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He wasn't against Ginyu, and thats the only thing that matters in this thread.
Unless you want to start a downgrade thread for Ginyu for this point.
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Captain Ginyu vs King
- Thread starter Ugarik
- Start date
He wasn't against Ginyu, and thats the only thing that matters in this thread.
Unless you want to start a downgrade thread for Ginyu for this point.
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This is wrong as Vegeta and Cui were completely surprised that beings could suppress their power levels, and is why Frieza needed forms to suppress his strength rather than just suppress his ki in his final form, its because the only ones who can do this are the earthlings. This is why the scouters were so important to Frieza and his men and one of the reasons why the Ginyu force had to show up to begin with
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And they then learn to do that.
I don't see why this is relevant. The point is that he knows characters can hold back their true strength, and is 9 times outta 10 going to assume King is just hiding his strength, like LITERALLY EVERYBODY THAT SEES KING DOES.
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Who does Ginyu know who can do that? Vegeta didn't know.
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Goku.
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Kaio-ken (界かい王おう拳けん Kaiōken, lit. "Realm King Fist") is a technique invented by King Kai; however, Goku is the only person ever to use it successfully. It is a technique that multiplies the user's ki for a "heartbeat" - thus increasing their power and speed and enabling them to inflict serious damage to opponents who are considerably stronger than them.
Not unsuppressed or holding back, multiple.
Not unsuppressed or holding back, multiple.
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Dude, he literally suppressed his own power. Ginyu body swapped after fighting him and Goku literally flexing his strength. This Kaioken point is a complete strawman, please do better than this. He suppressed his strength against the other members of the Ginyu Force as well, your point with Kaioken has literally no meaning here.
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Alright, I'll do better in this debate.
Post a scan of Goku suppressing his base power against Ginyu. Haven't seen one from you.
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I'll post a scan about Goku suppressing his power against Jeice and Burter, and Ginyu's statement saying Goku is holding back.
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Then Goku uses Kaio-Ken to that statement. I see the clip.
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Manga > Anime. Give me a minute.
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https://media.**********.net/attachments/666703024781262866/806723073507197008/0203212208.jpg?width=502&height=670
His power level was over 9000 in the Saiyan Saga base, and Ginyu's scouter says 5000. It's pretty damn obvious he's holding back. Why are you even questioning this?
His power level was over 9000 in the Saiyan Saga base, and Ginyu's scouter says 5000. It's pretty damn obvious he's holding back. Why are you even questioning this?
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https://media.**********.net/attachments/666703024781262866/806723402429104168/0203212210.jpg?width=502&height=670
Here's 2 more. Sorry for the poor quality, I got these from someone else and it doesn't seem their lighting was the best.
https://media.**********.net/attachments/666703024781262866/806724039158267914/0203212212.jpg?width=502&height=670
https://media.**********.net/attachments/666703024781262866/806724039598145546/0203212212a.jpg?width=502&height=670
Here's 2 more. Sorry for the poor quality, I got these from someone else and it doesn't seem their lighting was the best.
https://media.**********.net/attachments/666703024781262866/806724039158267914/0203212212.jpg?width=502&height=670
https://media.**********.net/attachments/666703024781262866/806724039598145546/0203212212a.jpg?width=502&height=670
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I mean, that scan you posted proves Ginyu can estimate a power level hidden from him far higher than his Scouter has shown, further proving that it’s a stretch for him to believe King is physically strong to test or believe he is stronger than the likes of Tatsumaki physically and Darkshine, if he can estimate Goku’s growth.
5000 to 60,000 is a big leap on a simple guess.
5000 to 60,000 is a big leap on a simple guess.
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He literally could tell that Goku was stronger than he was letting on. It proves that Goku was holding back, and it's almost directly stated. So, Ginyu is able to tell that King is physically complete fodder. He's credited as the "Strongest man in the world", which Ginyu would come to the conclusion of it's very blatantly false. So, Ginyu just straight up kills him.
The difference in Ginyu and other monsters that were scared of King, is that they weren't able to deduct how powerful King is. He's credited as the STRONGEST man. Physically the strongest. If Ginyu realizes this is false, which he will, he's literally just going to kill King. There's NO REASON he would assume hax when King's reputation is for PHYSICAL STRENGTH.
The difference in Ginyu and other monsters that were scared of King, is that they weren't able to deduct how powerful King is. He's credited as the STRONGEST man. Physically the strongest. If Ginyu realizes this is false, which he will, he's literally just going to kill King. There's NO REASON he would assume hax when King's reputation is for PHYSICAL STRENGTH.
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Sigh, I was dragged in Discord and was sat down.
I guess the reasoning up till now is invalid, because Ginyu does not have enough information to make assumptions about what King can do to him.
I guess the reasoning up till now is invalid, because Ginyu does not have enough information to make assumptions about what King can do to him.
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But isn't like, mysteries which he would feel after seeing king abilities make him scary of king? Or I missed something?
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Nah, he intimidates things that are massively weaker than Ginyu, there's no reason for the intimidation to work on Ginyu.
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Sigh, let me be their mouth piece, without using "the Dragons are fodder so lol, I'm better than you, SBA willing to kill, just means you die in the 1 second of the match because characters that are willing to kill in stories don't talk to each other" argument.
Basically, because of the knowledge Ginyu has of his own verse and OPM's verse, there is nothing for someone human like King in terms of Hax to defeat Ginyu.
If we had a verse that had something like reality warping for characters to make assumptions on, maybe. Not between Dragon Ball and OPM tho.
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When did Extremely High Luck and Social Influencing based Intimidation become power based?
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Shortly saying, even prior knowledge wouldn't help which makes this a stomp thread?
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The intimidation only works because people think he's way stronger than he is, once Ginyu sees that he's actually complete fodder (with the scouter and with his natural intuition or whatever it is that lets him gauge it) he'd just kill him. He more than likely wouldn't care about King's reputation, and even if he thought King was stronger than he is, he would attack King and test his ability. That's in-character for him.
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As for luck, we need to gather the feats for it to see how it works, and post it on King’s profile.
ZetaMarishi
He/Him- 616
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I'll be honest, King on his own probably could not beat Ginyu.
I do think he would SURVIVE an encounter with him and get the credit for it if it were placed in some kind of series, but what it feels more like for me is that it might get Ginyu to want him to fight with his full power instead of holding it back, and giving him a chance. King is about to do something, and then something like Goku comes in and manages to take him out or something. That's probably how that would actually play out. But on his own, he would more than likely get killed.
Even if he did get as much information as possible, though, at most he might get to assume he's a lifewiper or at most planetary based off of the whole Boros situation. It's not like he was raised in the environment that would get him to fear King to the degree that he would need to in order to lose.
I do think he would SURVIVE an encounter with him and get the credit for it if it were placed in some kind of series, but what it feels more like for me is that it might get Ginyu to want him to fight with his full power instead of holding it back, and giving him a chance. King is about to do something, and then something like Goku comes in and manages to take him out or something. That's probably how that would actually play out. But on his own, he would more than likely get killed.
Even if he did get as much information as possible, though, at most he might get to assume he's a lifewiper or at most planetary based off of the whole Boros situation. It's not like he was raised in the environment that would get him to fear King to the degree that he would need to in order to lose.
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Yeah, in SBA, other characters aren't allowed to come in and fight unless they're like, equipment. Which is why I don't think this fight should be on the profiles, it just doesn't work with our standards.
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It’s one of those
“Yeah, he could win since his power calls on others but vs matches don’t allow outside help.”
On that note, in canon, Goku beat Ginyu with outside help. Should we recreate the match here?
“Yeah, he could win since his power calls on others but vs matches don’t allow outside help.”
On that note, in canon, Goku beat Ginyu with outside help. Should we recreate the match here?
ZetaMarishi
He/Him- 616
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Dunno why you want to spite so badly, but I'll throw my answer out here anyway.
They fought in canon and Goku lost. He was left with a broken body because he was caught off guard.
I'll do you one better. Vegeta, who at this point is stronger than anything we've seen Goku put out up to this point, lost to Ginyu because he played with his food too much. While Ginyu was crippled and near death.
Doesn't change that King more than likely loses to Ginyu.
They fought in canon and Goku lost. He was left with a broken body because he was caught off guard.
I'll do you one better. Vegeta, who at this point is stronger than anything we've seen Goku put out up to this point, lost to Ginyu because he played with his food too much. While Ginyu was crippled and near death.
Doesn't change that King more than likely loses to Ginyu.
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It wasn’t out of spite. I was actually interested in the match up cause I learned something new.
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I'm not going to lie you don't make sense you just say whatever benefit you
first he didn't get killed meaning his luck was still there
second he got save by saitama and that goes with the story of him training
and third it shows his luck has limits like people Turing up late to save him
also in nearly every encounter with monster higher then wolf or tiger class he was always saved and this 1 on 1
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Didn't Child Emperor's power level sensing thing fail on King?
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The mask couldn't read king power because he was to weak and it also couldn't read the hero association owner because he was to weak
and for saitama it legit broke the mask
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Yes, but the scouter can read normal people, and King is stated to have the capabilities of an average human. There’s no reason it would fail against King.
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Do I need to take this match to the VS battles removal thread or can it just be removed here?
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Dude, you are just terrible at debating your points and responding to mine. I'm glad Axx came in and sorted things out.
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I made a post on the Vs Battles Removal Thread.
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look you said king was doing a 1v4 because there thought of him so powerful but you didn't add in where black s legit said he going to fight him by him self
anyways forget that you did a good job at debating sorry for acting a bit arrogant
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I'll also apologize. Part of my own toxic behavior came from knowing people wouldn't understand King's power.
It was when the details of King's power (the fact Ginyu had no knowledge of hax to fear against from either verses) is what broke down my core argument.
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