Unity of Everything

[Livinaa]

"Everything that has existed, is existing, and would exist lingers in eternity"

Eternity is the unity of everything that has existed, is existing, and would exist.

Among those that has existed and is existing are Low 1-A character and 1-A character.

What would Eternity's tier be?

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

still 1A

 

[Livinaa]

still 1A

Can you explain why it's still 1-A?

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

Can you explain why it's still 1-A?

Nothing suggests any transcendent over the structures, it is just containing them.
like we keep saying it needs to

transcend the generic quality defining a those 1A structures or potential qualitative layers from those structures rather than just containing them

 

[Livinaa]

Nothing suggests any transcendent over the structures, it is just containing them.
like we keep saying it needs to

transcend the generic quality defining a those 1A structures or potential qualitative layers from those structures rather than just containing them

It's neither transcendent over nor containing them. Eternity is the unity of everything that has existed, is existing, and would exist. In Eternity, there's no difference, all is one wholeness.

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

It's neither transcendent over nor containing them. Eternity is the unity of everything that has existed, is existing, and would exist. In Eternity, there's no difference, all is one wholeness.

Eternity is everything ,past, present, and future. Then Eternity would still be 1A, because in this content we take the highest thing Eternity encompasses as her,his tier .

 

[Livinaa]

Eternity is everything ,past, present, and future.

I don't think "has existed, is existing, and would exist" refer to past, present, and future though. One of the beings that is included in "unity of everything" here is the concept of space and the concept of time. There's also the nondual, void/non-existent Chaos that predates all concepts, including concept of space and concept of time.

Since Eternity here is the unity of everything, including dual and nondual concepts, making it one wholeness with no difference, thus being intrinsically different than either Low 1-A and 1-A, it should atleast be High 1-A i think.

Edit : Here's how that nondual, void/non-existent Chaos refers to itself in relation to Eternity

"We are eternal beings. Intelligent spirits before this mortal life. We are now living part of eternity. Our mortal birth was not the beginning death, which faces all of us is not the end..."

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

I don't think "has existed, is existing, and would exist" refer to past, present, and future though.

thats what they mean

One of the beings that is included in "unity of everything" here is the concept of space and the concept of time. There's also the nondual, void/non-existent Chaos that predates all concepts, including concept of space and concept of time.

I see, but concepts of space and time are not by default Low 1A, but are by default Type 2 concepts which scale to just how many dimensions the verse has. You have to prove concepts of space/time are the very essence, definition, of space/time and are the source of all space/time ,the essence is independent and separated from all spatiotemporal particulars things that originated from them. That's for Low 1A.For 1A you need one more thing

the chaos/void predating concepts of space/time and all concepts does not make it 1A. It is stated and nondual. You have to prove there is duality in the verse.

Q: Is predating the concepts of space and time an 1-A feat?​ A: No. As said above, predating a certain concept does not necessarily imply any form of superiority over it

Since Eternity here is the unity of everything, including dual and nondual concepts, making it one wholeness with no difference, thus being intrinsically different than either Low 1-A and 1-A, it should atleast be High 1-A i think.

Edit : Here's how that nondual, void/non-existent Chaos refers to itself in relation to Eternity

nope

 

[Livinaa]

I see, but concepts of space and time are not by default Low 1A, but are by default Type 2 concepts which scale to just how many dimensions the verse has. You have to prove space/time are the very essence, definition, and fundamental of space/time and it is the source of all space/time and the essence is independent and separated from all temporal things that originated from them. That's for Low 1A.

Here's what Space means:

RAW JP

「空間」とは、宇宙だけでなく、次元、物理などの概念を指す。それは果て無き概念であり、いまだ永遠に成長している概念である。

DeepL translation

The term "space" refers not only to the universe, but also to dimensionality, physics, and other concepts. It is an endless concept, one that is still forever growing.

It's also a Type 1 Concept, since it's the first Concept created by the Gods to make the World. Before Space was created by the Gods, there's no Existence at all, only Chaos/Void. And even after the Gods created Space and the others, Chaos is still present, encompassing them and superior to them.

I'm not really sure if Chaos/Void is nondual. Chaos would be 0 to Space's 1. And since Space encompass all the other Concepts due to being the first Concept to be created by the Gods, Space should encompass dualities that exist in the World.

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

Here's what Space means:

RAW JP


DeepL translation


It's also a Type 1 Concept, since it's the first Concept created by the Gods to make the World. Before Space was created by the Gods, there's no Existence at all, only Chaos/Void. And even after the Gods created Space and the others, Chaos is still present, encompassing them and superior to them.

i asked for translate

"Space" not only refers to the universe but concepts as well such as dimensions and physics. It is an endless concept, one that keeps on going forever.

not so diffrent
it would still depend on the cosmology because it only encompass type 2 concepts .

1-A / High 1-A / Tier 0 Revisions Hub

Does someone remember where we agreed to place "controlling/embodying all concepts"? I mean in the case where concepts refer to something like universals, to be clear. (Since I know we use the term loosely) Just thinking about what to do with the more powerful concept manipulators :unsure...

vsbattles.com

I'm not really sure if Chaos/Void is nondual. Chaos would be 0 to Space's 1. And since Space encompass all the other Concepts due to being the first Concept to be created by the Gods, Space should encompass dualities that exist in the World.

We don't just assume all concepts in a verse includes the concept of duality; you have to prove certain concepts.

 

[Livinaa]

not so diffrent
it would still depend on the cosmology because it only encompass type 2 concepts .

1-A / High 1-A / Tier 0 Revisions Hub

Does someone remember where we agreed to place "controlling/embodying all concepts"? I mean in the case where concepts refer to something like universals, to be clear. (Since I know we use the term loosely) Just thinking about what to do with the more powerful concept manipulators :unsure...

vsbattles.com

According to Ultima, being superior to dimensions will always land you at either Low 1-A or 1-A, regardless of the concept type. Being superior to concept 1/2/3 of dimensions will still land you at atleast Low 1-A.

Beyond the concept of dimensions

I have a question that I hope to answer accurately if there is a verse that has 5 dimensions and there is a letter from the same verse that exceeds the concept of dimensions, does it exceed the concept of dimensions completely or will it be 5 dimensions (according to the dimensions in the...

vsbattles.com

Since Space as a Concept encompass not only the concept of dimensions, but also other concepts such as physics and many more (since it's an eternally growing Concept), it's atleast Low 1-A, and possibly 1-A.

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

According to Ultima, being superior to dimensions will always land you at either Low 1-A or 1-A, regardless of the concept type. Being superior to concept 1/2/3 of dimensions will still land you at atleast Low 1-A.

What ultima meant by superior is that you have to transcend, surpass, ascend, above the concept of dimensions, which is not the case here.

Beyond the concept of dimensions

I have a question that I hope to answer accurately if there is a verse that has 5 dimensions and there is a letter from the same verse that exceeds the concept of dimensions, does it exceed the concept of dimensions completely or will it be 5 dimensions (according to the dimensions in the...

vsbattles.com

Since Space as a Concept encompass not only the concept of dimensions, but also other concepts such as physics and many more (since it's an eternally growing Concept), it's atleast Low 1-A, and possibly 1-A.

I don't think I even see 1B or High 1B because they need to state how many dimensions there are not just "Space also refers to dimensions" because it can be talking about the normal 3 dimensions

 

[Livinaa]

What ultima meant by superior is that you have to transcend, surpass, ascend, above the concept of dimensions, which is not the case here.

Encompassing the concept of dimensions and other concepts is the same as being above concept of dimensions. To encompass something, one must necessarily be bigger/superior to the thing being encompassed.

I don't think I even see 1B or High 1B because they need to state how many dimensions there are not just "Space also refers to dimensions" because it can be talking about the normal 3 dimensions

Space refers to concepts, and among those concepts are dimensions, physics, and many other. Aka concept of dimensions, concept of physics, etc...

It's not talking about physical dimensions, instead it's talking about concept of dimensions.

Concept of dimensions encompass all possible dimensions. Low 1-A.

Space encompassing the concept of dimensions among many other concepts makes it bigger/superior to concept of dimensions.

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

Encompassing the concept of dimensions and other concepts is the same as being above concept of dimensions. To encompass something, one must necessarily be bigger/superior to the thing being encompassed.

wrong content only aplies to the void stuff , for concept stuff you need a direct statement that says "you transcerd the very concept of dimensions"

Space refers to concepts, and among those concepts are dimensions, physics, and many other. Aka concept of dimensions, concept of physics, etc...

It's not talking about physical dimensions, instead it's talking about concept of dimensions.

Concept of dimensions encompass all possible dimensions. Low 1-A.

I already said why this is not low 1A

concepts of space,dimensions and time are not by default Low 1A, but are by default Type 2 concepts which scale to just how many dimensions the verse has. You have to prove concepts of space, dimensions /time are the very essence, definition, of space, dimensions /time and are the source of all space, dimensions /time ,the essence is independent and separated from all spatiotemporal particulars things that originated from them. That's for Low 1A.

You have not yet proved they are independent and separated from their particulars. The only context it has is that it is called a concept, that’s it.

1-A / High 1-A / Tier 0 Revisions Hub

Does someone remember where we agreed to place "controlling/embodying all concepts"? I mean in the case where concepts refer to something like universals, to be clear. (Since I know we use the term loosely) Just thinking about what to do with the more powerful concept manipulators :unsure...

vsbattles.com

 

[Livinaa]

wrong content only aplies to the void stuff

Void of nothingness is for BDE 2nd Type 2 which is 1-A, not for BDE 1st Type 2 which is Low 1-A. Also the Chaos/Void that i talked about before should be BDE 2nd Type 2, since it's a nothingness that existed before and encompasses all Concepts created by the Gods, including Space. It's also unbound from Space and Time.

, for concept stuff you need a direct statement that says "you transcerd the very concept of dimensions"

Encompassing concept of dimensions and multiple other concepts is as direct as transcending the concept of dimensions.

wrong content only aplies to the void stuff , for concept stuff you need a direct statement that says "you transcerd the very concept of dimensions"

I already said why this is not low 1A

concepts of space,dimensions and time are not by default Low 1A, but are by default Type 2 concepts which scale to just how many dimensions the verse has. You have to prove concepts of space, dimensions /time are the very essence, definition, of space, dimensions /time and are the source of all space, dimensions /time ,the essence is independent and separated from all spatiotemporal particulars things that originated from them. That's for Low 1A.

You have not yet proved they are independent and separated from their particulars. The only context it has is that it is called a concept, that’s it.

1-A / High 1-A / Tier 0 Revisions Hub

Does someone remember where we agreed to place "controlling/embodying all concepts"? I mean in the case where concepts refer to something like universals, to be clear. (Since I know we use the term loosely) Just thinking about what to do with the more powerful concept manipulators :unsure...

vsbattles.com

Again, Ultima said that being superior to concept of dimensions, regardless of which Type the concept of dimensions is, will always be Low 1-A.

Also encompassing the concept of dimensions and many other concepts, yet not being restricted to them and still growing eternally sounds like it's independent and separated from even the concept of dimensions.

It has other context other than being called as a concept. Firstly, it's the very first Concept created by the Gods, meaning that all concept it encompasses originates from it.

A member of the Council and the Speaker of "Space," the very first concept created by the Gods.

「議会」の一角であり、神々より作られし最初の概念「空間」の代弁者にあたる。

It's created as the very first Concept by the Gods to build the World.

On the day I descended and had awakened, “The Gods” had only just begun the world’s construction, and the shaping of “Concepts” had just started. In the beginning, “The Gods” created “Space.”

私がこの地に舞い降りて目覚めた頃、

神々は「概念」を作り、

世界を構築し始めたばかりだった。

初めに、神々は「空間」を構築した。

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

Void of nothingness is for BDE 2nd Type 2 which is 1-A, not for BDE 1st Type 2 which is Low 1-A. Also the Chaos/Void that i talked about before should be BDE 2nd Type 2, since it's a nothingness that existed before and encompasses all Concepts created by the Gods, including Space. It's also unbound from Space and Time.

Ok, i can see that

Encompassing concept of dimensions and multiple other concepts is as direct as transcending the concept of dimensions.

Nope, it does not. it is just containing them , not transcending it. And where does it say Encompassing = Transcendent?

Again, Ultima said that being superior to concept of dimensions, regardless of which Type the concept of dimensions is, will always be Low 1-A.

thats only applies if a character is stated to transcerd the concept .

Also encompassing the concept of dimensions and many other concepts, yet not being restricted to them and still growing eternally sounds like it's independent and separated from even the concept of dimensions.

It has other context other than being called as a concept. Firstly, it's the very first Concept created by the Gods, meaning that all concept it encompasses originates from it.

It's created as the very first Concept by the Gods to build the World.

Ultima already said that does not cut it and it does not follow all the steps, characteristics
Independent and separated here means that the essence exists in a Conceptual Realm, which is a higher world,plane than its particulars and a statement of independent

 

[Livinaa]

Ultima already said that does not cut it and it does not follow all the steps, characteristics
Independent and separated here means that the essence exists in a Conceptual Realm, which is a higher world,plane than its particulars and a statement of independent

Space is not just "prior to the world in some way", it's the very first Concept created by the Gods to create the World and all of Existence. There's nothing else prior to it beside the Chaos/Void that is BDE 2nd Type 2.

All things in the World (excluding the other 2 Concepts created by the Gods) originate from Space, including concept of dimensions, since it's the very Concept that all things is dependent on, while Space isn't dependent on the things in encompasses, since it's the very first Concept, with nothing prior to it.