• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

(GRACE) Adding Pokemon Masters to the canon

Status
Not open for further replies.
Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera said:
Literally all you're saying is that it's noncanon so it doesn't deserve to be on mainline profiles, while ignoring any proof that it is and hoping that you've spammed enough to finally break through my defenses and any ability to fend you off.
Click to expand...
Can you please quote your proof? That'd make evaluation easier.
 
DaReaperMan said:
Even if he agreed it'd be 3-1 favoring separate profiles when it comes to staff votes.
Click to expand...
You mean 2-1. And 3 agree with the original CRT, they just also agree that many Masters profiles should be separate, which while some characters in Masters are a perfect final outcome of their ordinary selves, some are just, like, some guy, so they would deserve separate profiles until further material is added.
 
Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera said:
He's going to.
Click to expand...
Eventually, but not yet.
Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera said:
I was talking about my CRT, not the infection that Jinx666 tacked on.
Click to expand...
Frieza_I%27ll_Ignore_That_Banner.jpg
 
OrangeFR said:
Nintendo has a really good track record of completely ******* the timeline and canon of their top franchises
Click to expand...
Its honestly not so bad if we all knew and agreed to stick within the given timelines/canons instead of compositing outright. Then we only have to deal with the inconsistencies presented within their respective timelines and not have to dwell on something from a completely separate branch of content dwelling on another
 
Jinx666 said:
Its honestly not so bad if we all knew and agreed to stick within the given timelines/canons instead of compositing outright. Then we only have to deal with the inconsistencies presented within their respective timelines and not have to dwell on something from a completely separate branch of content dwelling on another
Click to expand...
Yes, yes, we all know how much you hate "compositing".
 
Please dont start on me again Sean.

The wiki as a whole doesn't composite for profiles.
 
@Imaginym Not to rush you or anything, take your time, but your verdict on this CRT may quite honestly affect the scaling and fate of the entire verse, so it would be good to hear an answer sooner rather than later.
 
Imaginym said:
My initial & current -However tentative that may be- impression is that this standpoint seems reasonable to uphold.

Worst comes to worst, points of contention can be gone over case by case, as seems to be par for the course.

No offense meant, all.
Click to expand...
Having now checked the linked evidence provided in the opening post of this thread, I reiterate this stance, which was established June 21st, 2025, a time prior to my becoming a Thread Moderator, to clarify that I find it is reasonable, with the further clarification however that:
I find myself in agreement with the sentiments established in this post:
FinePoint said:
I'll elaborate, since I feel like my opinion can't really be easily summarized as "agree or disagrees".

Proposals I think would be unreasonable: Declaring it entirely non-canon and not using it at all.

Proposals I think would be reasonable: Secondary canon, new keys, new profiles, some combination of the previous three.

Proposal which I personally prefer: New profiles.
Click to expand...
DarkDragonMedeus said:
This looks alright to me.
Click to expand...
Based on this, DDM also agreed with it.

As may likely be evident, my preference (& assuming their stance(s) haven't changed since August 1st & 2nd, 2025, the same is true for FinePoint & DarkDragonMedeus) is new profiles to be created, presumably for Masters EX content.
Treating them as Secondary Canon, with New Keys in addition to New Profiles &/or "some combination of the previous three", is also deemed reasonable; Presumably, the option of just "New Profiles" or the 3 as a whole or in some combination is to be determined based on a majority, & the majority will determine which precludes the other.
Should neither have the majority, then it would default to the just New profiles option.

@FinePoint @DarkDragonMedeus : Forgive me please for @-ing you, but given the amount of time passed & how impactful your clarifications of how you are voting here could be important, I would like you two to clarify, please:

Do you have any preference between:
A. Secondary canon, new keys, new profiles, some combination of the previous three.
OR
B. New profiles.

It is my understanding of the establishment of this stance by FinePoint's wording that should no preference for either of those two be distinguished, then preference should default to Option B, "New profiles".



BTW, if my saying so can be pardoned, please @Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera , @Jinx666 : You two often seem at odds & at an impasse with one another. While bumping a thread at a reasonable rate is fine, if you two don't have new content to contribute to a debate & your debate is primarily, if not specifically one another whom you know is likely to disagree with you, then try to avoid doing so, or at the very least, attempt to be polite.
 
Last edited:
Masters EX rolls with its own interpretations and takes, as well as crosses over these characters nonsensically (for the sake of a gacha game concept, which is fine in itself but it shouldn't be used as Pazdera is trying to do, in overriding and 'retconning' the mainline in order to make it take dominance). Theres an effort to explain using Hoopa portals, but even then that just creates more confirmed alternative characters that cant be lumped in with the mainline version fully. Masters EX still being ongoing and prone to any wild change off the bat, too its just better to put these versions of the characters in separate profiles as opposed to compositing.

This way, you get undisturbed profiles that can accomodate the crazy scaling implications for a crossover game, while also not having it interfere with the general state of the mainline. The only point in the OP that regards directly to Masters EX being canon is the fact that its writers make an attempt to write them in-character (as you'd expect), but theres otherwise no proof events and happenings in Pasio are in the same mainline as the standard games (especially when they contradict). The implications of making Masters EX secondary canon is just too unpredictable and inconsistent too, and adds far more workload no one is prepared to suitably deal with for something that will always be controversial. Its fine to use Masters EX for like, an extension of character i guess, but itas also worth mentioning that Masters EX entire battle system is different with completely new moves and abilities that arent referred to or accomodated in the mainline

Hence, if Pazdera wants to include Masters EX content, it is just far better as a whole to make them separate profiles. They still get all the implications of the mainline games they belong to, but without the need to try and retcon mainline in order to make it work.
 
Imaginym literally just told you to stop doing this. Besides, I know exactly what you're doing; you're hoping that the incoming mods that see this will take your side, despite the literal lies you continue to tell which I've debunked over and over and over again for 5 pages.
Jinx666 said:
Masters EX rolls with its own interpretations and takes, as well as crosses over these characters nonsensically (for the sake of a gacha game concept, which is fine in itself but it shouldn't be used as Pazdera is trying to do, in overriding and 'retconning' the mainline in order to make it take dominance).
Click to expand...
Masters doesn't do this nearly to the degree that you say it does, pretty much the only time they did this was making Leon still be unbeaten, and not only was that early in Masters' creation, if they didn't do that, you wouldn't even know about it to begin with.
Jinx666 said:
Theres an effort to explain using Hoopa portals, but even then that just creates more confirmed alternative characters that cant be lumped in with the mainline version fully. Masters EX still being ongoing and prone to any wild change off the bat, too its just better to put these versions of the characters in separate profiles as opposed to compositing.
Click to expand...
Why would Florian be lumped into the same profile as Juliana('s eventual profile), especially since he's treated as completely differently even in Masters itself? Marvel and DC Comics is also ongoing and even more prone to any wild change off the bat. Pretty much every gacha game we have on this site is still ongoing (except the Digimon ones) and nobody protests the gathering of their feats.
Jinx666 said:
This way, you get undisturbed profiles that can accomodate the crazy scaling implications for a crossover game, while also not having it interfere with the general state of the mainline.
Click to expand...
"Mainline" does this already. Wally from ORAS and Colress from BW are 2-A because of the Battle Tree, pretty much everyone in HGSS is 2-A because of Platinum's Battle Frontier, basically everyone in SwSh is 2-A because they scale to the Rental Pokemon in Dynamax Adventures somehow- hell, Daybreak Rei is Low 1-C due to straight up beating Arceus and was actually depowered when he went to Masters. Crazy crossover scaling has always been in Pokemon; It's not a Masters problem.
Jinx666 said:
The only point in the OP that regards directly to Masters EX being canon is the fact that its writers make an attempt to write them in-character (as you'd expect), but theres otherwise no proof events and happenings in Pasio are in the same mainline as the standard games (especially when they contradict).
Click to expand...
That is... one small part of one single piece of evidence that I listed. Why are you so focused on that bit when you haven't even debunked the other 3, or even the rest of the scan that you're talking about?
Jinx666 said:
The implications of making Masters EX secondary canon is just too unpredictable and inconsistent too, and adds far more workload no one is prepared to suitably deal with for something that will always be controversial.
Click to expand...
No, it doesn't. In fact it would make it very simple: It's basically canon but contradictions are ignored. Just in case you were talking about the amount of feats in the game, it's a good thing I've been collecting feats from it for years. And even then that doesn't mean it should be ignored
Jinx666 said:
Its fine to use Masters EX for like, an extension of character i guess, but itas also worth mentioning that Masters EX entire battle system is different with completely new moves and abilities that arent referred to or accomodated in the mainline
Click to expand...
Masters' battle system is basically just Triple Battles with Z-Moves. See the first question in the FAQs.
Jinx666 said:
Hence, if Pazdera wants to include Masters EX content, it is just far better as a whole to make them separate profiles. They still get all the implications of the mainline games they belong to, but without the need to try and retcon mainline in order to make it work.
Click to expand...
Even if you were right about everything, you're not but if you were, many characters in Masters are treated as the perfect natural conclusion of their game selves rather than some blank slate with a name and a Pokemon. For many of them, making separate profiles would be a needless distinction.

That being said, there are original characters made by and for Masters, so they would actually get original profiles.
 
Last edited:
Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera said:
Imaginym literally just told you to stop doing this. Besides, I know exactly what you're doing; you're hoping that the incoming mods that see this will take your side, despite the literal lies you continue to tell which I've debunked over and over and over again for 5 pages.
Click to expand...
I was giving a TLDR of the overall stance, it wasn't to get into another argument with you. Which im not going to be doing so i wont be reading the rest of your post.

When theres two more options being given out by the Imaginym guy, then its worth reiterating briefly why its better to make separate profiles for Masters EX content. Thats perfectly reasonable to do
 
Last edited:
Jinx666 said:
I was giving a TLDR of the overall stance, it wasn't to get into another argument with you. Which im not going to be doing so i wont be reading the rest of your post.
Click to expand...
"I just wanted to come in and lie, so I'm going to ignore your entire argument against mine." Holy shit that's so ******* evil. Pokemon is way bigger than you can imagine and it's definitely not your personal playground. It wasn't even the overall stance, it was actual lies that you made up and no one is falling for. The literal only thing that anyone even remotely agrees with you on is the possibility of having separate profiles, which, by the way, you also lied about the validity and necessity of.
Jinx666 said:
When theres two more options being given out by the Imaginym guy, then its worth reiterating briefly why its better to make separate profiles for Masters EX content. Thats perfectly reasonable to do
Click to expand...
That's why you need to read my arguments, Jinx. And I thought you just said it was a TDLR of the overall stance. What you used it as is an opportunity to spit up all your talking points against me, against Pokemon, and against Masters, of which you have zero proof of and which ignores the entirety of both my arguments and the original post.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Jinx666
[STAFF INPUT PLEASE] Changing Pokemon 'Protagonist' pages
7 8 9
Replies
325
Views
20K
Jinx666
Jinx666
Pokemon verse page "Pokémon (by Species)" tabber separation
2
Replies
48
Views
2K
User_A_98732165489
Arceus0x
  • Locked
Pokemon: Infinity and gimmicks
2
Replies
63
Views
4K
Arceus0x
Arceus0x
ProfessorKukui4Life
Pokemon: Mew (And others) Upgrade
Replies
8
Views
1K
Mbpoops
Mbpoops
Human-to-Pokemon Powerscaling (Weaponry in Pokemon World, more correct this time)
2 3 4
Replies
159
Views
8K
User_A_98732165489
Back
Top