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2-C Dragon Ball Super upgrade

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Well ofcourse ssb, toppo or vegeta are as strong as the gods, but there are many statements put them as such. Obviously giving them rating based on just statements is a no go. But the fact that they are getting compared to gods "mainly in power " meaning that they are at the same realm as the godd, but obviously less stronger and skillfull
AKM sama said:
Well, because the GoD level isn't a fixed power level. Even in the manga, Vegeta was weaker than Beerus, but was said to be a possible candidate of GoD in another universe. Same with Toppo, he isn't that strong in his base form, but is strong enough to be considered a candidate who later gained the GoD transformation.
That statement just means Goku is strong enough to be considered a candidate for the position. Them "rivalling" the GoDs has been teased so many times, during SSG, and when Goku went SSB KKx10, etc.

Toppo being a candidate to be GoD doesn't necessarily mean he is as strong as Belmod.
Click to expand...
Btw the justification for belmod is "is that two gods were to fight each other, but will mean the end of two universes " or something like that.
It either that's true, giving toppo the half 2-C, or that's false, removing everyone's rating except Champa and beerus.
 
Vietthai96 said:
Again Association Fallacy, Toppo became GoDs doesn't mean he should be = 12 official GoDs in power, using your logic then SSG Goku should be = GoDs as he also have power of God, all of your point is just your personal interpretation of context and wording
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Uhm goku only has god ki
Meanwhile toppo is an actual god
 
Darkmon_cns said:
Looking at the other GoD pages, they seem to have this in then

"A fight between two Gods of Destruction can result in the destruction of two universes."
As there low 2-C justification, I pulled this from here https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Mule
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Yeah, I think that needs to be changed to simply say "they should not be much weaker than Beerus or Champa"
in lack of any better option/info
 
Orange said:
Champa nor beerus were stated to be stronger or weaker I think.
U7 is the lowest while U11 is the highest so that could mean something?
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No, highest or lowest whatsoever is evolution point of each universe, as GP and Angel point out, those point are indicated of how much of an universes develop, it is not related to individual power level
Orange said:
Uhm goku only has god ki
Meanwhile toppo is an actual god
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And.....Kaioshin is also actual God, but way weaker, your reason hardly mean anything, it is the same argument "of hey he is a god, he must be stronger than that human" of which i saw across all of vs debate community when a topic about someone who is a God vs someone who is a human (no insult you of course) =.=
 
AKM sama said:
Yeah, I think that needs to be changed to simply say "they should not be much weaker than Beerus or Champa"
in lack of any better option/info
Click to expand...
I feel like- there was a long discussion well super was airing that resulted in the decision that the half 2-C applied to all GoDs for reasoning that applied along something like, the rule that 2 Gods of destruction can't fight eachother is founded on the idea 2 universes would be destroyed as a result of it, or something like that, but I'm really not sure now, I'd think you'd remember that
 
Vietthai96 said:
No, highest or lowest whatsoever is evolution point of each universe, as GP and Angel point out, those point are indicated of how much of an universes develop, it is not related to individual power level

And.....Kaioshin is also actual God, but way weaker, your reason hardly mean anything, it is the same argument "of hey he is a god, he must be stronger than that human" of which i saw across all of vs debate community when a topic about someone who is a God vs someone who is a human (no insult you of course) =.=
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Ah yes, because obviously toppo was stated to be "toppo, the kaioshin" not "toppo the god of destruction "
Silly me.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Wasn't Vados outright staying that two Gods of Destruction should never fight as doing so would result in the destruction of both universes? Not just Beerus and Champa but just the combined might of 2 Gods of Destruction?
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I think that interpretation came from the very old subs (most likely fansubs at the time) when these episodes were still airing, that Orange posted a while ago. It was Whis who stated that two GoDs should not engage in a fight. Then Vados spoke about Beerus and Champa in specific: "the two of you must know your combat would inevitably lead to the rather inconvenient annihilation of both the Sixth and Seventh universes"

Whis' statement, "I'm sorry, but we couldn't stand idly by and allow one Destroyer to engage another in combat" would be true for all the GoDs because two GoDs fighting each other would most definitely cause major destruction to at least one universe.
 
The first sentence seems to connect with the second to me. It can still mean that a fight between two GoDs will result in two universes being annihilated.
 
Orange said:
Or they will change the tiering so it doesn't get accepted
Click to expand...
Fans should just wait until the anime comes out and wait for more feats instead of disesperately making CRTS which get rejected over and over, to try and make their characters stronger.
 
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Hello everyone, I was sleeping so I couldn't participate. Whis and vados' statement in the japanese subs didn't specify beerus and champa but all GoDs in general. This means that it's totally plausible for Toppo to scale to the other GoDs especially when featless GoDs scale to that statement as well.
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
Hello everyone, I was sleeping so I couldn't participate. Whis and vados' statement in the japanese subs didn't specify beerus and champa but all GoDs in general. This means that it's totally plausible for Toppo to scale to the other GoDs especially when featless GoDs scale to that statement as well.
Click to expand...
Well it did specify the universes.
But I could see that statement be proven.
Shouldn't we get the original script and Translate it so we can avoid any misinformation
 
Orange said:
Well it did specify the universes.
But I could see that statement be proven.
Shouldn't we get the original script and Translate it so we can avoid any misinformation
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I think they say exactly what the subtitles say but it still implies that any 2 GoDs can break U6 and U7.
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
I think they say exactly what the subtitles say but it still implies that any 2 GoDs can break U6 and U7.
Click to expand...
The statement indicates that if two gods of destruction two universes will get destroyed.
Since the fight was between the gids of U7 and U6, those two universes will get destroyed thus explaining why they state it.
This would help the rating ofcourse
 
The video is from Jan, 2016. Again, fansubs. Initial subs are never completely accurate. I already posted the accurate one and if you were to check any of the updated paid websites, I am sure you'll find that they are way different than what you posted.

Anyway, I guess the conclusion here is to simply change the wording in the AP justification of other GoDs.
 
AKM sama said:
The video is from Jan, 2016. Again, fansubs. Initial subs are never completely accurate. I already posted the accurate one and if you were to check any of the updated paid websites, I am sure you'll find that they are way different than what you posted.

Anyway, I guess the conclusion here is to simply change the wording in the AP justification of other GoDs.
Click to expand...
Huh? I seen another subs from an anime website and it states verbatim "Two gods of destruction must never fight each other, you should know that would mean the annihilation of universe 6 and 7." I will not link the source though as it's from a pirated anime website. If you have the statement saying something that contradicts this in another translation that's official then show me. None of the statements I've seen contradict that any two GoDs will destroy 2 universes if they fight and I saw 2 different subs and the English dub.
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
Huh? I seen another subs from an anime website and it states verbatim "Two gods of destruction must never fight each other, you should know that would mean the annihilation of universe 6 and 7." I will not link the source though as it's from a pirated anime website. If you have the statement saying something that contradicts this in another translation that's official then show me. None of the statements I've seen contradict that any two GoDs will destroy 2 universes if they fight and I saw 2 different subs and the English dub.
Click to expand...
This translation makes it seems like Zen'o would destroy their universes for fighting.
 
AKM sama said:
I have posted the statement once, and quoted it twice. Just see some of my previous comments.
Click to expand...
I have seen it, there are 3 other versions of this scene, the video, the one I showed and the dub all suggest that it's any GoD will destroy 2 universes. Whis literally says in japanese ""hakashin" twice, so he would be saying any GoD not just beerus and champa specifically and would make the video translation more accurate, just because it's a fan translation doesn't mean it's wrong you know? I still think that this is strong evidence for toppo scaling to the GoDs and if you're willing to scale the other GoDs to beerus and champa then why exclude toppo for no reason?
 
I think what AKM is saying is that it's never stated 2 GoDs can destroy a universe. Whis says that 2 GoDs can't fight. I think that's what AKM is implying.
 
RisingIons said:
He's saying the statement specifically pertains to the two gods involved, in question.
Click to expand...
Yeah and what I'm saying is that there are three different versions that state that all GoDs apply to the rule, and the japanese dialog implies this also while akm only has 1 version that implies that.
 
Well if there are three different versions that give the results, the gods will have the ratings plus toppo
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
Yeah and what I'm saying is that there are three different versions that state that all GoDs apply to the rule, and the japanese dialog implies this also while akm only has 1 version that implies that.
Click to expand...
There are only one version like AKM said, no other version said that all GoDs apply to the rule
 
Siding wit fluffy here, it seems that both sub and the dub agree that the fighting between two gods of destruction should lead to the annihilation of two universes.
Thus the gods keep thier original arting, we just add who scales to them including toppo
 
Orange said:
Siding wit fluffy here, it seems that both sub and the dub agree that the fighting between two gods of destruction should lead to the annihilation of two universes.
Thus the gods keep thier original arting, we just add who scales to them including toppo
Click to expand...
Nope, it is just his interpretation, the Japanese clearly said that it is U6 and U7 destruction, which refer to Beerus and Champa this case
 
If translation is this much of an issue, can we just ask one of the wiki's own translator to look at the raw scene and decide what translate/interpretation is most accurate and be done with it/accept there judgment?
 
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