Alr. I'm back.
I believe that OP and the agreeing party are both oversimplifying and misunderstanding the argument used to dictate that the Game Files encompass also concepts alongside information and plot.
NEP 2 is a whole other can of worms that deserves its own topic however.
This is a very lazy and overly specific rebuttal, ngl.
You do not have to namedrop "concept" in order to qualify as such, as the basis of
Conceptual Manipulation is basically to be some kind of abstract and non-physical essence which determines everything in reality, and you alter said essence, then the corresponding objects that are part of it are also affected in the same way (also because things like Dreams in Chrono/Sonic or the Heart in Kingdom Hearts, do not namedrop it either, .
Not only this was brought up in
the CRT that introduced it, but OP acts as if it's impossible for an abstract substance to be both Concept and Information at the same time, when it just isn't true (see Information Particles in Tensura). In fact, Files in DDLC do things that fit Concept more than only Information (which is just the fundamental data that makes up the, yk, information of the universe):
- The plot being one of said files: I have genuinely no idea what else could Plot be in this context. It's pretty much an abstract force that determines in a metafictional way all the events and rules of the setting it rules over, I do not think it cannot be described as anything but Abstract, because what else could it be? Given that the files of DDLC make up everything in reality (given they're what the DDLC universe is built upon), including abstract stuff like plot, I do think that files in themselves being an abstract thing which aren't just physical information is a warranted. Then, if for the Wiki's current standards this alone isn't enough to qualify, then is whatever.
- The effects of the deletion of the characters. This also was brought up in both the 2022 CRT and the blog that explores in depth said reasoning. Reading it fully is reccomended (especially given OP seems to have totally skipped it), but, to keep stuff relevant and without any fluff, the things showing that altering a file alters everything related to said file instead of just the object in itself is the following:
- Sayori: Prior to her deletion after her suicide, the game went normal with no errors, the main menu showed her sprite with no issue, and she was the Vice-President of the Literature Club. But after her deletion, the menu couldn't properly load her sprite anymore, and attempting to even mentioning her name will cause said name to be replaced from a bunch of nonsense before totally glitching and crashing, causing it to reboot. And after said reboot, Sayori just stops existing entirely from reality itself, to the point that MC never mentioned her despite being his childhood friend, Yuri is the Vice-President and the Literature Club never had 4 members prior to MC's arrival.
- Yuri and Natsuki: After Yuri also committing self-death, Monika deletes her file, and also Natsuki's, which causes also the latter's cupcakes to disappear with the narrator being unable to read her name either, which supports the notion of affecting the file affecting also everything related to said file.
- Monika: Nuking her file causes her sprite to become a glitched mess and her name cannot be read anymore, disappears entirely from the menu, and she stops to be a thing in the story entirely, as Sayori always was the Club's president in her place.
Now, I am not completely familar with the standards about Fundamental Aspects (they tend to become a bunch of wordsalads which need to be watered down most of the time to get), but can Information in itself affect everything related to the object instead of
just the object? I mean, just look at the justifications for Type 1 and 2:
Type 2 Information instead... does not say as much.
It only mentions that it's the fundamental blocks of reality akin to code in a simulation, but we see in DDLC it does more than that, as deleting a file literally forces the universe to retcon itself to not make said character a thing anymore. I personally do not think what I linked above can be explained with just Information Manipulation, as Concept is the fundamental idea of something, and altering said idea alters everything related to said idea.
I do agree that the current explanation on the profile is kinda eh, but I think we can work for a better wording which would make the message clear, prolly the Blog won't even be needed anymore, who knows.
About NEP 2, I personally began to have my doubts more due to "created and destroyed" being taken way too literally. It's mostly likely reffering to just Monika (hehe) retconning the universe like it happened Act 2, 3 and 4. Obviously the old universe won't exist anymore if the new one retcons it and takes its place, as prior the mail mentions that "
Is it part of the butterfly effect from some of Monika's fundamental changes, or is it a result of her just messing around with the other characters in VM1 as her own experiment (or for fun)?", rather than some DBZ-like destruction, which kinda shoots down the basis of the files being independent from the universe they govern and encompassing the void left.
This also probably nukes CM 1 and makes it back to 2, and I personally don't really care about that. But as I said above, Concept imo should remain, whether is Type 1 or 2.
Edit: If this goes through, OP should also downgrade
Imscared to be coherent, as its basis for Type 2 CM is the exact same as DDLC's. Back in the 1st upgrade thread Roachman (the guy who added said ability), agreed with DDLC also qualifying given the similarity of the argument, so if one goes, both should because of fairness.
