Will the real Nova rise up?

[Tllmbrg]

This CRT will cover both Sam and Rider
For Sam it'll be mainly a P&A revision and adding a Weirdworld Key while for Rider it's adding a keys for pre Full Nova Force and Cancerverse while arguing full Nova force Rider is 4-B

Additional powers for Sam
1) Light Manipulation (Strong enough to blind a person) - Marvel NOW! Point One issue 1
2) Healing (Can push poison from a dog) -
3) Attack Reflection (Shown here) -
4) Underwater Breathing Type 3 (His helmet supplies him with air in space) - Champions Volume 2 Issue 2
5) Resistance to heat and radiation - Nova Volume 5 Issue 3 and
Telekinesis and automatic translation both appear in Champions Volume 2 Issue 2
I'll also add scans for existing powers, while regeneration should be removed unless someone else can find a scan of that

Possible LS Upgrade
Could lift a Ferris wheel -

Weirdworld Key
This's Sam while being in Weirdworld, which is magical land where he didn't have access to his Nova helmet and lost his memories being mentored by a villain the Champions were chasing

Stats: 10-A physically, 9-C with a sword (Was trained to be a warrior and wields what seem to a European Longsword) and 9-B with powers (Made a crystal man explode) - Champions Volume 2 Issues 25-26
P&A: Weapon Mastery, Flight, Energy Projection (Shown here and here) - Champions Volume 2 Issues 25-26
Speed: At least Athletic Human level (Is a trained knight)
Durability: What ever we rate medieval armour as
Lifting Strength: Average Human level

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Now we'll go to the cooler Nova, Rider

A note: before anyone asks this Key doesn't scale to Sam in any way due to black helmets inherently giving more access to the Nova force the Rider's regular yellow helmet

Pre Full Nova Force Key
Stats: High 8-C+ (Can harm Sandman while being severely weakened) - Nova Volume 1 Issues 13-14
Speed: MHS+ (Can tag Sandman and Doctor Octavius) - Nova Volume 1 Issues 13-14 and Nova Volume 3 Issue 1
Durability: High 8-C+ (Even when weakened can take hits from Sandman. Takes punch from Rhino with no damage) - Nova Volume 1 Issues 13-14 and Nova Volume 3 Issue 1
Lifting Strength: At least Class 1 (Can easily lift a car) -

P&A:
1) Heat Manipulation (Shot a blast that turned Sandman into glass) - Nova Volume 3 Issue 1
2) Regernation for uniform (Can reform from this) - Nova Volume 3 Issue 7
3) Underwater Breathing Type 3 (His helmet supplies him with air in space)
4) Absorption (Absorbed Gladiator's energy blast) - Nova Volume 2 Issue 1
5) Flight (Also key lets downgrade people who Rider tagged to Mach 3)
6) Extrasensory Perception (Shown here) -
7) Cloth manipulation (Shown here) - Nova Volume 2 Issue 7
8) Energy Projection (Shown here)
9) Can survive in space (I see some pages simply listing that while other derive resistances from that so idk what to put)
10) Acrobatics (Shown here) -
11) Enhanced Senses (Has night vision) -
12) What ever this is -
11) Resistance to heat, electricity and possibly to paralysis - and Nova Volume 2 Issue 8 and Nova Volume 2 Issue 12

Full Nova Force Key
Okay so now I need to argue why Rider should just be 4-B

So I'll list just his 4-B feats:
Fighting and killing Annihilus (Second Key) and hurt Thanos more the once - Annihilation: Nova Volume 1 Issue 4 and Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 3 Issue 18
No the main feat going against this is Surfer having a lopsided fight in Surfer's favour, and there's no real reason outside a narrative one for why Surfer > Rider
Now considering it's a 1 v 2/3 feat wise and Rider is constantly portrayed as above 5-As, not to mention he fought against the Cancerverse while being there for years (Yes he did die there several times but its not portrayed as if it was one sided) I think it's safe to assume he's considering a 4-B level dude writing wise
Heck even while at 17% power a threat from him to Gamora made her back of, and he easily beat the Black Order while being under mind control so... - Nova Volume 3 Issue 10 and

And another feat to support that is this - Nova Volume 3 Issue 6
Basically in the first scan he arrived to that place by flying into the star, now I'd imagine a star collapsing at you with full gravity to a 1 atom length thing would at least be 4-C if not higher (Not to mention he's way weaker then usual due to putting a lot of his power into fighting a mind controlling virus)

Lifting Strength: At least Class M (Can shrug of Venom trying to pin him down) - Nova Volume 3 Issue 3

Statement of the great amount of Nova Force used to keep the virus in check - Nova Volume 3 Issue 8

Now to P&A:
1) Everything from the previous Key and everything Sam has (As the guy who literally has all Nova Force at his command I think it's fair to say he'd be able to use all Nova powers ever shown)
2) Hacking (Shown here and could even hack Annihilus's ships) - Annihilation: Nova and Nova Volume 3 Issue 3
3) Limited Power Null (His helmet can cancel physical enhancements if they're psionic in nature) - Nova Volume 3 Issue 8
5) Gravity Manipulation (Shown here and here, also should scale to his brother) - and Nova Volume 3 Issue 8, ,26-27
6) Resistance to Mind Manipulation and Possession, what ever being in a place where physics are collapsing is and even greater resistance to radiation - Nova Volume 3 Issue 3, 6, 8, 13

Worldmind
1) Supergenuis Intelligence (Preforms calculations Reed finds difficult) -
2) Mind Manipulation (Too long to scan, but basically he could through whispering into other Novas minds none stop make them subservient to him and be happy without even noticing) -
3) Fusionism (Also too long to scan, but when he was left alone in Cancerverse he fused with it) - Nova Volume 6 Issue 6
4) Power Bestowal (Can even do it while Nova Prime is comprised) - Nova Volume 3 Issue 4-5
5) Information Analysis (Shown here) - Nova Volume 3 Issue 8
6) Technology Manipulation (Shown here) - Nova Volume 3 Issue 18
7) Telekinesis (Shown here) - Nova Volume 3 Issue 22

Cancerverse Key
Stats: At least 5-A (Can keep up with Gamora. Handled an explosion that overwhelmed Sam to the point he passed out) - Nova Volume 6 Issue 3-4
Speed: MFTL+ (Keeps up with Gamora and Sam)
Durability: At least 5-A (Same as AP)

P&A:
1) Everything as the first Key, power null from second but minus hacking
2) Immortality (Types 1, 4, 5, and 7; has the traits of Cancerverse residents where death doesn't exist) - Nova Volume 6 Issue 6
3) Tranformation (Shown here and here) - Nova Volume 6 Issue 3

Also in theory there's a post Cancerverse Key who's Rider but without Worldmind so maybe that's something worth adding idk
Tho that version also has an anti-feat for Novas having regeneration or at least any decent one due to Nova Force only being able to keep him alive after his chest got pierced and can go on for a limited time -

 

[Tllmbrg]

Posting this now to get the next spot for a Marvel CRT

 

[Antvasima]

This seems to mostly make sense to me, but I am not sure whether or not we have any other Marvel revision going right now.

Also, I do not think that getting rid of poison quite qualifies as healing, and likely not Purification either, so I am not sure what to classify it as.

 

[Antvasima]

Also, Rich himself did only have his usual intelligence. He could simply constantly ask the Worldmind for advise.

 

[LordTracer]

There is a Marvel thread going on right now.

 

[Antvasima]

Oh right. I will close this one in the meantime then. You can ask The_Impress to open it again later.

 

[Cropfist]

I agree with this.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

shouldn`t the star feat be calced Neutron star blowing should be above 4V

 

[Antvasima]

@Matthew_Schroeder @Zensum @C2_of_Omegon @Eficiente @Qawsedf234 @Sandman31 @SuperAPM @Firestorm808 @Elizio33 @EmperorRorepme @The_Impress @Hykuu @LuciferDC099

Are you willing to comment here?

 

[LuciferDC099]

Actually, i'm not very knowledgeable about Nova, so i can't give any inputs to this revision.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. No problem.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Just saying I asked this CRT to be re-opened so I can first cite all my sources, so I'd rather discussing the CRT after I finish that

 

[Qawsedf234]

A Neutron Star blowing up is at most High 4-C. But I wouldn't even call it that, since it was mid-collapse rather than exploding so he's not being hit by a nova.

As for 4-B making Thanos grunt isn't solid 4-B evidence. Maybe if the medium in question wasn't DC/Marvel, but it is. Thanos isn't notably slowed down or impacted by the strikes. The Annihilus fight however, should be looked at since that's something.

P&A looks fine at a glance but I would have to go through them in greater detail when I get the time.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Thanos thing is a supporting feat, on its own it's bad yah but I think it should be fine as supporting
Also the star feat is again supporting feat since he's at 17% power at the time and wasn't even majority hurt by it

 

[Tllmbrg]

Also I just want to say that in Nova Volume 3 Issue 20 several Nova Corps members beat Dragon Man together who we list as 5-A
So like if lower end Nova Corps members are already 5-A and Richard would have their way the **** up so another supporting feat

 

[The_Impress]

I'll say pure 4-B is an outlier, the Annihilus feat seems propelled by PIS as the situation REALLY reeks of it, and lower end Nova Corps members don't mean jack when we already established Rider is far higher by downscaling from 4-Bs.

Rest is fine.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Okay so after Zark in Discord explained to me why Annihilus's second Key on the wiki is named really dumbly his current Full Nova Force rating should probs stay

 

[Antvasima]

I do not think that getting rid of poison quite qualifies as healing, and likely not Purification either, so I am not sure what to classify it as.

Rich himself did only have his usual intelligence. He could simply constantly ask the Worldmind for advise.

With the exception of this, and what Qawsedf and Impress rejected, this is probably fine.

 

[Tllmbrg]

So can I start editing this to both Nova's pages?
Also what we rate regular medieval armour as durability wise?

 

[Antvasima]

You can edit them if Impress and Qawsedf think that it is fine to do so.

 

[Qawsedf234]

The poison thing seems more like weird TK/Energy control than healing. Otherwise yeah I'm good with everything since the 4-B stuff was dropped.

Couldn't comment on the Ferris Wheel though. Should be Class 25 or 50 at least though.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. With the exceptions of our objections above, this can probably be applied then.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Nova (Richard Rider)

Richard Rider was born in Hempstead, New York. As a teenager, he was chosen at random by the alien Rhomann Dey, last surviving Centurion of the planet Xandar's elite Nova Corps, to inherit his power and succeed him in the rank of Nova Prime following the destruction of his world by the...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Can I have this unlocked?

 

[Antvasima]

Yes. I have done so.