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Epic Persona 5 Revisions (Formerly known as Yaldy (Personaugh) revisions (Mostly hax))

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Ok so since the current page is absolute trash i've taken it upon myself to make sure this dude is soloing tier 4 like he should be.

Treasures are the centers of palaces, they along with their rulers passively sustain the palace that formed from them. Yaldy, aka the holy grail, isn't just the treasure of 1 palace but of all of Mementos, but with sentience and an obligation to uphold the order it represents.Destroying it would erase the entire metaverse, the world of the unconscious.

Essentially he is the core of cognition and subconscious thought themselves.

It's also suggested here that Yaldy is not just the treasure of Mementos, but also its ruler at the same time. Mementos is basically the collective unconscious, the shared palace, of all of humanity. Yaldy himself reaffirms way later that he is the administrator of the collective unconsciousness, backing up the idea that he is indeed the unconscious' ruler as well as treasure.

So yeah that's what puts him way above anyone else in P5 basically. Keep in mind that this is all a mental/astral/conceptual/whatever-tf-u-call-it location, not a physical one.

Yaldy doesn't just sustain cognition though, definitely not.

Yaldy is capable of manipulating cognition to however he needs it to be. For example, it's implied he caused the entirety of the public to have a lessened reaction to the Phantom Thieves, with many people close to protag kun remarking about how it wasn't normal and totally out of line with what people thought earlier. Some were even saying strange stuff that oddly lined up with Yaldy's decisions to control, and later to purge and recreate, humanity.

Mind and perception manip, and because cognition is basically its own mental-construct universe in P5 it probably also count as reality warping.

Here he basically caused people to view even a world merged with Mementos as normal. Only the Phantom Thieves and the certain people with in-game social links noticed something off.

Yaldy offers to strike a deal with the protagonist here. His side of the deal is him agreeing to separate reality and cognition again (That is elaborated on further down), as well as rewriting all of humanity's cognition to have them praise the Phantom Thieves as heroes as opposed to them simply forgetting about them. It's possible to actually accept this deal in-game, and doing so will trigger a bad end in which Yaldy will stay true to his word and do exactly what he describes above. More reality warping stuff basically.

Mementos is also known as the prison of sloth or regression because of the collective attitude of humanity. Yaldy confirms the above himself as well. Basically all of humanity wishes to be lazy to the point where someone else does even thinking for them, and Mementos - the palace and cognition of all humans, the collective unconscious - changed form to represent that. Yaldy is the treasure, the core, of these desires.

This is more stuff that backs up Yaldo's status as the core of cognition. Yaldy goes into further depth about why he became a god in the first place, outright confirming the above.

Now before you start saying "Lmfao just kill all huamns/sentient life-forms and he dies", Yaldy can apparently afford to toy with the very things that give him his immortality and existence. He even goes as far as to state that whether reality and humanity get destroyed and recreated or not is just entertainment to him, and this is proven by him quite literally making a game (That he even rigged in favor of recreation, to boot) out of it.

You could probably argue high godly regen with that but i'm not gonna go there for now, especially because he's got some way more solid low godly stuff (mentioned below). He also talks about wanting to purge humanity. Here he is just straight-up erasing humans from existence himself.

Existence erasure but I prolly didn't even need to state it myself.

Yaldy is empowered by humanity's unconscious wishes as well as Mementos itself, using them to grow stronger (Represented by his color changing) and nullify all damage dealt to it. He also makes it clear that he embodies the unconscious itself, more specifically he represents people's sloth and desire for order and control. The veins basically give him his damage negation, which are connected to all of Mementos. They're also connected to the cages that contain the shadows of individual humans.

This is essentially types 1, 3 and 8 of immortality, type 3 because he can regenerate damage completely (and amp himself while doing it, that bit would give him reactive evo going off this page's logic), and 8 + abstract existence because of embodying the distorted unconscious desires of humanity. As long as sinful desires exist in anyone's cognition, he will exist as well.

Here, Yaldy basically decides to "encroach upon reality itself", which he does by bringing reality and cognition together. This bit could count as more reality warping, but because he's warping the boundary between reality and cognition specifically + his reality warping hasn't been shown to extend past the cognitive world (Aside from in specific circumstances), I tend to think of it as closer to limited boundary manipulation.

It's a good thing that Yaldy passively and fully controls Mementos, because once he blurred the boundary between reality and cognition, his order and the rules of the cognitive world were imposed over reality's in this new merged world. An example of this was the Phantom Thieves being erased from existence and sent to the Velvet Room; this happened because the Thieves were forgotten by society thanks to Yaldy's doing, and once they ceased to exist in cognition they ceased to exist in reality, which had been painted over with Mementos. Basically he brought them together, and once that happened he showed up in reality + his reality warping could work in reality. Essentially he is a non-corporeal abstract entity made of pure unconscious thought up until he decides to paint over reality with the cognitive world, at which point he's already got control over the whole thing. More stuff that basically reaffirms the above. Also further suggests that Yaldy was responsible for people forgetting about the Thieves. Yaldy can also undo all that reality warping boundary manip garbage on a whim + rewrite the cognitive world if he ever wanted to, as he does exactly that in a bad end to the game. Kinda redundant but this particular moment pulls multiple aspects of his abilities together nicely so I decided to squish it in a few times.

Yaldy split Lavenza's soul into 2 separate beings, known as Caroline and Justine. Mind and probably Soul manip right here.

He also sealed Lav's memories and extra-sensory perception, which didn't fully return until after she regained her form. Sealing, Power null and Memory manip as well.

Yaldy can also alter your memory severely, to the point where you aren't able to remember how to use your abilities. More Memory manip.

It's revealed that Yaldy banished the real Igor from the Velvet Room and locked him out. BFR and more Sealing.

Going back to earlier for a little bit, Yaldy, as the Holy Grail, could also expel the Thieves from Mementos casually. More BFR.

Yaldy took over the Velvet Room and could even seal Igor's powers alongside himself, according to this. More Sealing and Power null.

He also sealed the entire Velvet Room inside Mementos. Even more Sealing and probably more BFR as well, these can apparently work on entire pocket dimensions.

So to sum that up, Yaldy took over the Velvet Room after casually bodying Igor and the attendants, sealed their powers and stuff.

Now and then, Yaldy will say something about "I am disappointed in u humans" or "I had hoped for u to not disappoint me but noooo" or "No am not doing this", but at those times he's just acting snarky about how cool he thinks he is. Yaldy actually planned everything that happened above, as if it were a game he rigged. Everything happened exactly how he thought it would, and wanted it to. Just to make sure no one brings that up.

Another thing i'd like to say is that Yaldy was literally fighting the P thieves with gestures in the actual fight and didn't actually get serious until they started yelling at him right after getting wiped out, just to stop the "If he has _ why didn't he use in fihgt" before it begins. Absolutely no one in P5 scales to a serious Yaldy except for Satanael.

To wrap this up, In the second half of the fight against him, Yaldy is capable of controlling the 7 evils of mankind themselves, also known as the 7 deadly sins. He basically imposes these concepts onto his foes, ailing them with various status effects in the process. Concept manip essentially, but their individual effects grant him some other stuff as well.

The first of the evils Yaldy uses is Lust. This is basically empathetic manipulation on the conceptual level, and it is unable to be nullified by things that cure empathetic manipulation normally.

The second evil Yaldy uses is Vanity. What Yaldy does here is use the concept of Vanity to create an effect similar to what shadow Madarame's Artist's Grace does; it overwrites all of one's resistances with severe weaknesses to every type of attack.

The third is Gluttony. Yaldy uses this to basically make attacks cost way more than what they normally do; if an attack requires physical strain, it will take way more of that with this active, for an example. In-game this translates to skill cost being doubled.

The fourth is Wrath. As with Lust, this effect seems to also be empathetic manip on the conceptual level, except with anger instead of lust.

The fifth is Greed. This one is probably the least impressive of the 7, all it really does is cause harm to an enemy and cause them to become hungry.

The sixth is Envy. As with Lust and Wrath, empathetic manip on the conceptual level. Not much different from those two.

The seventh is Pride. This one is different from the others in that Yaldy casts it on himself instead of an enemy. While Distorted Pride is up, any offense dealt to Yaldy, be it physical harm, an attempted status ailment, statistic debuff or etc, will be returned to the offender in the form of an attack to their stamina and magic power.

Also his entire arsenal of attacks is like 95% almighty so I feel like that should be mentioned as well.

And for the love of god, jesus and the holy spirit use a better pic, actually we prolly need 1 for each of his different forms because technically the holy grail is just Yaldy's base form.
 
I am the bump of my thread

Impatient is my mind and attention-mongering is also my mind

I have created over a thousand threads

Unknown to mods, Nor known to members.

Have withstood pain to create many posts

Yet, those threads will never hold any comments

So as I pray,

Unlimited Bump Works.
 
Yaldy needs to be capable of affecting actual reality in order to accomplish what he did in fusing reality with Mementos. Not sure why it would be boundary manipulation, rather than outright control. So he was basically maintaining a realm consisting of our universe and the cogntive metaverse.


Good summary overall.
 
I worded it kinda badly in the thread, what I meant by that was basically that he needs to actually bring the two together before his reality warping will work on both
 
^What Yobo said.

You'd have to show to not be able to die as long as the concept exists, or outright be one with the concept itself to actually gain type 8.
 
^uhmmm, Yaldabaoth literally is the one with the concept of Collective Unconscious. He is literally the Palace of Mementos/creator.
 
DMB 1 said:
^What Yobo said.
You'd have to show to not be able to die as long as the concept exists, or outright be one with the concept itself to actually gain type 8.
>Quite literally said himself that was the case
 
I am the bump of my thread

Impatient is my mind and attention-mongering is also my mind

I have created over a thousand threads

Unknown to mods, Nor known to members.

Have withstood pain to create many posts

Yet, those threads will never hold any comments

So as I pray,

Unlimited Bump Works.
 
Well we've got what looks like 4 votes so far, but we need at least 1 mod's approval as well as members iirc

Edit: as of like 9 minutes after this comment, 5
 
So like is there an active discussion for Universal+ Yaldabaoth? I've seen people saying wait but I don't see public discussion on it and it's been like over a month I believe.I think there is plenty enough evidence for his fusion of mementos/reality being actual reality itself. From taking over the velvet room, controlling/creating the metaverse, Galaxy level characters being fodder to him, to resetting timelines.

I think a very underlooked point also exist here

https://youtu.be/1qJ0SYReCYk?t=131

Morgana clearly states that "the whole world" (reality aka universe in this context) is made up by cognition, and explicitly notes he is talking about our reality. "There's no such thing as the real world. What each person sees and feels, those are what shape reality. This is what gives the world infinite potential."

This is pretty much confirmed by Morgana coming back into existence because of the feelings held in the PT heart.
 
Universal+ Yaldy is a very real possibility as well. So far the only argument against it I've seen is "But then he'd be on Nyarly's tier and that's no."
 
I mean it's pretty much confirmed by Morgana that the realworld/metaverse boundaries are superficial on a fundamental level. Essentially making them connected analogues. This makes Yald's feats much more concrete and scalable to physical reality control.

That doesn't really work as a counter argument as it assumes no character can ever reach their level for whatever reason and I'm also pretty sure P1/P2 are universal. Yaldy is in a fine position to be on that level given his obvious feats of that level (which she be enough in of themselves) along with his special status among Persona antagonist of the new generation. He has casual reality control, controls the "verse" of cognition, and is the only one whose ever gone straight into Igor's crib and take that shit over. Making him a threat to the cognitive universe, the physical universe, and even a realm that exist in between them (VR).

We shall slay them together.
 
Voice your opinions in my thread and bring up to the mods in their to check this out. These changes should be pretty open and shut tbh.
 
Yeah this is fine.

Edit: Regarding the 7 Sins, they should qualify for Concept Manipulation (Type 4), but it also seems to borrow aspects of Realism/Idealism.

Still fine with it.
 
Where is the evidence for Type 8 being part of his Abstract Existence?

And while we're at it, what proof is there that the 7 Deadly Sins are treated as concepts here?
 
Also, surviving the death of humanity doesn't imply he would disappear or be erased and then return, so there is no reason it would be Godly regen whatsoever.
 
Yobo Blue said:
Where is the evidence for Type 8 being part of his Abstract Existence?
I believe we've already been over this, the actual scans themselves directly state that he cannot die as long as people subconsciously desire his control.

Yobo Blue said:
And while we're at it, what proof is there that the 7 Deadly Sins are treated as concepts here?
Mostly context and such. Yaldy is the administrator of the collective unconscious, which basically means he controls humanity's thoughts, and by extension perceptions, themselves. So with that in mind he would be controlling humanity's collective perception of what each sin is.

Yobo Blue said:
Also, surviving the death of humanity doesn't imply he would disappear or be erased and then return, so there is no reason it would be Godly regen whatsoever.
The level of regen i'm actually arguing for doesn't come from that, as I stated very clearly in the OP.

But despite that, i'm just gonna bite the bait rq and defend it anyways. Someone who exists as the core of a race's cognition disappearing when the race itself does is the default assumption, since cognition wouldn't really exist if there was no one around to think.
 
Can you point me to which scan? It's a bit hard to find in the OP

That doesn't equate to Conceptual Manipulation

None of the other evidence is sufficient for even Low-Godly, and the default assumption if he's saying he would survive is that he wouldn't die, not that he would die and come back.
 
All Persona Dieties we have seen have some variant of Type 8 (well at least the ones beyond 3). Nyx is the embodiment of Death. Izanami is the embodiment of Truth. Yaldaboath is the embodiment of Humanity.

And Yaldy also has a pretty control over the seven sins due to A. The previous 7 bosseses were all metaphors for the 7 sins and Yaldy is immensely above them. B. Even if you ignore that, Yaldy said himself he manipulates the concepts mankind percieve all wrongdoing as iirc. This is blatant Type 4 Concept Manipulation.

The only one I am sort of iffy on is Regen, but I am definitely fine with the revisions.
 
Yobo Blue said:
Yes it does. It is in the Type 4 category:

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Conceptual_Manipulation

"Such concepts are abstract, but do not govern reality. Instead, these concepts are governed by the perception of these concepts by sentient beings. Without the perception of other beings, these concepts would cease to exist. As such, these concepts are far more vulnerable and are generally lesser when compared to all other abstract concepts. However, these concepts are truly abstract, and manipulating the abstract concept itself is still conceptual manipulation. "
 
Perception of the concept are not the concept itself. I only agree with this if he said he manipulated the concepts rather then the perception of them.
 
Yobo Blue said:
Perception of the concept are not the concept itself. I only agree with this if he said he manipulated the concepts rather then the perception of them.
Still qualifies according to OP: "while directly destroying all concepts of this level and thus blocking all perception would qualify." Ask Matt tho if you are skeptical or Dragon. Edit: That said, I could be wrong and misinterperting something, it seems fine tho at first and second glances.
 
Yobo Blue said:
Perception of the concept are not the concept itself. I only agree with this if he said he manipulated the concepts rather then the perception of them.
That's actually type 4 Conceptual Manipulation, I think.
 
From my understanding, it's saying that concepts affect perception, not the other way around
 
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