Welcome to Low 2-C (Riven vs BB)

[Hl3_or_bust]

Take is at the very least trillions of times better than anything BB has ever messed with outside of Moon Cell stuff

so no

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

May i ask what you mean by outside of mooncell stuff??? May I also ask what you mean by "At least trillions of times better??"

BB had power equivlent to the MoonCell even before absorbing the MoonCellThey were both stalemating each other until eventually BB got the upperhand.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

the 8D stuff which is limited. Take is 2-B in terms of potency for all of it's abilities, with said 2-B being drastically above abilities that restroactively affect trillions of timelines and i think there was a better 2-B feat but i forget.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

All instances of 8-D MoonCell and BB is vehmently rejected, but the fact that BB had a power equivlent to the mooncell still stands as both have High 3-A, to Low 2-C feats.

Question, is Take also Riven of a Thousand Voices????? How does Take have anything do with that guy??

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

wait really? I coulda sworn that 8D stuff still counted for hax, mainly BB's info hax.

Taking is an ability that she shares with Oryx, the Taken King, with the only real difference being the absence of concept manip and a downgrade in potency.

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

One person disagreed but it doesn't mean it's rejected. Nothing was actually concluded.

 

[Paul_Frank]

The only "conclusion" that was reached is that she won't be tiered 1-C physically

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

Monarch never agreed, or disagreed either. And imo hes the only reliable Staff member that i'd like to hear from, but what he said also confused me.. All other staff memembers were also confused.. on the matter

Monarch simply said "They aren't real higher dimensions" and he says confusing stuff that seemd contradictorial to that.. so it all becomes a mess.. and in short. I think it would be best to safely assume they are Upper tier low 2-C

Anways the thread is here @Hl3 or bust

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3185171 This thread was never a 1-C upgrade. it was strictly about what tier is her hax.


Yeah the "staff" agreed that 8D hax contradicts tiering, and she has no other feats being 1-C. So, therefore her Hax are to be Nerfed to the upper tier of Low 2-C

So all his hax are in the 2-B range?

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

Not all of it. Her mind hax is only well above a literal space-time continuum trying to destroy your mind

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

One part of the thread was about dimensional tiering being shitty, the other about tiering hax, feats that talked about dimensions in Fate were pretty much ignored. Those who read them somewhat understood what's going on, but they still weren't discussed. The thread was closed prematurely, meaningful comments were ignored.

Yeah, if someone wants to remove 8D thing they can create a proper thread with actual discussion which won't lead anywhere and this will never be concluded.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

My computer is lagging.


Does she usually lead/start a fight off trying mind hax??


I plan on making another thread about it, but I'm going to wait a few months before then. In particular, I'm going to wait for Ultima reality's revisions.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

Riven starts with mind hax yes. If that doesn't work, she tries to Take

 

[GalaxianAegis]

If there's a specific problem with BB's 8D stuff I can make a thread on that pretty soon.

As far as this fight is concerned, Riven begins with her mindhax and when that doesn't work she mostly attacks via other means. Though it should be noted that her mindhax also involves constantly invoking the Anthem Anatheme not only control her opponent but reality as well.

And this is powerful enough to have worked on the PC Guardian who defeated a being like Oryx, the Taken King.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

A specific problem??? It seems everyone has a problem with it... Each "problem" someone has.. is completely different from the next, or the previous problem...

Considering how the thread i linked went.. I reccommend not touching it for a while..

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

How good is Riven's mind hax?

 

[GalaxianAegis]

Riven is able to mind hax through taking BB's latent desires and warping reality to better suit herself. For example, Uldren really wanted to see his sister Mara, so Riven preyed upon that desire to speak with Mara's voice in his head and make him believe he was helping his sister the entire course of Forsaken.

Basically by even interacting with her with a desire, you are making a bargain with her. She was even able to get this to work on Oryx somewhat when he came to Take her during the Taken War.

Given her obsession with Hakuno, I think that Riven would start to work off that.

 

[GalaxianAegis]

Bump

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

It doesn't seem like a good enough mind hax to work on BB.

 

[Wokistan]

God I ******* love notifications on this site they work so well

If we use the BB perceiving 8D things as a resistance feat, there is the matter that the Vex are able to simulate infinite dimensional space and yet people who can Take can do it to them just fine.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AQ5tu7eM3abdj1JPjy3Vcw_R___35Mec/view

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

That depends on whether "infinite dimensional" is accepted or not.

 

[Wokistan]

Seems to be the same issue with the one BB has. If dimensions were accepted in this sense for either of them they'd just translate to AP and aren't terribly relevant otherwise.

 

[GalaxianAegis]

Well I personally don't even think the dimensions referred to in BB's statement that she gets the higher dimensional manipulation are higher order spatial/temporal dimensions, but regardless that shouldn't affect her Mind Manipulation resistance. It's not in her resistances section that this would have any impact.

If she has not resisted mindhax greater than Oryx or The Guardian, there is no reason to assume that she would resist Riven's suggestions. Especially when we know that she satisfies the requirements of having a ton of desires.

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

It has been accepted as such long ago.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

It was rejected recently. Because "they aren't real 8th dimensional spaces."

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

It was ignored and not even discussed properly.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

That wasn't why. It was because Nasu doesn't regard dimensions in a way that qualifies them for dimensional tiering

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

It was ignored and not even discussed properly.

 

[GalaxianAegis]

I don't think that is the case. It was pretty definitive how the higher dimensional stuff doesn't really grant superiority, nor does Nasu follow that thought process.

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

I'm pretty sure that every time higher-dimensional things are mentioned they are explained as superior.

 

[GalaxianAegis]

She interacts with and is defeated by lower dimensional beings though. That superiority doesn't really exist as for as Nasu is concerned.

 

[ThisIsMySwagPack]

Her mind is higher-dimensional so interaction is not a problem.