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Dragon Ball Super Revision Thread Z

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It seems that everyone forgot that Tien had actually managed to destroy a massive chunk of Super Katchin, which should be superior to regular Katchin which even the Ki-Infused Z-Sword could not break.

Do we consider this an upgrade for Tien, an outlier, or do we assume this is something he can only do with Neo Tri-Beam, considering something similar happen to Cell?
 
Tien momentarily stopped a High 4-C being with his Shin Kikoho back in the Cell Saga. He's also the type of dude to keep training and thus he probably got way stronger than that. Also DBS Tien is 3-A just like everyone else in the tournament.
 
Kid Gohan damaged 3rd form Frieza and has high 4-C in his key for it. Tien damaged 2nd form Cell, deflected Buutenks's ki blast, and now this feat. Hermila blew apart Piccolo's arms and damaged the stage as well as catching Vegeta off guard.

This would also scale Roshi above him, since he beat Tien under the talisman spell.

Unless every time Tien gets screen time, its an outlier.
 
Didn't Majora also manage to fight against 18 and Krillin? That's a solid thing to make Krillin Tier 4 as well.

(I know this isn't the topic but Tier 4 humans in general is what I'm aiming for)
 
Unite My Rice said:
Kid Gohan damaged 3rd form Frieza and has high 4-C in his key for it. Tien damaged 2nd form Cell, deflected Buutenks's ki blast, and now this feat. Hermila blew apart Piccolo's arms and damaged the stage as well as catching Vegeta off guard.
This would also scale Roshi above him, since he beat Tien under the talisman spell.

Unless every time Tien gets screen time, its an outlier.
Click to expand...
but frieza is Low 4-C at best.
 
We know Krillin got stronger after ep 76 and during his recruitment fight with Goku Goku had to turn super saiyan and Krillin could also somewhat go up against ssb kamehameha shouldn't krillin be scaled to base Goku and we have master roshi who fought Ganos,Tien defeating the sniper who was a problem for Gohan,Piccolo,Vegeta and Goku(all 3A) so shouldn't humans get upgrades but not necessarilly 3A though
 
Here's how it goes:

  • Katchi Katchin is far more durable than normal Katchin
  • Buu Saga Base Gohan would be around Star level. He would at the very least be way stronger than Frieza Saga Base Goku and Casual Final Form Frieza
  • He tried to destroy Katchin with a Ki-Infused Z Sword and failed
  • This means that Katchin is at least unquantifiably above Star level and Katchi Katchin is much stronger
  • This means that everyone who is capable of damaging the Stage is At least far above Buu Saga Base Gohan.
This would make Tienshinhan High 4-C, since he destroyed a huge chunk of the stage with a Kikoho. And this makes sense, since Krillin isn't that far behind 18 in terms of power, who should be as strong as her High 4-C Android Saga self since she never trained.
 
I also don't think that the "It's a Kikoho" argument works. Kikoho is Tien's strongest attack, yes, but it doesn't upgrade him that much.

You can see in Classic Dragon Ball that the Kikoho is only marginally stronger than normal Tien, in the Saiyan Saga that a suicide Kikoho didn't do shit against Nappa even though Tien could easily defeat Saibamen with his fists.

The only reason people think the Kikoho is super impressive is because of the Cell Feat, but that was several Kikohos that nearly killed Tien and it only amounted to leaving Cell annoyed and buying time.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
Here's how it goes:
  • Katchi Katchin is far more durable than normal Katchin
  • Buu Saga Base Gohan would be around Star level. He would at the very least be way stronger than Frieza Saga Base Goku and Casual Final Form Frieza
  • He tried to destroy Katchin with a Ki-Infused Z Sword and failed
  • This means that Katchin is at least unquantifiably above Star level and Katchi Katchin is much stronger
  • This means that everyone who is capable of damaging the Stage is At least far above Buu Saga Base Gohan.
This would make Tienshinhan High 4-C, since he destroyed a huge chunk of the stage with a Kikoho. And this makes sense, since Krillin isn't that far behind 18 in terms of power, who should be as strong as her High 4-C Android Saga self since she never trained.
Click to expand...
I guess tupper should 3-A to since he destroyed part of the arena ...
 
Android 18 is still stronger than them. She hasn't trained at all since the Android Saga and is still stronger than Krillin.
 
Doesnt the Katchkin in the new tounament get cracked and broken by people falling on it? And cracked apart under the weiugh of the giant wolf dude? Whatever his name is. pretty sure we do not really know how strong that stuff is conclusively.
 
Only by people being punched or thrown into it by other characters. We know exactly how strong it is because we know how strong normal Katchin is.
 
"normal Katchin is."

What did the sword that shattered do to prove its durability? Wasnt the arc of the story to break the sword to release Kai to begin with? probably just PIS.
 
No, it definitely wasn't.

Gohan was trying to train with the Z-Sword and wanted to see if it could cut Katchin, which shattered the sword and released the Old Kai.
 
The Everlasting said:
Didn't Majora also manage to fight against 18 and Krillin? That's a solid thing to make Krillin Tier 4 as well.
(I know this isn't the topic but Tier 4 humans in general is what I'm aiming for)
Click to expand...
Yeah, I personally think that Krillin, Tien and roshi being High 4-C is reasonable, or "Likely High 4-C"
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
I also don't think that Roshi and Krillin are stronger than Tien after last episode.
Click to expand...
Roshi battled tien both in his base and MAX power form.

And Krillin has his own feat against Majora, at least for holding his own.
 
18 and Krillin seem to be very comparable, all things considered. They fight as a team against the same opponent.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
18 and Krillin seem to be very comparable, all things considered. They fight as a team against the same opponent.
Click to expand...
Well to be fair, fighting as a team doesn't mean they are equal. We all know 18 is easily superior to the other humans.
 
The Everlasting said:
Didn't Majora also manage to fight against 18 and Krillin? That's a solid thing to make Krillin Tier 4 as well.

(I know this isn't the topic but Tier 4 humans in general is what I'm aiming for)
Click to expand...
...Majora is from Zelda, my friend. ovo (yes, I realize I'm being stupid)
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
Matthew Schroeder said:
18 and Krillin seem to be very comparable, all things considered. They fight as a team against the same opponent.
Click to expand...
Well to be fair, fighting as a team doesn't mean they are equal. We all know 18 is easily superior to the other humans.
Click to expand...
I think Matt's point is that, since they fought well against the same guy, they're clearly comparable.
 
@Matt

I think they do.

But ye, Tier 4 humans.

What do you think should be covered after that?
 
I am fine with upgrading the human Z-fighters.
 
Ant, i have also all the sources to confirm their tier:

1] Roshi:

- Defeated Tie.

- Max Power Roshi fights with Base Goku, who says that he is even stronger than before via training.

- He casually outpaces and plays with Transformed Ganos, who is stronger than Base Ganos that fought with Base Goku.

- He eliminates a Transformed Ganos in Max Power, who got stronger via his ability.

2] Krillin:

- Fought Basill via mental vision from Goku and Goha.

- Put Goku to go SS and SSB, then clashes with his kamehameha.

- Fought Goha and Android 18.

- Punched Shosa, who fought with 18.

- Defeated Majora, who knocked 18.

- 18 deflected SSB Goku kamehameha.

- Android 18 said that she can help 17 by fighting his opponents, including Ribranne.

3] Tien:

- Took a punch from Mystic Goha.

- Eliminated Preecho.

- Destroyed the Super Katchin Blocks, which are more durable than the ones shown here that broke Gohan Z-Sword, who says that he is stonger than before.

- Harmed Hermila, who is not a glass canno, that was able to blast away Piccolo harms and was going to eliminate him.

- His clones restrains and drops Hermila.
 
Okay. Thank you for gathering the information.
 
Sigh, Dark649, listen.

Roshi beating Tien doesn't mean he can be 3-A because he isn't.

Base Goku holds back all the freaking time. You cannot use Base Goku as an argument.

Except that Base Ganos was also matching Master Roshi himself and Transformed Ganos was giving Roshi a hard time and he only beat him through a full-power Kamehameha.

Mental illusions =/= Actual fighters, it's nonsense.

Are you completely ignoring that the same episode established that Suppressed Base Gohan Pre-Training End was much, much stronger than Krillin? The only reason Goku went Super Saiyan Blue was to test Krillin's resolve since there would be opponents on that level of strength in the tournament.

"Fought Gohan". Yeah, and Gohan was holding back and still easily beat Krillin who had to resort to tactics.

"Fought 18". 18 casually stomped him in this scene.

The Tournament of Power fights do show that Krillin is somewhat comparable to 18 although she is still the stronger of the two.

Android 18 helping 17 does not, in any way, shape or form, confirm that they are equal in power. We actually need feats for that and 3-A feats for 18 would be outliers since she has never trained.

Tien took a punch from a heavily suppressed Goha, who didn't want to kill him. Gohan only went 100% power when he fought Goku solo later on.

Tien destroying the Katchi Katchin is a High 4-C feat.

I'm pretty sure the context in the episode was that the fighters were using Attack Reflection / Redirection blasts and this is why they hurt Piccolo, him restraining Hermilla doesn't mean he is 3-A, just means that he can do wrestling moves.

You are continuously omitting context from your Dragon Ball Super posts and arguing almost solely based on still scans rather than full scenes to try and upgrade everyone to 3-A no matter how unreasonable or false the premises are.

High 4-C is as far as the humans go.
 
I am fine with High 4-C.
 
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