Why isn't Destiny of the Endless rated as possibly 1-A?

[LordNephalem]

So Destiny of the Endless is rated as "At least High 1-B", since all the other Endless exist as a part of his book and etc. But shouldn't he be rated as "At least High 1-B, possibly 1-A"? I mean, there are at least three evidences of a possibly 1-A Destiny:

- He can affect Lucifer Morningstar (though he's still far, far weaker than him)

- His garden has a peculiar geography that is distinct from time and space

- He can save Dream from the black hole thad lead him to Mother Night's realm (which is accepted as 1-A) and to do so, he states that he had to "rent the bonds of time and space"

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Delirium has the same feats... So if this is accepted, a upgrade is on order for her too.

 

[LuckyCharmingStar]

Ant told me that atleast 1-B is possibly 1-A it literally the same.

 

[LordNephalem]

If I'm not wrong, Mother Night just said that Delirium usually plays in her realm or something like that. But like Dream, maybe she uses some method to enter a 1-A place (Dream used the black hole), while Destiny explicitly showed that he can acess that realm by his own.

 

[LuckyCharmingStar]

atleast high 1-B = possible 1-A

 

[Aeyu]

At least High 1-B is more like, they transcend an infinite dimensional reality to a level which is beyond space-time but not dimensions as a concept, or is someone comparable to a 1-A being, but who has never shown any feats or indication of being outerversal (Which, honestly should require an explicit mentioning. See: Crimson King. It's also why the Downstreamers were downgraded.)

 

[TheSandman31]

Okay, necroing this thread.

I'm pretty curious myself, the previous reasoning for Destiny's High 1-C tier is that he exists beyond the Source Wall and Matthew said that Destiny exists outside the Source wall and he along with The Source exists at the same level of existence

Due to recent upgrades, if the same reasoning for Destiny being High 1-C is used now then he wouldn't be High 1-B but 1-A

That plus the fact that the Endless has been consistently shown to be able to easily traverse outerversal realms (The Dream of the sleeping Lovecraftian gods that sleeps in the "space beneath space and space beyond space", Dream's ship being outside of Destiny's Book and his ship was said to pass "Outside of space or time".Father Times realm, mother Nights realm and Death existing in the void after the death of Creation and even escaping into the Void wont let you escape her but only delay the inevitable)

 

[TheSandman31]

At least High 1-B possibly 1-A ,seems fair for the Endless (Destiny, Death , maybe Dream probably not )

 

[TheSandman31]

If I'm not wrong, Mother Night just said that Delirium usually plays in her realm or something like that. But like Dream, maybe she uses some method to enter a 1-A place (Dream used the black hole), while Destiny explicitly showed that he can acess that realm by his own.

My guess is that Delirium knows the way to Mother Night's realm, she knows things that even Destiny don't and she once mentioned that she knows that there are exits in Destiny's Garden

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

... At least High 1-B is the exact same as " Possibly 1-A "

 

[TheSandman31]

Not the exact same thing as Aeyu stated above At least High 1-B means you're above infinite dimensions in a level that is beyond space-time, possibly means that it is possible but inconclusive due to lack of proof

possible means that he could be above dimension as a concept not just space-time

 

[TheSandman31]

The previous reasoning for Destiny's High 1-C before the upgrade is that because he is outside the Map of the Multiverse and exists beyond The Source Wall together with The Source .

Because of the DC upgrade The Source is now 1-A but why is Destiny isn't?

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

I respect your opinion... And you are actually right . However ... Because they were strictly stated as Wave Functions, which unfortunately limits them to High 1-B loosely. Think of Eternity a little bit . Despite him having feats of an equal resisting a 1-A realm destroying him and inhabiting said space for a long time , he is still High 1-B due to strictly being a Infinite-D being ( Even though much weaker or at least comparable beings also resisted a 1-A realm as well ) . We even had a Conduit of Hyperspace resist Oblivion's Realm when his power was heavily weakebed. He would still be High 1-B

 

[TheSandman31]

So the fact that they were said to be wave functions means that they cant ever be 1-A? despite of feats

I mean what kind of wave function survives the destruction of the universe like Death ? or in case of Destiny, who possibly exist even before Creation?

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Basically. I know it's... A bit unfortunate.

A really really powerful one.

 

[TheSandman31]

A wave function by its very definition cant exists in a realm outside of space and time.Which the Endless can, there won't be wave functions if the universe is completely destroyed and swallowed by a timeless and undimensioned void.

That already disqualifies them as wave function

 

[TheSandman31]

A wave function isn't even a thing. it's just a mathematical formula used to describe quantum objects or used to describe the quantum behavior of an object.Its a complex function of space and time, how can there be wave function in a place devoid of both space and time?

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Same reason why a Infinite-D can survive resisting something beyond it's very concept that binds it... It's impossible. Yet... It still somehow binds them loosely to the tier.

 

[Antvasima]

The Endless have been described as wave functions, and are embodiments of an infinite-dimensional multiverse, which means High 1-B. However, Destiny might exceed that scale, and as such is "At least High 1-B"/"Possibly 1-A".

 

[Js250476]

Destiny is supposed to be the most powerful of the Endless IIRC so it sounds fair to me

 

[Antvasima]

Yes. I will close this thread.