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Update on The Truth's abillities.

EinelRendezvous

EinelRendezvous

436
509
Let's get to the point, I have suggestion for some of an abilities that The Truth deserves to have on it's profile:

• Non Existence Physiology type 1 (The Truth present as a superior "metaphysical" existence in The Gate of The Truth where he creates it and the conventional existence doesn't exist in there, that's why when Edward wants to go there he has to use his "mind" as guide which consists of body and soul)

• Abstract Existence type 1 (The Truth is the embodiment of everything that exists in the world to the metaphysical stage, he becomes the concept of God, Space, and all things that exists)

• Conceptual Manipulation type 3 (The Truth creates The Gate of Truth and the Alchemy's concept which in there contains all the knowledge in the world and within everyone, that is why everyone can use alchemy)

• Soul Manipulation, Non Physical Interaction (The Truth can control the soul of a person, Edward once made a deal with him to exchange his right hand for the soul of Alphonse)

• Large Size type 8 (The Truth is the Universe itself)

• Law Manipulation (Create the Gate of Truth which why everyone can use alchemy, with principles such as Law Conservation of Mass and Law of Providence)

• Incorporeal (The Truth exists in the center of The Gate where it's metaphysical)

• Higher Dimensional Existence (Literally the universe itself including it's dimension, and exist in the place where it's beyond physical world; in the Gate of Truth as the God)
 
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Agree with all but iffy on NEP, if the mind consists of body and soul, how come the gates doesn't allow conventional existence?
 
AE type 1 is just him explaining that he is omnipresent
So disagree with AE type 1 and leaning towards disagreement but still am neutral on NEP type 1 and Conceptual manip
Agree with everything else
 
theultimate5105 said:
AE type 1 is just him explaining that he is omnipresent
Click to expand...
It isn't just that he is omnipresent he is all of those things that he mentions the space ,the world, the all and the god as proven by the fact that everyone has an gate of truth even inanimate objects such as earth
 
Rez said:
It isn't just that he is omnipresent he is all of those things that he mentions the space ,the world, the all and the god as proven by the fact that everyone has an gate of truth even inanimate objects such as earth
Click to expand...
Yeah that is what omnipresense is
He is the space since he is space, he is the world because he is the universe, he is the all since he is in everything
 
theultimate5105 said:
Yeah that is what omnipresense is
He is the space since he is space, he is the world because he is the universe, he is the all since he is in everything
Click to expand...
No omnipresence means being present everywhere,whenever and no where at the same time. Instead truth is everything the space,people and the planets etc it's a bit more than just omnipresence
 
NEP is not within my expertise so neutral.

Abstract Existence looks solid

I'm not sure if that's really Conceptual manipulation but rather creation and Power Bestowal

Soul Manipulation and Non Physical interaction are legit.

Large Size type 8 looks good.

Given he created the laws of Alchemy and thus created the Laws of Thermodynamics, and does have the ability to alter it so equivalent exchange isn't always needed by notes it's more just something must be given to receive something. So I see Law Manipulation being a possibility.

Incorporeal is legit

High dimensional existence also looks fine.
 
MarvelFanatic119 said:
NEP not sure, since the panel states Edward had his body with him and he was using his mind to bring him to the Gate, nothing about leaving it behind.

No to the Higher Dimensional Existence since the scan doesn't say anything about higher than the Universe and even says Truth is the Universe.
Click to expand...
The universe in FMAB already is rated as a space-time, if truth is the universe, it is a higher dimensional existence
 
What Medeus and MarvelFanatic accepted is probably fine to apply, but let's wait a bit to see if we get more responses first.
 
Rez said:
No omnipresence means being present everywhere,whenever and no where at the same time. Instead truth is everything the space,people and the planets etc it's a bit more than just omnipresence
Click to expand...
that also can be omnipresense just a higher form of it
It doesn't have a reason to be AE since none of that is abstract
 
EinelRendezvous said:
Let's get to the point, I have suggestion for some of an abilities that The Truth deserves to have on it's profile:

• Non Existence Physiology type 1 (The Truth present as a superior "metaphysical" existence in The Gate of The Truth where he creates it and the conventional existence doesn't exist in there, that's why when Edward wants to go there he has to use his "mind" as guide which consists of body and soul)

• Abstract Existence type 1 (The Truth is the embodiment of everything that exists in the world to the metaphysical stage, he becomes the concept of God, Space, and all things that exists)

• Conceptual Manipulation type 3 (The Truth creates The Gate of Truth and the Alchemy's concept which in there contains all the knowledge in the world and within everyone, that is why everyone can use alchemy)

• Soul Manipulation, Non Physical Interaction (The Truth can control the soul of a person, Edward once made a deal with him to exchange his right hand for the soul of Alphonse)

• Large Size type 8 (The Truth is the Universe itself)

• Law Manipulation (Create the Gate of Truth which why everyone can use alchemy, with principles such as Law Conservation of Mass and Law of Providence)

• Incorporeal (The Truth exists in the center of The Gate where it's metaphysical)

• Higher Dimensional Existence (Literally the universe itself including it's dimension, and exist in the place where it's beyond physical world; in the Gate of Truth as the God)
Click to expand...
Oh, and his lifting strength also need to be upgraded to Immeasurable instead of his current Infinite rating
 
I don't see how that is NEP. Especially if body and soul exists, that is still existence.

Where in those scans is it stated that it creates the laws or concept of alchemy? The gate being necessary to use alchemy, and the truth being/creating that gate, doesn't equate to creating literally everything that relates to alchemy in every way.

Don't think it's higher-dimensional. It's space and the universe, but that is still just three dimensions unless we have confirmation of it being the entire timeline at once. It also is a metaphysical place, but that doesn't equate to higher dimensions.

Incoporporeal sounds weird. It is literally all physical things, so it has a body. It also has non-physical components maybe, but it still has a physical body too.
 
DontTalk makes sense as usual. Thank you for helping out.
 
Neutral on Nonexistent Physiology
Everything else seems fine
Also, I think the tag should be Truth or Truth (Fullmetal Alchemist) instead of The Truth
 
Okay so most of the problem is on NEP feats? I'm fine for it to be not accepted by others since it's indeed vague and contradicted the definition also so almost all of them excluding NEP is accepted? That's fine.

theultimate5105 said:
AE type 1 is just him explaining that he is omnipresent
Click to expand...
Well the reason The Truth is omnipresent because he became "everything" including the concept that was there so he still AE. The Truth also the Law of Alchemy itself, and as Bern said earlier.
 
DontTalkDT said:
Where in those scans is it stated that it creates the laws or concept of alchemy? The gate being necessary to use alchemy, and the truth being/creating that gate, doesn't equate to creating literally everything that relates to alchemy in every way.
Click to expand...
Does that need to be questioned? The Truth is the existence of God who is everything there. Even if you say The Truth didn't create it, everything in there is a small part of The Truth, including the concept. Especially Alchemists, because The Truth's Gate is the only Gate that holds all the knowledge in the world that reaches all other people's Gates.
DontTalkDT said:
Don't think it's higher-dimensional. It's space and the universe, but that is still just three dimensions unless we have confirmation of it being the entire timeline at once. It also is a metaphysical place, but that doesn't equate to higher dimensions.
Click to expand...
Well, the FMA universe has been accepted as Space - Time structure. When the Truth means the "World" it's refer to Universe in literal which contains Time and Space dimensions.
DontTalkDT said:
Incoporporeal sounds weird. It is literally all physical things, so it has a body. It also has non-physical components maybe, but it still has a physical body too.
Click to expand...
No, it's not literall all physical things. With Edward using his "mind" which is deeper than body and soul signifies that The Truth is an incorporeal being that cannot be felt by conventional methods. Plus The Truth becomes the embodiment of everything including abstract things like the laws of the Alchemists.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
I'm not sure if that's really Conceptual manipulation but rather creation and Power Bestowal
Click to expand...
Creation and Power Bestowal also can be listed here but since The Truth being omnipresence because everything including world, people, law, and universal concept that dominates reality doesn't he have CM3 by default?

Wait, I just read the CM page and realized that it has been revised. So now CM2 The Truth?
 
Neutral on NEP, not knowledgeable enough on that.

Agree with Abstract Existence.

I don’t think creating the Alchemy is the same as manipulating concepts. That would be Law Manipulation, since they are part of the laws of physics in this world.

I agree with Soul and Non-physical interaction.

I agree with Large Size.

I agree with Law Manipulation.

I agree Incorporeal.

I am unsure about higher dimension.
 
So can somebody summarise who have agreed with what here please?
 
Okay. Thank you, and which staff members agree or disagree with what then?
 
Antvasima said:
Okay. Thank you, and which staff members agree or disagree with what then?
Click to expand...
@Armorchompy Agreed with everything but admitted to not being knowledgeable on the matter.

@Theglassman12 Agreed with everything except NEP.

@DarkDragonMedeus Agreed with everything except for NEP (neutral), CM (possibly sees it as power bestowal/creation) and Law Manipulation (admittedly is willing to compromise with a "possible" rating).

@DontTalkDT Not convinced by CM, Law Manipulation, Incorporeal, HDE and NEP but doesn't seem to have issues with the rest.
 
EinelRendezvous said:
Does that need to be questioned? The Truth is the existence of God who is everything there. Even if you say The Truth didn't create it, everything in there is a small part of The Truth, including the concept. Especially Alchemists, because The Truth's Gate is the only Gate that holds all the knowledge in the world that reaches all other people's Gates.
Click to expand...
Just because something is stated to be a god, that doesn't mean we hand it abilities. It needs to prove that stuff just as much as a normal human would.

The Truth is never stated to be those concepts, so that being 'everything' includes all kinds of concepts and additionally grants it the ability to manipulate those is pure speculation.

The Truth's gate holding knowledge doesn't relate to concept manipulation in any way.

EinelRendezvous said:
Well, the FMA universe has been accepted as Space - Time structure. When the Truth means the "World" it's refer to Universe in literal which contains Time and Space dimensions.
Click to expand...
It only says it is space as far as I am aware. Can you proof it is time as well? Being the 'world' is too vague to equate to timeline per default. World can mean a number of things and change in usage by context and without warning.

EinelRendezvous said:
No, it's not literall all physical things. With Edward using his "mind" which is deeper than body and soul signifies that The Truth is an incorporeal being that cannot be felt by conventional methods. Plus The Truth becomes the embodiment of everything including abstract things like the laws of the Alchemists.
Click to expand...
Actually, I guess we can consider the physical aspects of it avatars. Although that much should be explained on the page IMO.
 
Well, DontTalk is one of our most knowledgeable and intelligent staff members, so if he has reservations they are almost always due to good reasons.
 
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