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Strongest One Punch Man General Discussion Thread v10

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Along with the above mentioned adjustments I'll also repost one I mentioned before so it also gets sorted:

I believe Garou should only become City level after his fight with Bug God and Royal Ripper. I understand he was considered a Dragon level threat even as a human, but its a little weird to consider that when he's still struggling against two demons several upgrades later. Its not outlandish to think of two Demons being city level of course, but a Dragon struggling against two demons is still pretty strange.

Of course I know the other reason for his tiering was due to damaging Metal Bat; Whilst he most definately is capable of reaching City level since he's canonically capable of fighting Dragon level threats, this is only when he has been pumped up with the right amount of punishment. He still struggles with Demon's whilst at base level, and since his power level is dependant on the amount punishment he's taken, he can still be demon level even whilst pumped up. He's obviously stronger than G4 Genos, having performed better against Kabuto than he did.

So here are my proposed changes for them:

Garou:

Tier: At least High 7-C | At least 7-B | High 6-C | High 6-A

Keys: Human (Hero Hunter Arc - Post Elder Centipede) | Half Monster (Post Bug God/Royal Ripper fight) | Peak Half Monster (Post Darkshine fight; Obviously won't be applied until after that part comes out in the Manga) | Awakened

Bug God and Royal Ripper:

Tier: At least High 7-C, each.

Metal Bat:

Tier: At least High 7-C | Varies from At least High 7-C to 7-B, possibly higher

Keys: Base | Pumped Up
 
Personally I agree with that, but I don't know how others feel about it.
 
Personally I always thought city level Bug God and Royal Ripper was a little iffy.

So I'm fine with said changes.
 
Agree with everything, but I'm not sure I'm a fan of a High 6-C key for half-monster Garou; there's really no frame of reference for how powerful he was in that specific form vs how strong he was when he finished monsterizing immediately after. He beat Golden Sperm rather effortlessly - I don't think there's any real point we can pin down (at least for now) where he was at all comparable to GS, Orochi, Tatsumaki. Pre-Darkshine fight he should still be significantly weaker, and afterward he becomes strong enough to beat them handily.
 
Personally against giving Garou a new High 6-C key then, at least until the manga clarifies. Other than that, I agree with making him High 7-C before that point.
 
SuperAPM said:
He recovered already by that point.
Click to expand...
I meant from being knocked out by Saitama.

Also, Metal Bat was pumped up, he had just fought Elder Centipede and then got even stronger vs Garou.
 
Garou only seemed slightly dazed afterwards, it was only a casual whack after all. But even if he was weakened I don't believe its enough to suggest he was City level at that point.

Metal Bat himself was pumped up to an unknown degree, and EC's whack was far to casual to suggest he broke past the High 7-C barrier at that point. Frankly speaking I don't believe MB even has any City level feats at the moment, he's really only at that level to begin with because of ONE's statements. So overall I'd say its safest to say he was no higher than High 7-C at any point in that fight.
 
Another issue, even if I agree with your points, is that in the VGS Metal Bat lasted three minutes against Carnage Mode Kabuto with no Fighting Spirit amp. Even if he died after that (in the simulation), the minutes of constant beating would heavily back a 7-B durability rating considering Genos was consistently two shot by a base Kabuto fifty-four times in a row.
 
He was knocked out cold.

We can assume it doesn't take hours for Metal Bat to get pumped up enough to be on par with a dragon level threat. He fought Elder Centipede for a decent amount of time, and then fought Garou for a while. Metal Bat's stimulus isn't just the amount of pain he takes either, since his swings were getting stronger and faster even when Garou was just dodging his attacks.

Metal Bat has his own statement that he can take down dragon level threats, ONE's confirmation of this and he also survived three minutes with Carnage Kabuto. That backing is more solid than quite a few of our OPM profiles.
 
Actually I don't think it was ever mentioned that Metal Bat fought Carnage Mode Carnage Kabuto without Fighting Spirit. We can see from his fight with Senior Centipede that he could amp himself with fighting spirit without being severely injured. So he was likely amped when he fought Kabuto but he wasn't at his peak because the simulation thought he was dead.
 
Actually I don't think it was ever mentioned that Metal Bat fought Carnage Mode Carnage Kabuto without Fighting Spirit.

From the Translation its heavily implied that it couldn't properly replicate Fighting Spirit

  • Genos: but that was his first fight with Kabuto and he lasted 3 minutes. That's pretty impressive.
  • Metal Bat: Huh? That's it? It's over?
  • Genos: You lost, Metal Bat, because the damage you sustained were too grave for you to continue.
  • Metal Bat: Huh? What are you talking about? I can totally keep going.
  • Genos: No, when you get injured to that extent, it is over. You are considered "dead" in the virtual world.
  • Metal Bat: No way, Jose. I might have lost in the game world, but in the real world it won't go like that. It might be over once you die in the game world, but in the real world, a death is just a flesh wound. You can totally revive through fighting spirit and have another go, know what I'm saying?!!
 
I think it only couldn't replicate the part where he kept going after being nearly dead. We already saw that he could amp himself to the point where he could one shot Senior Centipede by merely banging his head on his bat. And we know that the simulation can replicate power ups as shown with Carnage Kabuto still being able to use Carnage Mode.
 
So you're saying it could replicate the power increase, just not the adaption and revival abilities of Fighting Spirit?
 
Yeah that's basically what I'm saying. It also does seem a bit more likely than Base Metal Bat who was injured by Senior Centipede suddenly being able to survive 3 minutes against Carnage Mode Carnage Kabuto.
 
Qawsedf234

Here is his fight against Kabuto, skip to 9:10. The simulation in question indicates that after landing several swings, Kabuto only landed a single hit agaisnt him, and that was enough to incapacitate him. Since we know Kabuto likes to play with his victims, as shown with his fights against Genos, it was most likely a held back hit to begin with. So I don't see it as justification for City level druability.

GyroNutz

Yes, but that doesn't suggest he was weakened. He came out with a bloody nose initially but nothing suggets he was anything more than dazed after the fact.

MB's power doesn't increase based on the amount of time he spends fighting, its based specifically on the amount of damage he's recieved. MB at that point had only taken a whack from himself, a single casual whack from EC, and several hits from Garou, none of which suggests he reached City level at that point. MB's swings becoming stronger and faster was specifically due to the damage he had recieved from Garou.

ONE's statements are needed to verify that they are in fact a reflection of his true capabilities, otherwise MB's statements by themselves would be simple unreliable boasts.
 
Huh, if it was only one attack then yeah. Probably not the best 7-B evidence. Though It may be possible it skipped over some sections of the fight.
 
Waking up just after being knocked out very much does suggest that you are weakened. A panel like this one (right after he threw Royal Ripper) suggests he wasn't at full power.

A 'casual whack' that left him bleeding down the head, and in a state that Garou assumed him to be knocked out. Also like I said before Metal Bat's swings were getting faster and stronger even when Garou was just dodging them, showing us that he does get stronger as he fights as well as being able to fight through his injuries.

By themselves, they likely would be yes. But you're acting like ONE's statement is the only thing suggesting he is 7-B. Metal Bat states he can take down dragon level monsters, which is confirmed by ONE. That's what makes it solid evidence he is 7-B.
 
Nothing about that suggests he was weakened to the point of reducing down an entire tier. Not in the same way he did against the heroes in the forest. As it is that scan only suggests he was only dizzy/dazed.

Sure, but what suggests that would allow him to break past the High 7-C barrier? Taking casual whacks from a far superior entity is completely unquantifiable for scaling. And no, again, MB's increasing strength and speed came directly as a result of Garou's numerous strikes, no more than mere moments after taking said hits in the first place. Nothing suggests it was just him simply swinging his bat that was increasing his fighting spirit. Again, Garou's direct quote about his Fighting spirit specifically contradicts the notion that anything other than the amount of damage he's taken increase his power

That would be correct, yes; ONE's statement is the only reason he's 7-B. You yourself just acknowledged the fact that MB's statements by themselves would only be considered unreliably hyperbolic, so it's only the fact that ONE backed them up that we consider it to be literal. If you took MB's statements away he'd still be considered Dragon class in power based solely on ONE, but if you took ONE's statements away he'd only be Demon, since that's where all his feats lay at. That is why I say ONE is the sole reason he's 7-B in the first place.
 
Before we do the potential scaling rollbacks, I believe we should wait for the updated statements on Rover. Bang calls him the strongest pawn of the monster association, Genos and Fubuki also comment on his power. If these statements are changed/retconned they directly affect our scaling here. And the chapter with said statements is very close, timeline wise.
 
Gouketsu and Elder Centipede didn't exist in this context so it could solidify or completely negate our current scaling. Depending on what is said about Rover in the upcoming manga chapters.
 
I have been thinking over those statements for a while, but if they remain exactly as they were to begin with they won't indicate anything:

  • The issue with Bang's comments is that he's never witnessed Gouketsu either in battle or even in general before his death, so any statements about Rover being the MA's most powerful entity won't indicate more than him being above every other cadre other than Gouketsu.
  • Genos however is another story, since he has actually encountered Gouketsu and even commented on the fact that he's the most powerful monster he's ever encountered. So his statement would at least hold more weight. Of course the issue arises if he simply comments on Rover's immense power; That alone won't signify him being more powerful than Gouketsu, just simply places him amongst the top of the MA in general, which should already be obvious.
 
The problem is that we're gonna be waiting for a while, so I'd say we should adjust their tiers down to 7-B for the time being and wait to see if it's correct to place them back up to 7-A.
 
I'm fine if its a couple weeks or even 3 to 4 months but I have a feeling its gonna be a lot longer than that.
 
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