Type 3 Ab. Exist. is a thing, but it's less AE and more Avatar/Smurf existence...

[Amexim]

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3028045?useskin=oasis#157 <———- this thread is where I and I think (correct me if I am wrong) Ant noticed that characters can be embodiments of concepts [and other stuff] without being literal ideas (type 1) or existing as a part of ideas or something (whatever type 2 is).

I don't know if we have a page for being someone/something's embodiment/flesh and blood incarnation/otherwise mortal projected avatar version of it, but we need one. I think?

Say a Deity creates a being as its avatar. That avatar is as mortal as anyone else. Harming them doesn't require Concept Manipulation, and they may or may not gain powers from their nature. It's not higher dimensional [though context varies] or anything immaterial. That character, the avatar, embodies the deity in the form of an individual incarnation that may have its own emotions and perspectives based on its limited outlook as a human being, or otherwise not be as abstract as its true form and be more of a symbol than anything else.

Basically, think of how Arceus has avatars, yeah? And how those avatars are all individuals in different universes that, even with their powers, are just individuals that embody the original one, rather those avatars than being immaterial individually? Maybe my lore for Pokémon is off. How about Ganondorf? Isn't bro, like, the avatar of Demise and/or his hatred of the hero and hylia?

What I'm trying to describe is a character that is an embodiment/avatar/projection of a higher version of itself, that is typically infinitesimally inferior and weaker, being flesh and blood or otherwise killable in comparison to it's real immaterial abstracta.

Or maybe y'all can phrase it better? Do that plz. Thx

 

[Amexim]

Best list of examples I can make up.

1. Jakobi Raitoning; Is the flesh and blood incarnation of the lightning element. His body is otherwise indistinguishable from another person, and he is for all intents and purposes, just another electricity manipulator. But the subtle difference is, he is literally the avatar of the element. It's not hyperbole, he was created by lightning itself in some way, even if he was born biologically normal like other humans. He has his own life, personality, memories, everything is him. He isn't made of lightning nor does he have type 2 abstract existence or type 8 immortality— it's that lightning itself would have something similar to abstract existence or would just get type 1, and the avatars it uses aren't really the conscious mind itself putting itself into a body, but an avatar nonetheless.

2. "Some other character I can make up" that's the same as Jakobi, but occasionally "fire" can speak through them and possess them to make them act more like a traditional type 1 avatar.

3. An avatar of a type 1 being with its own type 1 Ab. Exist. Also counts. Anything that's an avatar really.

4. Maybe the Avatar? From The Last Airbender and Korra? Like, isn't Ravaa using them for her reincarnation or something? I'm not sure if Ravaa is always inside of the avatars as their soul or if she's immaterial beyond and above them and she's reincarnating them so she can interact with the world. Iirc, she fused with the first dude, so maybe this is a stretch?

Anyway, point is, being an embodiment or avatar of a thing is enough to qualify for this. Even if you have other traits that contradict being mortal and fleshy for example.

 

[Antoniofer]

Personally I do not really like this power, is one of these abilities that try to standarize characters giving then a set of powers, like its the same for all characters have few statements in common.

Being a concept do not necessary means that one is invulnerable or can't be killed, I've argue that is pretty dangerous to be a walking concept; and if one can create an avatar, we have Avatar Creation.

 

[Amexim]

Do we have a page for being an avatar?

 

[Antoniofer]

Just for creating an avatar, there's no really an avatar physiology, that varies.

 

[Amexim]

I think we need a page for that, to put on profiles for things that had type 3 abstract existence. Maybe we can put it as a note under Avatar Creation? And edit Avatar Creation to not be limited to a sentient user, and instead be applicable to those who are the avatars of concepts without personhood for example?

 

[Bobsican]

Bump.

 

[Amexim]

I'm literally for any solution that properly indexes being an "embodiment" of something.

 

[DontTalkDT]

If we are talking immortality of the avatar due to the avatar creator then that's what Type 9 Immortality is about, I think.

Otherwise I'm not sure what the point of a "being the embodiment of something" ability is, if said ability gives no conform skill set. That would in essence be a state of being, instead of an ability.

It's like "the ability to be of japanese heritage". Technically a thing many characters have, but as it doesn't give any kind of general skill set it is pretty pointless.

 

[Amexim]

No immortality, just being an avatar. It doesn't have to possess a consistent skill set as it could work or function in a variety of ways. Being an "embodiment" of chaos might mean you might be given chaos manipulation or something. Basically what Type 3 AE was, but not pertaining to abstract existence solely I guess?

 

[DontTalkDT]

If it has no specific effect, then it isn't an ability.

Just write "Embodiment of X" into the Classification section of the standard format, that's what it is for.

As an ability this is superfluous. We may as well start making pages like Demon Physiology, Angel Physiology, Vampire Physiology, Dwarf Physiology, Elf Physiology etc.

 

[Amexim]

Oh cool. Didn't think of that...? Valid. This can be closed if that's what you want.

 

[Bobsican]

I have to agree with DT.

If there's nothing else to discuss, this can be closed, especially considering it appears to be concluded.