what to make of the HPL letter？

[ultimate]

We know that there are larger universes outside the Cthulhu universe, but we can't be sure that this process is infinite

"But what place is this? Is it Paradise or Hell? This is not the world I have known since birth. And those stars-I have never seen them before. Those constellations are mightier and more fiery than I ever knew in life."

"There are worlds beyond worlds, universes within and without universes," said the ancient. "You are upon a different planet than that upon which you were born; you are in a different universe, doubtless in a different dimension,"

"Then I am certainly dead."

"What is death but a traversing of eternities and a crossing of cosmic oceans? But I have not said that you are dead."

"Then where in Valka's name am I?" roared Kull, his short stock of patience exhausted. "Your barbarian brain clutches at material actualities," answered the other tranquilly. "What does it matter where you are, or whether you are dead, as you call it? You are a part of that great ocean which is Life, which washes upon all shores, and you are as much a part of it in one place as in another, and as sure to eventually flow back to the Source of it, which gave birth to all Life. As for that, you are bound to Life for all Eternity as surely as a tree, a rock, a bird or a world is bound. You call leaving your tiny planet, quitting your crude physical form-death!"

"But I still have my body."

"I have not said that you are dead, as you name it. As for that, you may be still upon your little planet, as far as you know. Worlds within worlds, universes within universes. Things exist too small and too large for human comprehension. Each pebble on the beaches of Valusia contains countless universes within itself, and itself as a whole is as much a part of the great plan of all universes, as is the sun you know. Your universe, Kull of Valusia, may be a pebble on the shore of a mighty kingdom. "You have broken the bounds of material limitations. You may be in a universe which goes to make up a gem on the robe you wore on Valusia's throne or that universe you knew may be in the spiderweb which lies there on the grass near your feet. I tell you, size and space and time are relative and do not really exist."

But recently, we found an hpl letter can prove it

343. TO FRANK BELKNAP LONG
Young Man:—
Feby. 20,1929
Glad you found the commonplace-book and cuttings of interest. Have you started your novel, or any short tales? Another thing you could use is that Hispano-Roman dream I described a year ago October. I proba-bly shan't ever get around to writing it up, so if you can find the letter containing it, you're welcome to the thing.
.. The actual cosmos of pattern'd energy, including what we know as matter, is of a contour and nature absolutely impossible of realisation by the human brain; and the more we learn of it the more we perceive this circumstance. All we can say of it, is that it contains no visible cen-tral principle so like the physical brains of terrestrial mammals that we may reasonably attribute to it the purely terrestrial and biological phae-nomenon call'd conscious purpose; and that we form, even allowing for the most radical conceptions of the relativist, so insignificant and tem-porary a part of it (whether all space be infinite or curved, and trans-galactic distances constant or variable, we know that within the bounds of our stellar universe no relativistic circumstance can banish the ap-proximate dimensions we recognise. The relative place of our solar sys-tem among the stars is as much a proximate reality as the relative posi-tions of Providence, N.Y., and Chicago) that all notions of special rela-tionships and names and destinies expressed in human conduct must necessarily be vestigial myths. Moreover, we know that a cosmos which is eternal (and any other kind would be a paradoxical impossibility)can have no such thing as a permanent direction or goal; since such
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SELECTED LETTERS would imply a beginning and ending, thus postulating a larger creating and managing cosmos outside this one-and so on ad infinitum like a nest of Chinese boxes. This point remains the same whether we con-sider eternity as a measure of regular pattern-movements (time) or as a fourth dimension. The latter merely makes all these intimations of a cosmos which our senses and calculations present to us. We must admit at the outset that the spectacle gives us no indications of a central con-sciousness or purpose, and suggests no reason why a cosmos should pos.sess such; that it renders the notion of special human standards and des.tinies absurd; and that it makes the idea of a permanent direction or goal improbable to the point of impossibility. Theoretically it can be al-most anything--but when we have not the faintest shadow of reason for believing certain specific things exactly contrary to all the principles of probability and experience in our limited part of space, it becomes a piece of hallucination or affectation to try to believe such things. Here are we-and yonder yawns the universe. If there be indeed any central governor, any set of standards, or any final goal, we can never hope to get even the faintest inkling of any of these things; since the ultimate reality of space is clearly a complex churming of energy of which the human mind can never form any even approximate picture, and which can touch us. only through the veil of local apparent manifestations which we call the visible and material universe. So far as analogy and probability go, there is strong presumptive evidence on the negative side-evidence based on the observation of small material systems like the electrons of an atom or the planets circling the sun. This evidence tells us that all small units of mass-energy are (that is, all humanly visible and conceivable presentations of such units are) rotating systems orga-nised in a certain way and preserving a balance and dovetailing of func-tions, absolute regularity and the exclusion of chance, (and hence of vo-lition or conscious action) and the infinite uniformity of this system of interlocking rotations and forms of regularity, seem to confront us wherever we delve beneath the surface; so that these circumstances ac-tually form the sum total of all our knowledge of the composition and administration of infinity. To say that such an array of evidence suggests a central will, a one-way direction, and a special concern for any one of the infinitesimal temporary force-combinations which form incidents of the eternal cycles within cycles of constant rearrangement, is to utter simple and unadulterated damn foolishness.

I think this proves the level of the Cthulhu universe, but does it conflict withThe Whisperer in Darkness？

Even now I absolutely refuse to believe what he implied about the constitution of ultimate infinity, the juxtaposition of dimensions, and the frightful position of our known cosmos of space and time in the unending chain of linked cosmos-atoms which makes up the immediate super-cosmos of curves, angles, and material and semi-material electronic organisation.

The more likely relationship between universes here is juxtaposition

If you're interested, leave your comments

 

[ultimate]

@Planck69

 

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@Roachman40 @Udlmaster @The_King_of_Prudence @Edenstar @Planck69 @Ultima_Reality @Elizhaa @LordTracer @KingPin0422

 

[Gasper]

Bump

 

[Gasper]

I agree with that

 

[ultimate]

Bump

 

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[Planck69]

It looks like rather good support for the idea of nested universes to me, though I'm unsure of the scaling implications.

 

[ultimate]

It looks like rather good support for the idea of nested universes to me, though I'm unsure of the scaling implications.

yeah，I mean，this is a good proof that Cthulhu's universe is infinitely expanding outward, and there is a larger universe outside of it
just like this

Things exist too small and too large for human comprehension. Each pebble on the beaches of Valusia contains countless universes within itself, and itself as a whole is as much a part of the great plan of all universes, as is the sun you know. Your universe, Kull of Valusia, may be a pebble on the shore of a mighty kingdom.