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Zeno's tier

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Mister_Death

Mister_Death

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I have a question, as it seems after the latest episode, Zeno was downgraded(?) to just tier 2(instead of atleast). Is it because he has a version of himself in a different timeline? Just need some clarification, as I myself don't remember seeing it discussed anywhere.

I figured he was only 2-C because we don't know, in entirety, the structure of the DB Universes, and whether it contains infinite dimensions and such.
 
There is one Zen'o for every set of timelines, hence his destruction of "all of existence" is strictly limited to a set of universes and not all variations of said universes, since one Zen'o would not be able to ranomly murder a bunch of copies of himself all equal in strength.
 
^

There has been instances of characters in other verses being ranked higher than Zeno and having a counterpart


Far as I'm concerned, another Zeno existing doesn't(or shouldn't) make him any less dangerous

He still nuked 6 universes (As in future trunks timeline, it's also twelve universes, which means those universes don't exist in any timeline)

And there's still the talk of him destroying all of existence, which would only leave the Zenos that were formed as a result of the main timeline being split.

Don't see the reason for the downgrade to be honest, or rather, I don't understand how the existence of another Zeno would downgrade him.
 
If said characters ranked higher than Zen'o have a counterpart, it's because they can still destroy more than Zen'o. The Zen'o of one set of timelines has no jurisdiction over the others. The one from Future Trunks' timeline didn't even know Goku existed.

Zen'o has really been nothing but hype up until now. All we know is that he can destroy 12-18 universes. We were pretty generous in his rating before, since nothing actually suggested there to only be one Zen'o who could wipe out all timelines, but we now know for a fact that isn't the case.
 
Anime4Life2020 said:
Just a quick question: When Zeno destroyed Zamasu how many universes were destroyed in that scene?
Click to expand...
With certainty? One.

Could be twelve if we assume he meant all 12 universes in that set of timelines when he said "world".
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
Anime4Life2020 said:
Just a quick question: When Zeno destroyed Zamasu how many universes were destroyed in that scene?
Click to expand...
With certainty? One.
Could be twelve if we assume he meant all 12 universes in that set of timelines when he said "world".
Click to expand...
Oh.....kk thanks

Im gonna make a thread about something concerning this in a bit but it might not be what some people find interesting....
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
If said characters ranked higher than Zen'o have a counterpart, it's because they can still destroy more than Zen'o. The Zen'o of one set of timelines has no jurisdiction over the others. The one from Future Trunks' timeline didn't even know Goku existed.
Zen'o has really been nothing but hype up until now. All we know is that he can destroy 12-18 universes. We were pretty generous in his rating before, since nothing actually suggested there to only be one Zen'o who could wipe out all timelines, but we now know for a fact that isn't the case.
Click to expand...
Beerus and the kai's from the main timeline bowed to the future zeno as they would the main timeline version, so I'm pretty sure Zeno as a collective entity, individually, however many there are, still have jurisdiction over everything, and are equal with each other. Besides that, nothing has really changed. Though, I was just looking for a reason, and I figured it had something to do with future zeno.

The existence of multiple Zenos wouldn't really mean much if he can still wipe out existence. Which I can agree is hype.(EDIT: Though, character statements are backed up somewhat)

But the tier didn't change until today, so, if it were just the hype to be at fault, I imagine the downgrade would have happened long ago.

off topic, my back hurts.
 
Mister Death said:
snip
Click to expand...
If Zen'o was shown to be a collective entity, Zen'o would have instantly known about his alternate self coming to visit, but he didn't. The Kais and Beerus would obviously bow to alternate Zen'o as well, since they're terrified of him.

A collective Zen'o with multiple avatars destroying all timelines could definitely be legit, but that's pretty much not the case at all due to recent events.
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
Anime4Life2020 said:
Just a quick question: When Zeno destroyed Zamasu how many universes were destroyed in that scene?
Click to expand...
With certainty? One.
Could be twelve if we assume he meant all 12 universes in that set of timelines when he said "world".
Click to expand...
iirc, in DBS the word World is used to refer to the 12 Universes, so, I think he destroyed the "Multiverse" or World
 
If Zen'ō truly destroyed all of Trunks' timeline, wouldn't that mean he destroyed 12 universes as well? Since each timeline has that many universes.
 
Ryukama said:
If Zen'ō truly destroyed all of Trunks' timeline, wouldn't that mean he destroyed 12 universes as well? Since each timeline has that many universes.
Click to expand...
Presumably.

Though didn't they later go back to the same timeline before it was destroyed?
 
Ryukama said:
If Zen'ō truly destroyed all of Trunks' timeline, wouldn't that mean he destroyed 12 universes as well? Since each timeline has that many universes.
Click to expand...
I think it's not necessary, you can erase spacetime of a single universe. That would count as erasing timeline for that universe in my opinion.
 
I dont think so as why would he? Out of all 12 universes, the only universe Zeno disliked was U7 given Zamasu becoming one with it. He has no reason to target the other 11 universes and I highly doubt he would destroy them without a reason. Destroying all 12 seems somewhat speculative in my opinion. Tho I'll address this in the Zeno thread I plan to make later
 
^Not the same one, a different one, I think. i would have to rewatch the episode


And I used collective entity in the wrong context, my mistake.
 
Each timeline has 12 Universes. Trunks' timeline has its own 12 Gods of Destruction and such. If he destroyed Trunks' entire timeline (which may or may not have happened, will have to rewatch the episode again) then he should've destroyed all 12 universes.
 
Anime4Life2020 said:
I dont think so as why would he? Out of all 12 universes, the only universe Zeno disliked was U7 given Zamasu becoming one with it. He has no reason to target the other 11 universes and I highly doubt he would destroy them without a reason. Destroying all 12 seems somewhat speculative in my opinion. Tho I'll address this in the Zeno thread I plan to make later
Click to expand...
I through that were stated that Zen'o destroyed the multiverse; I didn't read that in the spanish sub, but I don't trust much that sub since it say that the galaxies there are solar systems.

And yeah @Azzy, Goku were back in time, that is one of the reasons why I said that the time weren't erased...
 
Ryukama said:
Each timeline has 12 Universes. Trunks' timeline has its own 12 Gods of Destruction and such. If he destroyed Trunks' entire timeline (which may or may not have happened, will have to rewatch the episode again) then he should've destroyed all 12 universes.
Click to expand...
I don't remember Zeno saying he destroyed the entire timeline. It said the world (sekai). It could very well be just Universe 7 only (since Zamasu merged with just Universe 7, not all other universe). We didn't see Zamasu spreading his aura across other universes
 
^ I'm assuming he destroyed future trunks' timeline in universe 7 only.

You know, unless each universe doesn't have their own space-time or something

In which case, all 12 are a goner, by logic.
 
Mister Death said:
^ I'm assuming he destroyed future trunks' timeline in universe 7 only.
You know, unless each universe doesn't have their own space-time or something

In which case, all 12 are a goner, by logic.
Click to expand...
Well all universe should have their own space-time, otherwise they're not universe at all. So Zeno technically needed to erase just one universe to get rid of Zamasu. That would count as erasing timeline for that single universe.
 
Well it seems they can all be destroyed only if they dont have their own space time

And if they dont have their own space-time, then wouldnt that Downgrade Zeno to like 3-A or High 3-A? Him being tier 2 in the first place is because of the idea that each universe was their own separate space-time.
 
Even if all the 12 universes are connected and only a single timeline exists in Dragon Ball (which simply isn't true) then Zen'ō being able to destroy it would still put him at Low 2-C.
 
Anime4Life2020 said:
Well it seems they can all be destroyed only if they dont have their own space time
And if they dont have their own space-time, then wouldnt that Downgrade Zeno to like 3-A or High 3-A? Him being tier 2 in the first place is because of the idea that each universe was their own separate space-time.
Click to expand...
Even destroying a single universe spacetime is low 2-C from what I see. There's no way Zeno is below Low 2-C.
 
Anime4Life2020 said:
Well it seems they can all be destroyed only if they dont have their own space time
And if they dont have their own space-time, then wouldnt that Downgrade Zeno to like 3-A or High 3-A? Him being tier 2 in the first place is because of the idea that each universe was their own separate space-time.
Click to expand...
...it's actually literally impossible for it to be assumed Zeno is lower than 2-C after the latest episode
 
Anime4Life2020 said:
I wouldnt say that. But yea him being below Low 2-C does seem rather absurd so kk.
Click to expand...
It's impossible for him to be below low 2-C Because he neg diffed Zamasu, a low 2-C being

Mostly this thread's purpose was to discuss Zeno's rating as a being potentially higher than 2-C
 
Beating another Low 2-C being does not make you 2-C in anyway, otherwise for example, Arceus from Pokemon would be 2-C or At Least 2-C in just his Incomplete Form alone since he stomped Dialga, Palkia and Giratina with massive ease, 3 Low 2-C beings
 
Zen'ō's definitely not being reduced below Tier 2. That's out of the question.

However there seems to be some confusion regarding the cosmology of DB.

Earlier on it was established that each timeline has its own set of 12 universes. With Trunks' timeline alone having its own 12 GoDs and an Omni-King to rule them all.

However from what was shown with Zamasu, his feats, his death and what some people here appear to be saying, it's now more like each universe has its own timeline. With Universe 7 having its own past, present and future separate from the other universes.

It seems uncertain to me. Perhaps someone else could help explain this to me.
 
@Ryu

Well, Goku Black and Future Zamasu have killed the other Gods of Destruction and Supreme Kais in all the 12 universes in Trunks' future.
 
@Ever that's what I was thinking. That each timeline has 12 universes of its own. But it seems others believe differently.
 
@Ever Basically the two of them killed all of the Supreme Kais which in return kills all the Gods of Destruction including Beerus which it is very well implied that each universe has its own timeline.
 
There's also the very fact that Future Zamasu and Future Gowasu exist despite being from Universe 10.
 
I think it's pretty confusing whether each timeline is shared or not, wasn't a new time ring created again from the events involving trunks or was that cause of what whis did, he said he was gonna make another one of trunk's timeline so i am guessing that's why there is a new time ring?

From what we can see practically the whole multiverse has the same timeline, when a new timeline is created a copy of the entire 12 universe is also made, so if someone from universe 7 messes with time and creates a new timeline it also affects the other universes?

Idk, there could be grounds to say the entire multiverse share the same timeline, would sharing the same timeline also mean they share the same space-time continuum? If that is the case destroying the multiverse is just low 2-C? This is confusing.
 
Im making a post about this now but personally, I think Zeno's feat from the last episode kinda makes his overall tier an outlier, unless someone can prove he destroyed all the universes and that they share the same space-time

Of course Zeno is not going to be downgraded below tier 2 at all as the least he'll be is Low 2-C but i have my reasoning for why this might be outlierish. Please dont get mad, its just my personal interpretation and thought into the matter and if u want me to explain first I will.
 
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