Naruto: 8 Gates Speed Multiplier Downgrade

[ssgengar]

We're not going to devolve into stacking calculations in real life and then trying to apply it to fiction. Futhermore, you're not fabricating five times the energy out of the blue, you are actually using more muscles and having weight on your punches.

My question was just the opposite situation of tempest’s example, I’m not trying to stack anything lol

And I’m saying energy because that’s what’s stated in the scan, it says the secret of the technique is overriding the brain’s limiter, which gives the user access to all of their chakra. So it seems to be more than just “more muscles”

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Yeah Deceived’s argument is most compelling so far. The statement itself mentions how it enables you to use super speed taijutsu, which heavily supports Deceived’s interpretation. There’s a lot into running speed (short sprints vs marathons, etc) but generally stronger leg muscles will enable you to explode forward more and thus be faster. The gates amping speed and strength comparably not only makes sense realistically, as training your muscles will enable that, but it’s consistent with Lee’s showings as well.

Also, if you train legs, your explosive short distance sprinting speed will increase. The idea that doing leg strength changing won’t increase your speed is asinine. I’ve done leg work (squats cleans etc) for the purpose of increasing my short distance burst speed. Long distance has The added stuff of stamina and form and certain body types are better suited for longer distances, but cqc is not long distance running, it’s short bursts of speed.

Disagree FRA is the tldr.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Disagree FRA.

 

[Godernet]

yeah, I don't agree with this at all. For one the first gate isn't inherently just a multiplier like Cursed Mark where there's little proof that it boosts all stats the same way. Everyone in the Naruto world is limited to 1/5 of their physical/mental potential by the logic of the gates. If you were given unrestricted access to that why wouldn't you get 5x faster? Besides, there are no antifeats or contradictions in a 5x speed increase.

 

[Damage3245]

It basically never says speed is multiplied.

This does seem to be the only relevant factor if this is what our multiplier requirements require.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

This does seem to be the only relevant factor if this is what our multiplier requirements require.

It doesn’t explicitly say it but it’s implied. Just as it never explicitly says Lee got his attack potency amped 5x, it’s just implied through the fact his muscular energy increased.

 

[samlex]

Oof

Yeah, seems fine.

Smh. What seems fine? Were you not the same person that agreed and even arguEd for the upgrade before? Using muscular energy translate to physicals which translate to speed.

This does seem to be the only relevant factor if this is what our multiplier requirements require.

Smh damage do better than just agreeing with every naruto downgrade. Your vote actually matter here not mine. Now knowing that your votes are the only vote that matter avoid agreeing without checking all side of the arguments. Please

 

[samlex]

Sorry Jvando

https://vsbattles.com/threads/might-guys-and-rock-lees-at-least-5x-multiplier-with-gates.54347/

Via our multiplier standards, it says that we need direct statements for multipliers.

Now it says that the first gate is utilizing 100% of the muscular energy when it usually utilizes 20%, so the strength is there. It even talks about muscle power and its limits, support.
It also says that speed is enhanced.

But the issue is that speed isn't stated to be amped on the same extent. It doesn't say "it utilizes 100% of its speed when it usually utilizes 20%", as speed is something that isn't really linear when trying to measure speed from force applied per movement and allat.

It basically never says speed is multiplied.

Strength multiplier stays, speed multiplier goes.

Disagree with this thread.

muscle translate to physically energy which translate to both speed and strength. If using 20 of muscle energy gives you x speEd then using 100 percent gives you x muitiplier by 5 . This is a easy muitipaler not hard at all in anyway and the reason you are doing this is because you don’t want to accept sage mode multipler, pure dishonesty and nonsense.

 

[LordTracer]

Were you not the same person that agreed and even arguEd for the upgrade before?

Dude acting like people can’t change their minds over time

 

[samlex]

Dude acting like people can’t change their minds over time

No I know you can but. Give reason don’t just say seems fine. This is one of the easiest upgrade in the verse no long argument yet you disagree but why Because your vote actually matters. Has only mod votes are accepted.

 

[LordTracer]

No I know you can but. Give reason don’t just say seems fine. This is one of the easiest upgrade in the verse no long argument yet you disagree but why Because your vote actually matters. Has only mod votes are accepted.

“Give reason why you agree with the OP”

???

 

[KingTempest]

I don't believe since we aren't given a "direct" statement about speed gaining a proportional amp means it doesn't actually gain a proportional amp. The statement within itself is referencing "muscular energy", which is just the chemical energy that muscles use to energize physical movements. Physical movements by definition would require both physical strength and speed to occur, so both are closely linked to each other. And both are relatively linear to each other, as in someone who is average in physical strength will also most likely be average in speed as well. Of course excluding specialized examples.

The statement within itself is referencing the strength of their muscles.

If anyone were to employ anything even close to 100% the strength in his muscles, the muscles themselves themselves would quickly break down... so the brain sets a limit on how much of our power we are willing and able to use. The secret of this technique is in overriding that internal cranial safety feature, giving the wielder access to all of his own chakra. Dangerous as it is, the result is the release of enough muscle power to enable the wielder to perform a series of grueling and demanding tasks at an incredible speed... pushing his own body to the limits and safety... and beyond.

It's quite directly referencing the strength of the muscles, not referencing any type of chemical energy whatsoever.

So if Lee can only utilize 20% of his muscular energy in base, but when he activates the 1st gate it allows Lee to use 100% of it, he'd gain a 5x amp towards his ability to utilize muscular energy, which is the energy that energizes physical movements, which is physical strength + speed. You'd require a higher preponderance of evidence to assume "muscular energy" is only referring to physical strength when by definition it isn't. A 5x amp towards this energy would inherently be a 5x amp to both speed and physical strength without further contradictory context, which hasn't been given yet.

Given the argument I've laid out above i disagree with this thread's premise, it should be a 5x amp towards both physical strength and speed, not just physical strength. (Also this will probably be my only actual comment on this topic since i don't care enough about Naruto to debate for it, so don't expect a reply back if you actually do reply)

Check with the new explanation of what “muscular energy” referenced.
Idk who told y’all it referenced chemical energy

Yeah Deceived’s argument is most compelling so far. The statement itself mentions how it enables you to use super speed taijutsu, which heavily supports Deceived’s interpretation. There’s a lot into running speed (short sprints vs marathons, etc) but generally stronger leg muscles will enable you to explode forward more and thus be faster. The gates amping speed and strength comparably not only makes sense realistically, as training your muscles will enable that, but it’s consistent with Lee’s showings as well.

Also, if you train legs, your explosive short distance sprinting speed will increase. The idea that doing leg strength changing won’t increase your speed is asinine. I’ve done leg work (squats cleans etc) for the purpose of increasing my short distance burst speed. Long distance has The added stuff of stamina and form and certain body types are better suited for longer distances, but cqc is not long distance running, it’s short bursts of speed.

Disagree FRA is the tldr.

arc your entire reply just ducked the entire premise of the thread and even ignored deceived point that you agreed with
Nobody said that it doesn’t improve speed. At all.
We said it’s not linear.

 

[KingTempest]

Disagree with this thread.

muscle translate to physically energy which translate to both speed and strength. If using 20 of muscle energy gives you x speEd then using 100 percent gives you x muitiplier by 5 . This is an easy muitipaler not hard at all in anyway and the reason you are doing this is because you don’t want to accept sage mode multipler, pure dishonesty and nonsense.

“Breathing translates to energy, so if I breathe twice as hard or breathe twice as much energy, I will gain twice as much energy and be twice as strong and twice as fast”
That’s what I just read from your entire argument

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

arc your entire reply just ducked the entire premise of the thread and even ignored deceived point that you agreed with
Nobody said that it doesn’t improve speed. At all.
We said it’s not linear.

Can you prove that claim that it's not linear? Cuz Occam's Razor takes my side. We don't look at "5x power" and go "well that isn't AP because power technically can be force x velocity, so they couldve just got 5x faster". Substantiate the claim that increasing the energy available to use in your muscles is some weird nonlinear amp.

 

[Naeblis495]

“Breathing translates to energy, so if I breathe twice as hard or breathe twice as much energy, I will gain twice as much energy and be twice as strong and twice as fast”
That’s what I just read from your entire argument

So that's the secret to me doubling my benchpress scores ? i just have to inhale harder.

 

[Deceived3596]

So that's the secret to me doubling my benchpress scores ? i just have to inhale harder.

Double this in yo mouth.

 

[KingTempest]

Can you prove that claim that it's not linear? Cuz Occam's Razor takes my side. We don't look at "5x power" and go "well that isn't AP because power technically can be force x velocity, so they couldve just got 5x faster". Substantiate the claim that increasing the energy available to use in your muscles is some weird nonlinear amp.

What
The multiplier references the power produced from the muscles

Occam’s razor isn’t at play in this thread when the context of the multiplier is the strength of the muscles.

Like no

 

[Naeblis495]

Double this in yo mouth.

i'll double yo mama tonigh.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

What
The multiplier references the power produced from the muscles

Occam’s razor isn’t at play in this thread when the context of the multiplier is the strength of the muscles.

Like no

The actual statement doesn't limit it to strength.

This is talking about the available muscular energy a human can use. Hence, Deceived and I's point stands.

 

[Deceived3596]

i'll double yo mama tonigh.

I'll sick my pitpull at you, have him bite yo shit off Mexican style.

 

[samlex]

i'll double yo mama tonigh.

Please don’t derail.

 

[Deceived3596]

Please don’t derail.

Derail this in yo mouth

 

[KingTempest]

The actual statement doesn't limit it to strength.

This is talking about the available muscular energy a human can use. Hence, Deceived and I's point stands.

You sent a new translation talking about how it’s specifically strength to justify why it’s linear for speed

We need a direct statement of speed being multiplied by 5. Your loopholes mean nothing to the lack of a 5x statement

 

[samlex]

The actual statement doesn't limit it to strength.

This is talking about the available muscular energy a human can use. Hence, Deceived and I's point stands.

It literally says to use super speed taijustu. Again speed is amped.

 

[KingTempest]

It literally says to use super speed taijustu. Again speed is amped.

Who said speed isn’t amped?????

 

[ssgengar]

I’m still not convinced that the amp isn’t linear

 

[The_Alxhemist]

It basically never says speed is multiplied.

This seems to be the only relevent issue that's not in line with the Multipliers standard.

Strength multiplier stays, speed multiplier goes.

Hard disagree with this. The 8 Gates was literally shown to be all round amp for strength and for speed, Cherry picking what stat it boosts is ridiculous. If strength stays then speed would too

 

[samlex]

Who said speed isn’t amped?????

Bruh it is difficult to argue with you. If the speed is amped based on the muscle increase. Doesn’t that mean it is amped by 5. It is not that difficult Understand. Stop asking for direct statements that post by arc is direct enough.

 

[samlex]

This seems to be the only relevent issue that's not in line with the Multipliers standard.


Hard disagree with this. The 8 Gates was literally shown to be all round amp for strength and for speed, Cherry picking what stat it boosts is ridiculous. If strength stays then speed would too

because he doesn’t want to upgrade the sage mode he is trying to downgrade the simple and non difficult upgrade. Smh

 

[The_Alxhemist]

So that's the secret to me doubling my benchpress scores ? i just have to inhale harder.

In the Words of Andrew Tate : BREATHE AIR

 

[The_Alxhemist]

because he doesn’t want to upgrade the sage mode he is trying to downgrade the simple and non difficult upgrade. Smh

Well yes this too. But that 10x Sage Mode amp is happening lmao

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

You sent a new translation talking about how it’s specifically strength to justify why it’s linear for speed

We need a direct statement of speed being multiplied by 5. Your loopholes mean nothing to the lack of a 5x statement

do you know what entails musculature energy/power?

Bruh it is difficult to argue with you. If the speed is amped based on the muscle increase. Doesn’t that mean it is amped by 5. It is not that difficult Understand. Stop asking for direct statements that post by arc is direct enough.

because he doesn’t want to upgrade the sage mode he is trying to downgrade the simple and non difficult upgrade. Smh

shut up and stop derailing

 

[ssgengar]

This seems to be the only relevent issue that's not in line with the Multipliers standard.


Hard disagree with this. The 8 Gates was literally shown to be all round amp for strength and for speed, Cherry picking what stat it boosts is ridiculous. If strength stays then speed would too

Agreed. It’s stated that gates limit the amount of chakra that flows in the body. No reason why we should assume strength is being prioritized here

 

[Romeu08]

Can you prove that claim that it's not linear? Cuz Occam's Razor takes my side. We don't look at "5x power" and go "well that isn't AP because power technically can be force x velocity, so they couldve just got 5x faster". Substantiate the claim that increasing the energy available to use in your muscles is some weird nonlinear amp.

Just because our muscles get their full potential unleashed it won't mean you will get 5x times faster in a linear way
Stomping the ground twice harder won't translate into twice the speed and unless there is a direct statement it seems very sus

 

[samlex]

Who said speed isn’t amped?????

Bruh it is difficult to argue with you. If the speed is amped based on the muscle increase. Doesn’t that mean it is amped by 5. It is not that difficult Understand.

do you know what entails musculature energy/power?



shut up and stop derailing

I’m not derailing. I’m stating the truth.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Bruh it is difficult to argue with you. If the speed is amped based on the muscle increase. Doesn’t that mean it is amped by 5. It is not that difficult Understand.

I’m not derailing. I’m stating the truth.

This is why you got banned last time, now stop talking unless you got something of worth to add to this thread

 

[Tdjwo]

This does seem to be the only relevant factor if this is what our multiplier requirements require.

This man has a downgrade boner for anything Naruto-related damn. Reio must be proud.
I'm joking

 

[KingTempest]

This seems to be the only relevent issue that's not in line with the Multipliers standard.


Hard disagree with this. The 8 Gates was literally shown to be all round amp for strength and for speed, Cherry picking what stat it boosts is ridiculous. If strength stays then speed would too

Nobody said it doesn’t amp speed, and it’s infuriating me that you guys are saying that I’m saying that it doesn’t

It doesn’t amp every stat equally

Bruh it is difficult to argue with you. If the speed is amped based on the muscle increase. Doesn’t that mean it is amped by 5. It is not that difficult Understand. Stop asking for direct statements that post by arc is direct enough.

To you

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

do you know what entails musculature energy/power?

@KingTempest weh

 

[KingTempest]

@KingTempest weh

I’m losing interest so explain what it entails while proving it amps speed linearly