announcement is also for a canoncity sections on verse pages, not just skill

 

[Dalesean027]

D-dale, this announcement is also for a canoncity sections on verse pages, not just skill

Yeah I'll be real my brain only saw the skill side of this

 

[Arkenis]

Something like this is fine? Just two tabs?

Alita (Pre-Last Order)

Alita, known in Japan as Gally (ガリィ Garī) and originally named Yoko (陽子 Yōko), is the titular protagonist of Battle Angel Alita and its sequel, Battle Angel Alita: Last Order. She is known for her prowess as a practitioner of the powerful cyborgmartial art Panzer Kunst. Alita's background and...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Arkenis]

Here too I think this is what you guys are referring to for skill in the verse page?

 

[Antvasima]

Something like this is fine? Just two tabs?

Alita (Pre-Last Order)

Alita, known in Japan as Gally (ガリィ Garī) and originally named Yoko (陽子 Yōko), is the titular protagonist of Battle Angel Alita and its sequel, Battle Angel Alita: Last Order. She is known for her prowess as a practitioner of the powerful cyborgmartial art Panzer Kunst. Alita's background and...

vsbattles.fandom.com

I think so, yes.

 

[AthelChan]

How about player insert characters like most of the Roblox profiles? Do I just assume its the peak player at their skill?

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

if someone's rated "dumb normally, supergenius in x" would they be changed to supergenius outright? you did put the genius in combat under quotations and didnt add it in the new line

The only rating would be higher in combat. We do not use Gifted, Genius, ect for combat intelligence anymore. But we simply add descriptions for defining their combat intelligence whether it be "Years of experience in the military" or "Mastered many different forms of martial arts", or even "Being exceptionally street smart and thinks outside the box during combat" can work as things to add to paragraph. Certain powers that make them grand masters of combat such as having the ability to sense + manipulate Ki that enables them to adapt to nearly any fighting style.

 

[Lilybitdun]

Wouldn't listing intelligence as like "Below Average Human normally, higher in combat" make it sound it like their combat skills are still in that Below Average Human level? That feels like a confusing way to word that

 

[Antvasima]

@DontTalkDT

Your input may be needed here, given that it was largely your intelligence section revision, if I remember correctly.

 

[Dalesean027]

Wouldn't listing intelligence as like "Below Average Human normally, higher in combat" make it sound it like their combat skills are still in that Below Average Human level? That feels like a confusing way to word that

There is no such thing as combat skill intelligence ratings now? You'd list the skill feats separately from regular intelligence and they wouldn't have a named rating so in this case it'd iust be below average intelligence and that's it

 

[Lilybitdun]

There is no such thing as combat skill intelligence ratings now? You'd list the skill feats separately from regular intelligence and they wouldn't have a named rating so in this case it'd iust be below average intelligence and that's it

I don't think you got what I was trying to say

I know there isn't combat skill intelligence ratings now, what I'm saying is that a casual person that sees "Below Average Human intelligence, higher in combat" would see that as "oh this character is also below average human in combat, damn they must suck at fighting". Most people who go check profiles aren't gonna know about the combat skill intelligence removal

Listing it as higher would just lead to confusion, I feel like the suggestion of just having a skill tabber is better

 

[Arkenis]

I don't think you got what I was trying to say

I know there isn't combat skill intelligence ratings now, what I'm saying is that a casual person that sees "Below Average Human intelligence, higher in combat" would see that as "oh this character is also below average human in combat, damn they must suck at fighting". Most people who go check profiles aren't gonna know about the combat skill intelligence removal

Listing it as higher would just lead to confusion, I feel like the suggestion of just having a skill tabber is better

That person wouldn't be very smart since all they'd need to do is read the contents of the section and conclude the below average has no connection. Also we've always been able to put tabs for intell.

 

[Dalesean027]

I know there isn't combat skill intelligence ratings now, what I'm saying is that a casual person that sees "Below Average Human intelligence, higher in combat" would see that as "oh this character is also below average human in combat, damn they must suck at fighting". Most people who go check profiles aren't gonna know about the combat skill intelligence removal

Im sorry but I have no idea what it is you're talking about here? Mind elaborating?

Listing it as higher would just lead to confusion, I feel like the suggestion of just having a skill tabber is better

Why would you list it as higher? There is no combat intelligence rating, there is nothing to list higher for and in the changes we have already given an example of a tabber and bulleted style of the changes so not sure where the confusion is coming in at for you

Peacemaker (DC Universe)

Christopher Clyde "Chris" Smith is a violent vigilante and a founding member of the 11th Street Kids who earned the name Peacemaker by previously vowing to achieve peace at any cost, no matter how many people he has to kill in the process, swearing a vow to do so after accidentally causing the...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Samus Aran (Zero Mission)

After being orphaned by a Space Pirate attack on her homeworld of K-2L, Samus Aran was adopted by the Chozo and raised to be a peerless warrior , given their technology and infused with their DNA, and raised to be a peerless warrior. After some time spent serving with the Galactic Federation...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Lilybitdun]

We already do higher to just mean higher into that level for every other stat (Wall level, higher with weapon means the weapon is higher into wall level)

Most people would read it as higher in their intelligence rating level

Why would you list it as higher? There is no combat intelligence rating, there is nothing to list higher for and in the changes we have already given an example of a tabber and bulleted style of the changes so not sure where the confusion is coming in at for you

DDM literally just brought up listing it as "higher in combat". It's the og thing I replied to man

The only rating would be higher in combat. We do not use Gifted, Genius, ect for combat intelligence anymore. But we simply add descriptions for defining their combat intelligence whether it be "Years of experience in the military" or "Mastered many different forms of martial arts", or even "Being exceptionally street smart and thinks outside the box during combat" can work as things to add to paragraph. Certain powers that make them grand masters of combat such as having the ability to sense + manipulate Ki that enables them to adapt to nearly any fighting style.

 

[Antvasima]

I don't think you got what I was trying to say

I know there isn't combat skill intelligence ratings now, what I'm saying is that a casual person that sees "Below Average Human intelligence, higher in combat" would see that as "oh this character is also below average human in combat, damn they must suck at fighting". Most people who go check profiles aren't gonna know about the combat skill intelligence removal

Listing it as higher would just lead to confusion, I feel like the suggestion of just having a skill tabber is better

I also do not think that we should make any mentions of "higher in combat", but rather just explain combat skills separately, and incorporate strategic thinking and similar into regular intelligence.

 

[Dalesean027]

DDM literally just brought up listing it as "higher in combat". It's the og thing I replied to man

You didn't do it as a reply in your original comment you just sent it without quoting anything but that's fine

DDM literally just brought up listing it as "higher in combat". It's the og thing I replied to man

Well you wouldn't do this so I'd imagine he just misspoke but regardless we've consistently been saying otherwise that there is no rating at all for combat/skill sections so that would include "higher" it just simply doesn't exist for it anymore

 

[Lilybitdun]

How do we make sure mobile users get across that the intelligence rating and combat skills are different since tabbers only appear on desktop?

 

[Dalesean027]

How do we make sure mobile users get across that the intelligence rating and combat skills are different since tabbers only appear on desktop?

Tabbers appear on mobile for me and the only time they wouldn't is if you aren't viewing the full site but regardless as the example from above also showed you can opt for a bulleted kind of format for it as well

Samus Aran (Zero Mission)

After being orphaned by a Space Pirate attack on her homeworld of K-2L, Samus Aran was adopted by the Chozo and raised to be a peerless warrior , given their technology and infused with their DNA, and raised to be a peerless warrior. After some time spent serving with the Galactic Federation...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Antvasima]

I have lobbied for years regarding that Fandom needs to fix their tabber display problem in mobile viewing, and the most recent time I did so, I was at least told that they would prioritise the issue.

 

[Lilybitdun]

Tabbers appear on mobile for me and the only time they wouldn't is if you aren't viewing the full site but regardless as the example from above also showed you can opt for a bulleted kind of format for it as well

Samus Aran (Zero Mission)

After being orphaned by a Space Pirate attack on her homeworld of K-2L, Samus Aran was adopted by the Chozo and raised to be a peerless warrior , given their technology and infused with their DNA, and raised to be a peerless warrior. After some time spent serving with the Galactic Federation...

vsbattles.fandom.com

I have lobbied for years regarding that Fandom needs to fix their tabber display problem in mobile viewing, and the most recent time I did so, I was at least told that they would prioritise the issue.

Yeah I went to check on my phone and it still doesn't display tabbers properly. Idk if it depends on the device

Hopefully it's something they can eventually fully solve