Georredannea15
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Well, i guess such lower-dimensional beings can move in higher-dimensional spaces, but they cannot move along all the axes of these higher-dimensional space.
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The commoners thread: Discussing Ultima's "On the Many, Many Incoherences of the Tiering System"
- Thread starter Iamunanimousinthat
- Start date
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Yeah at this point I'm just not smart enough.
You definitely could get them to move through all with help from a higher-D being (or maybe even just a similar-D or lower-D being that shares at least one dimension, and doesn't share at least one other?). They could presumably also do that themselves if they had some way to rotate themselves, but I'm not sure if that requires having size in those dimensions, especially if we allow vastly different laws of physics.
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Couldn't you conceptualize this as being what happens through Dimensional Travel, in a certain sense? Generally speaking, alternate universes are treated as being on a separate axis, right? It'd be like a human traveling from one spacetime to the next. Are you speaking from a non-fictional/purely mathematical standpoint?
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of course they do.
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Yeah probably sure.
Kind of. I'm sort of wondering how far we have to go before it can't work with physics, and we just have to use magic (i.e. telekinetically rotating one's body throughout additional axes) to get it to work.
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Yeah, trying to equate it to physics sounds like it could be a nightmare on its own. Some branches of physics assume only 3 spatial dimensions, others assume 4, 5, etc... and many of them assume the dimensions result in different outcomes so I imagine it would rely heavily on
A.) Do these other dimensions even exist?
B.) How do they impact the universe as a whole?
A.) Do these other dimensions even exist?
B.) How do they impact the universe as a whole?
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pretty much yeah based on our site model anyways...
dimensions are just 1-D axes stacked perpendicularly onto themselves. which means multiple 1-D intersections exists so... yeah.. In addition to what you said here, higher dimensional beings can also "pop in and out of sight" to lower dimensional ones.
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- Thread starter
- #1,688
They can actually.
A being's movement is only limited by the space they are in. A one dimensional being can move in 100 directions if they are in 100D space.
Georredannea15
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They can move in 100 directions, one at a time, but they cannot move in 100 directions at the same time
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- Thread starter
- #1,690
Why would they be limited to being able to move one direction at a time?
If the object is in 100D space, then you can displace it in 100 directions simultaneously by acting 100 different forces on it at the same time.
Flowman777
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Another example: 0-D point moves forward, up, and to the left. It's moving through 3-D space but is only ever at a point throughout any time point in the journey. So it's moving in more directions than the dimensions it has.
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Consider the distinction between an object propelling itself, and it being displaced by another object.
Georredannea15
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An object with a single direction of motion extends in one direction in that space. More precisely, it cannot extend in more than one direction at the same time
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- Thread starter
- #1,694
Even in that distinction, lets say a one-dimensional object can only move in single forward motion, it should still be able to slightly change it's directory, kind of like a snake moving forward, and if it can't change its directory, the straight line it's traveling can still be displaced in multiple directions. You can move in a straight line in 3 dimensions, and your coordinates in all three dimensions can still shift.
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I don't think a 0-D point can "move" in the way you're describing. A point is an exact location in space and movement is an act of changing location or position. Other decidedly 0-D objects should still technically be able to move from point-to-point though.
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- Thread starter
- #1,696
It can extend in one direction of space, but that doesn't mean it can only move in one direction. it's the property of space that determines the degrees of movement, not property of the object.
In 2D space, a 2D object cannot flip, but it can in a 3D space.
Georredannea15
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Yes, as you can see from here, it runs along a single direction. And this action depends fundamentally on the subject itself. Don't misunderstand, I'm not talking about its move, I'm talking about the axis along which the subject extends. It depends on the subject itself rather than space.
Flowman777
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Oh, okay. Replace point with object and my point stands.
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Agreed, I don't think your reasoning was wrong I just don't think "point" was the right word to use.
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Y'all really need to chill with the little things or at least clarify that you agree with their overall point before correcting them. lmao.
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I thought I did that, though. I even said at the end "Other decidedly 0-D objects should still technically be able to move from point-to-point though."
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I’m personally a bit confused on how Omnipotence now plays a role in Tier 0 as noted by Ultima. I thought we tended to stay away from that term.
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Does it? I thought that Ultima was pretty against even using "omnipotence" statements for tiering, unless it has a hell of a lot of context behind it. Like I think "logical omnipotence" is Tier 0, but that has harsh standards.
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The "omnipotence" here isn't necessarily the ability to do anything but it's moreso an existence that is "all powerful", above and lacking all qualities we could assign something. I dunno how to explain it well but basically concepts of monad and ultimate/absolute reality that have no contradictions.
Rakih_Elyan
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why?
Rakih_Elyan
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Gu Chensa assimilated with beyond deathless realm.
Beyond deathless realm cannot be ascended via cultivation, even with infinite amount of lifetime.
And then there another novels from the Author.
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@Ultima_Reality in your tiering system revision.
Is it possible to have Tier 0 cosmologies, or realms?
Like say the truest form of a verse reality is some form of unchangeable, uninteractable, nothingness. That can only be perceived by higher powers but those powers don't transcend it just allow you to see that reality really is just inherently nothingness
This isn't verse specific just random easy over simplified example
Is it possible to have Tier 0 cosmologies, or realms?
Like say the truest form of a verse reality is some form of unchangeable, uninteractable, nothingness. That can only be perceived by higher powers but those powers don't transcend it just allow you to see that reality really is just inherently nothingness
This isn't verse specific just random easy over simplified example
Rakih_Elyan
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Because bullshit duh, and he is actually chosen by it?
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What...?
Rakih_Elyan
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He is chosen to become one with "it" by "it".
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probably doesn't, probably does somehow.
True Omnipotence probably isn't something that can be conceptualized... any definition we give is just gonna be some kind of "lesser omnipotence" anyway. Essentially those truly omnipotent characters if they do somehow exist would be above tiering systems i guess since Tiering systems are based on our comprehension. However, the highest form of omnipotence we can fathom can qualify for Tier 0 but that work of fiction is probably gonna have to be so specific in its definition of omnipotence and has to lack all contradictions somehow, theres probably gonna be a quite a lot of criterias that the omnipotent being has to pass. The character probably has to be a Monad too iirc (dunno what a monad is myself, saw it in a youtube vid)... Idk i don't care about fictions with characters like these...
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It is less you reach tier 0 by being omnipotent and moreso that a tier 0 being by necessity must be omnipotent.
If something were to be tier 0, then by its simple nature of being it is omnipotent, (eg through it being properly monist, or nondual)
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I feel like Don'talk and Ultima need to be put through a series of yes/no questions, at this point. Maybe someone to delete their messages if they say anything else.
At the same time, I also want character names, rather than just hypotheticals.
At the same time, I also want character names, rather than just hypotheticals.
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Oh don't be so cruel. We still need to keep their graces so I'm not given all their work.
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Yeah. When you hit Tier 0, the distinction between "character" and "place" really just comes down to whether the thing is an intelligence of sorts or if it's just mindless and impersonal.
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