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Which Superman(/men) is this?

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Shadow_Somnius

Shadow_Somnius

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https://media.**********.net/attachments/958721994667479120/1038518510286032917/1667672496775.webp

https://media.**********.net/attachments/958721994667479120/1038518905628532766/1667672593216.webp?width=362&height=573
 
Bottom one is superboy prime, top two are pre crisis and golden age I think.
 
Top one is Post-Crisis Superman fighting Golden Age Superman, bottom one is Superboy Prime. Both from the Infinite Crisis arc, the first scan being in the Superman: This is Your Life tie-in.
 
Ehnkr2beboh said:
Top one is Post-Crisis Superman fighting Golden Age Superman, bottom one is Superboy Prime. Both from the Infinite Crisis arc, the first scan being in the Superman: This is Your Life tie-in.
Click to expand...
If that's the case, then why isn't the first scan listed in his profile? Obviously breaking the boundaries of space and time is no simple feat.
 
Shadow_Somnius said:
If that's the case, then why isn't the first scan listed in his profile? Obviously breaking the boundaries of space and time is no simple feat.
Click to expand...
The wiki has had a few reasons. The ones I can recall are arguing it's an outlier/plot convenience, it being a metaphorical feat, and the Universe being weakened by the events of Infinite Crisis.

Personally though, I think the feat is pretty legit, but that's the Wiki's stance.
 
Shadow_Somnius said:
If that's the case, then why isn't the first scan listed in his profile? Obviously breaking the boundaries of space and time is no simple feat.
Click to expand...
Because, if my memory is not wrong, this is after Prime broke reality with his punches, the reason Golden Age Supes is there in the first place. Luthor was also messing up with the multiverse by using the Supermen to stretch it. So, its really hard to use that feat because they weren't destroying universes. The most you might get is limited form of space time manipulation.
 
Immortalgodd said:
Because, if my memory is not wrong, this is after Prime broke reality with his punches, the reason Golden Age Supes is there in the first place. Luthor was also messing up with the multiverse by using the Supermen to stretch it. So, its really hard to use that feat because they weren't destroying universes. The most you might get is limited form of space time manipulation.
Click to expand...
If it won't be much trouble would you mind getting the scans? They broke the boundaries of space and time, would it qualify for immeasurable speed?

And what about this feat?

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/958721994667479120/1038886132332630146/1667760142138.jpg
 
Shadow_Somnius said:
If it won't be much trouble would you mind getting the scans? They broke the boundaries of space and time, would it qualify for immeasurable speed?

And what about this feat?

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/958721994667479120/1038886132332630146/1667760142138.jpg
Click to expand...
Its not a speed feat bruv and that doesn't qualify as immeasurable.
 
Immortalgodd said:
Because, if my memory is not wrong, this is after Prime broke reality with his punches, the reason Golden Age Supes is there in the first place. Luthor was also messing up with the multiverse by using the Supermen to stretch it. So, its really hard to use that feat because they weren't destroying universes. The most you might get is limited form of space time manipulation.
Click to expand...
Its never stated anywhere that Luthor messing with the multiverse did much. Most of the space-time shattering was done by the Supermen, so it would at least be half of low 2-C
 
XXKINGXX69 said:
Its never stated anywhere that Luthor messing with the multiverse did much. Most of the space-time shattering was done by the Supermen, so it would at least be half of low 2-C
Click to expand...
In fact it was indeed stated that it was unstable. And no, they didn't shatter space-time continuum but the boundaries of Post Crisis Earth and Earth 2 which were sharing the same space. I am not sure how this can be argued to be Low 2C at all.
 
Immortalgodd said:
In fact it was indeed stated that it was unstable. And no, they didn't shatter space-time continuum but the boundaries of Post Crisis Earth and Earth 2 which were sharing the same space. I am not sure how this can be argued to be Low 2C at all.
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Prove they shared the same space. Why does it being unstable matter? Shattering the boundaries of universes is low 2-C
 
XXKINGXX69 said:
Prove they shared the same space. Why does it being unstable matter? Shattering the boundaries of universes is low 2-C
Click to expand...
https://media.**********.net/attachments/773413428248182784/1039513675905642506/Infinite_Crisis_2005_-_Infinite_Crisis_2005_Issue_5_-_2.jpghttps://media.**********.net/attachments/773413428248182784/1039515973348245576/20221108_180849.jpghttps://media.**********.net/attachments/773413428248182784/1039515341128212480/Infinite_Crisis_2005_-_Infinite_Crisis_2005_Issue_5_-_14.jpg
Click to expand...


Superman literally flew to Earth 2 from Earth 1 and Diana too, physically. If the fight was actually Low 2C and collpasing Space time continuum, it would do more than destroy parts of a city and not affect anything else. You're gonna have to prove why this is Low 2C.
 
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Qawsedf234 said:
We don't use stuff from that Death of the New Gods regarding Darkseid and the Source due to some of the plot issues it has.
Click to expand...
It has nothing to do with the plot, as the very plot of DotNG was referenced in Final Crisis. The reason we disregarded the Source’s depiction in DotNG is because it contradicts the current wanked interpretation of the Source being = to the Overvoid.
 
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Shadow_Somnius said:
If it won't be much trouble would you mind getting the scans? They broke the boundaries of space and time, would it qualify for immeasurable speed?

And what about this feat?

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/958721994667479120/1038886132332630146/1667760142138.jpg
Click to expand...
This is Soul fire darkseid it's definitely a tier 1 feat
 
Immortalgodd said:
Superman literally flew to Earth 2 from Earth 1 and Diana too, physically. If the fight was actually Low 2C and collpasing Space time continuum, it would do more than destroy parts of a city and not affect anything else. You're gonna have to prove why this is Low 2C.
Click to expand...
It shattered the boundaries and rewrote it, maybe they recreated it
 
Qawsedf234 said:
We don't use stuff from that Death of the New Gods regarding Darkseid and the Source due to some of the plot issues it has.
Click to expand...
Shadow_Somnius said:
Could you elaborate? Or tell me where to find the explanation?
Click to expand...
Yeah, Death of the New Gods is an enormous outlier for both Darkseid and the Source. Not just in terms of feats but characterization. The depiction of the Source is completely incompatible with any other comic, and even Grant officially retconned the whole "black/white humanoid Source" thing.

In this scan you can see the official rejection of that whole aspect of the storyline. It basically retcons the "Source" in DOTNG as just being the humanoid form of the Anti-Life Equation, the Source itself is above Anti-Life and isn't "half of it." In Grant's work, the Source is just another name for the Overvoid, which is why the map labels the white void outside creation as "Overvoid" and "The Source" and Darkseid doesn't come close to scaling to it.

Grant has said in an interview statement that Countdown and DotNG are apocryphal. He incorporated some elements of the story but only the parts that we actually see reflected in Final Crisis directly are considered canon.

In pretty much every other storyline, the Source is literally a God to the New Gods like Darkseid and is far far more powerful than them. In modern canon the Source is the supreme being above Perpetua and the Super Celestials, etc.
 
Deagonx said:
Yeah, Death of the New Gods is an enormous outlier for both Darkseid and the Source. Not just in terms of feats but characterization. The depiction of the Source is completely incompatible with any other comic, and even Grant officially retconned the whole "black/white humanoid Source" thing.

In this scan you can see the official rejection of that whole aspect of the storyline. It basically retcons the "Source" in DOTNG as just being the humanoid form of the Anti-Life Equation, the Source itself is above Anti-Life and isn't "half of it." In Grant's work, the Source is just another name for the Overvoid, which is why the map labels the white void outside creation as "Overvoid" and "The Source" and Darkseid doesn't come close to scaling to it.

Grant has said in an interview statement that Countdown and DotNG are apocryphal. He incorporated some elements of the story but only the parts that we actually see reflected in Final Crisis directly are considered canon.

In pretty much every other storyline, the Source is literally a God to the New Gods like Darkseid and is far far more powerful than them. In modern canon the Source is the supreme being above Perpetua and the Super Celestials, etc.
Click to expand...
Thanks! You're incredible. Could get me a better version of the link fixed to 'scan? It isn't really clear..
 
Deagonx said:
Yeah, Death of the New Gods is an enormous outlier for both Darkseid and the Source. Not just in terms of feats but characterization. The depiction of the Source is completely incompatible with any other comic, and even Grant officially retconned the whole "black/white humanoid Source" thing.

In this scan you can see the official rejection of that whole aspect of the storyline. It basically retcons the "Source" in DOTNG as just being the humanoid form of the Anti-Life Equation, the Source itself is above Anti-Life and isn't "half of it." In Grant's work, the Source is just another name for the Overvoid, which is why the map labels the white void outside creation as "Overvoid" and "The Source" and Darkseid doesn't come close to scaling to it.

Grant has said in an interview statement that Countdown and DotNG are apocryphal. He incorporated some elements of the story but only the parts that we actually see reflected in Final Crisis directly are considered canon.

In pretty much every other storyline, the Source is literally a God to the New Gods like Darkseid and is far far more powerful than them. In modern canon the Source is the supreme being above Perpetua and the Super Celestials, etc.
Click to expand...
Prove that
 
Immortalgodd said:
Grant Morrison has referred to The Death of the New Gods as canon but clarified that the depictions of Orion vs. Darkseid in both that story and in Countdown were "apocryphal attempts to describe an indescribable cosmic event". In addition, other aspects of the story, such as the Source being split in two, were retconned by Morrison. Due to this, do not attempt to scale Darkseid to the Source.
Click to expand...
I kind of want to address this.

Grant calling Darkseid vs Orion apocryphal doesn’t matter in terms of Soulfire Darkseid matching Source. As Soulfire Darkseids death in the aftermath of his fight with Orion, was literally shown to us in DC Universe #0 which was written by Morrison.

Also sure Final Crisis said the Source cannot be halved divided or contained, meaning the old Gods splitting the composite form of the Source was retconned. However that would affect the Old Gods, not Darkseid who matched the composite form of the Source with the Soulfire formula.
 
That's incorrect. Grant made it clear that the storylines were apocryphal, and the depictions of Darkseid and the Source are not correlative to Final Crisis. He made it clear that his view is that the Overvoid is the Source, not some talking orb that combines with the Anti Life Equation to make a composite being.

DotNG Darkseid and DotNG Source scale to eachother, but their depictions are not connected to other stories.
 
Grant didn’t say the entire storylines were apocryphal, Grant said the very last battle between Orion and Darkseid was apocryphal. Which is irrelevant to Darkseid vs The Source.

The Source being the Overvoid runs extremely contradictory to the comics. Also according to your own comments, what Grant says isn’t necessarily canon.

Deagonx - “He can say something about his own work, but what he says isn't necessarily canon. He doesn't have sole authorship over what is printed. This isn't Morrison Comics, it's DC Comics. Not every author who published a DC comic book has the ability to create post-facto canon by airing out their musings in an interview.”
 
Xearsay said:
The Source being the Overvoid runs extremely contradictory to the comics
Click to expand...
So does him being a talking orb. The Source's depiction has varied drastically. Grant made it overtly clear what his view was, and this is reflected on his Multiversity map.
 
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