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The King wants his throne back (Ikki vs Jin Mo-Ri Redux) Grace

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If no one else is going to, guess I'll start us off.

Mori has experience in mimicking fighting techniques that take years to master. Case in point, Mira has been mastering Wolfgang Swordsmanship since she was a child and Mori copied it perfectly after just seeing it. Same goes for Daewi's Full Contact Karate and Ilpyo's Ssam-Su Taekkyeon.

Might I also add that in both Daewi and Ilpyo's fights, Mori adapted and overcame them by learning how to counter them as the fight was going on. After getting hit by Blue Dragon's Storm, Mori literally came up with his own stronger version on the spot and thrashed Daewi with it. And after having his go-to martial art completely countered, he fixed the errors of his fighting technique on the spot and managed to beat a guy who's whole martial art revolved around countering Re-Taekwondo and abusing it's flaws.

This on top of the insane boosts to AP and speed acupuncture give him, and you've got yourself one hard monkey to kill.
 
Something about more Ikki x Stella talk than actual debate. Also Mori's experience was serverly downplayed in the original thread.
 
Ikki did the same to a style that took a lifetime to master without even seeing it, just by seeing the stance.

Ikki perfected a sword technique after 30 seconds of copying it, as his very first feat against stella.

Insane boosts are 8x right?

@Ion

Different keys.

Why is this even called redux? It's not a redux, it's the same fighters, but different keys.
 
Yes, the maximum Mori has used the multiplier in this key is x8.
 
Ikki's most infamous stat amp is 10x. He also has the 100x on top of it. So basically.

Ikki can copy just by seeing the stance, a feat better than Jin's copying feat.

He can perfect styles quicker than Jin.

Has better stat amp.

And trackless step on top of it all.

Needless to say, i vote ikki for the reasons i mentioned.
 
Perfect Vision should be better than Mori-Jin's mimicking ability. Ikki should be able to replicate his martial arts techniques.

Can he deal with Trackless Step?
 
EmperorRorepme said:
Blade Steal is sword techniques. Perfect Vision is basically everything else that isn't a magic ability.
Click to expand...
Technically Blade Steal isn't sword technique either. Blade steal is more about the copying the fighting style while Perfect Vision is just the better blade steal which also has precog.
 
I'm fairly certain that Jin has copied stuff from stances alone several times, but i;d need to check

You act like Trackless Step is just straight up invisibility, rather than the resistance to ESP that you have said taht it is several times. Make up your mind.

I'm also fairly certain that Jin can mess with techniques better than Ikki.

Ikki does have better stat amp......kinda. Re-Taekwondo goes from barely damaging people to completely mauling them in a couple of hits, on top of the acupuncture. Plus Ikki using his boost is super ooc iirc, althought the same can be said of Jin in most cases.
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Dienomite22 said:
Can is Ikki's copying only limited to sword techniques?
Click to expand...
Nope. It's not limited to martial arts at all. He copied body control from edelweiss.
Click to expand...
Body control isn't martial arts, is there an instance where he copied martial arts?
 
There's no significant argument. Even if Jin and Ikki have the same mimicking they cancel out. Plus if Ikki has a better stat amp then that's not a point
 
It makes people unable to percieve him by all senses. It is not invisbility. He walked past a group of interviewers who were looking for him, and none of them noticed because of trackless step. It's not invisibility but it's better than invisbility, like a lot of characters have. Because you can't sense it at all not just unable to see it.

This is not an argument. As in that's just your opinion.

Ittou Shura is not ooc, ittou rasetsu is usually ooc. Ittou shura is rather in character. Most fights for Ikki use Ittou Shura.
 
Trackless Step is just a martial art technique which makes the brain think you aren't important enough to be perceived basically. So they move "into the opponents subcoinciousness".
 
EmperorRorepme said:
He copied a martial art which allowed him to move at his top speed without accelerating.
Click to expand...
Was it considered a martial art in verse or was it possible to do it thanks to his control over his body?
 
Dienomite22 said:
Was it considered a martial art in verse or was it possible to do it thanks to his control over his body?
Click to expand...
It was technique yes. A girl could accelerate from 0 to top speed via technique. I am not sure how she does that it was never explained but he copied it.
 
@Emp

not gonna dignify that with a response.

@Earl

Except that you've said it simply made him unable to be seen with anything but the five standard senses. Regardless, Jin can see invisible things.

Not really? Oven's post shows examples of that, although they're close enough in this that it's hard to tell who beats who in this regard.

So......Jin copies Ittou Shura and uses it or uses acupuncture and outlasts since he's lasted way longer than a minute under full acupuncture boosts before.
 
Thats not how it works. He can't perceive him because his brain doesn't. So he can't see Ikki.

You can't copy Ittou Shura it's a blazer ability not a martial art.
 
@H13

Wait when did i actually say, he can be sensed with the 5 senses but not otherwise? I'm pretty sure i you just missunderstood my point wherever you read it. Also "It is not invisibility" "Jin can see invisible things"...really?

That's still your opinion. Give me actual feats to work with please.

Ittou shura uses magic. Ittou amps are the only thing that require magic. So yeah. Also he won't be copying anything when getting blitzed.
 
EmperorRorepme said:
Thats not how it works. He can't perceive him because his brain doesn't. So he can't see Ikki.

You can't copy Ittou Shura it's a blazer ability not a martial art.
Click to expand...
A normal human brain also doesn't percieve ghosts. But guess what Jin can see?

The page doesn't say this at all and it is very similar to Jin's acupuncture, which he copied froms someone else, in method and effect.
 
Hl3 or bust said:
A normal human brain also doesn't percieve ghosts. But guess what Jin can see?

The page doesn't say this at all and it is very similar to Jin's acupuncture, which he copied froms someone else, in method and effect.
Click to expand...
There is a difference between "can't" and "won't". Seeing ghosts doesn't mean he doesn't trick your brain into not sensing him.

It uses magic.
 
i will obviously ask people to stay calm and respectful this round. This got kinda heated in the discord channel already, no need to raise it further than that.
 
Again that's not how it works. His brain is telling his senses that there is nothing there because Trackless Step tricks the brain into thinking that whoever is usng it is not significant enough to be perceived. Therefore, again, Ikki isn't seen.
 
First Witch said:
i will obviously ask people to stay calm and respectful this round. This got kinda heated in the discord channel already, no need to raise it further than that.
Click to expand...
I appreciate the concern, but it seems pretty chill here tbh. I don't really feel any hostility going around.
 
@Earl

You said that in either Ikki vs Yujiro or the other version of this thread iirc. Sorry if i'm misremembering.

whatever. Oven gave you feats of this and you are clearly just ignoring them.

Ok. Also, apparently this form of Jin is a lot more open to using acupuncture than i remembered, since he opened several fights with it iirc.

Your explaination of Trackless Step is literally just normal invisibility. Even if it wasn't, Jin would be more than able to notice that something was up and adjust, which is more than possible according to Ikki's page
 
It isn't normal invisibility. Invisibility isn't tricking the brain. It's just you cannot be seen.

Jin has to actually adapt if he can anyway. Apparently to counter Trackless Step you have to move your sense to the uncoincious and find the information of Ikki to see him but how will he if Ikki attacks and kills him?
 
>Invisibility isn't tricking the brain

except that it literally is. Regardless, finding out what's going on at 8x speed is gonna be pretty easy.
 
No it literally isn't. Invisibility isn't tricking perception. It just means you cannot be seen by the naked eye. And that's it. It doesn't trick the brain in any fashion.

Anyway let me assume invisibility is tricking the brain for arguments sake. Even if it was it isn't shifting the perception of the opponent to the subcoincious because nothing is being perceived. On the other hand the brain is actually perceiving Ikki it's just taking him in as useless information and pushing it into the subcioncious.

Ikki can also stat amp.
 
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