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Transformers General Discussion

Ednaxel2 said:
Shouldn’t anyone who tanks Ultra Magnus’ hammer be Low 5-B? Like Predaking in Beast Mode
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Ednaxel2 said:
Not saying it’d be the most consistent thing
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No one is going to be Low-5B, Magnus makes note to keep the power below 50% we don't actually know how much is used against the enemies so the scale would be "7A, upto 5B [120 Zettatons] with Forge of Solus Prime, higher with Star Saber, far higher with Matrix of Leadership" for someone like optimus, there's no room for inconsistency if no one legitimately scales except maybe Unicron




ofc that's assuming it was canon but it seems from Dinobot's comment that might not be the case


fire signature btw
 
Ghostimuscrime said:
No one is going to be Low-5B, Magnus makes note to keep the power below 50% we don't actually know how much is used against the enemies so the scale would be "7A, upto 5B [120 Zettatons] with Forge of Solus Prime, higher with Star Saber, far higher with Matrix of Leadership" for someone like optimus, there's no room for inconsistency if no one legitimately scales except maybe Unicron
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It’s implied in that text that he only uses it at 50%, so it doesn’t make sense for him not to use it at that cap against his fight with Predaking. The statement isn’t even usable anyways
Ghostimuscrime said:
fire signature btw
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Thanks!
 
Ednaxel2 said:
It’s implied in that text that he only uses it at 50%, so it doesn’t make sense for him not to use it at that cap against his fight with Predaking. The statement isn’t even usable anyways
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Never uses more than 50% power
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the 50% is a limit he does not go beyond
you could maybe argue he uses it at 5% normally but went upto 50% in one or two extreme instances but the issue is we would not know when that instance is because he does not want to destroy the planet they live on even if it might provide an edge

if it was canon, a better argument would be saying predaking destroys the forge --> his striking strength scales
 
Ghostimuscrime said:
the 50% is a limit he does not go beyond
you could maybe argue he uses it at 5% normally but went upto 50% in one or two extreme instances but the issue is we would not know when that instance is because he does not want to destroy the planet they live on even if it might provide an edge

if it was canon, a better argument would be saying predaking destroys the forge --> his striking strength scales
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I mean even if he uses it at 1% the country they’re on gets disintegrated
But yeah the Predaking feat would be better
 
1000043109-jpg.30890339

1000043110-jpg.30890340

Apparently there’s two more Transformers movies in development from Bay and Cooley respectively. GI Joe crossover is also still in development

Edit: apparently it’s more like 5
 
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for the Unicron profile what version of the character is it scaling? At first I thought it was composite but the notes say it isn't given it doesn't include IDW or G1, is it a composite of everything outside those two continuities or is there a specific continuity used as its basis?
 
Rosa said:
for the Unicron profile what version of the character is it scaling? At first I thought it was composite but the notes say it isn't given it doesn't include IDW or G1, is it a composite of everything outside those two continuities or is there a specific continuity used as its basis?
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It's a composite because almost every Unicron is part of the Multiversal Singularirty. G1 and IDW are exceptions as they're pretty explicitly not part of the Singularity.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
It's a composite because almost every Unicron is part of the Multiversal Singularirty. G1 and IDW are exceptions as they're pretty explicitly not part of the Singularity.
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is there something online that lays out all the content included under Multiversal Singularity? Gonna get into it
 
Ghostimuscrime said:
Shouldn’t IDW get his own scaling profile for Unicron then?
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vsbattles.fandom.com

Unicron (IDW)

In the early days of Cybertron's history, Unicron was viewed as Cybertron's greatest enemy. It was told that he was arch nemesis of the mythical Primus, and would one day be destined to awakened once again to attack Cybertron, and was destined to be slain by the last of the Primes. This was...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
 
LordTracer said:
vsbattles.fandom.com

Unicron (IDW)

In the early days of Cybertron's history, Unicron was viewed as Cybertron's greatest enemy. It was told that he was arch nemesis of the mythical Primus, and would one day be destined to awakened once again to attack Cybertron, and was destined to be slain by the last of the Primes. This was...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
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oh shi mb, thought they were all bunched up into one big comp character
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
It's a composite because almost every Unicron is part of the Multiversal Singularirty. G1 and IDW are exceptions as they're pretty explicitly not part of the Singularity.
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Just for fun, and I wouldn't think too hard about this (and it wouldn't impact his scaling in the cartoon at all) but I recently found out about is Cloud asserts Sunbow Unicron might be part of the greater Unicron entity. In Cloud, Unicron is directly stated to be a pan-dimensional existence a la Singularity Unicron. This has just been taken to apply Japanese G1 Unicron to that, which makes sense. Where it gets strange though is Cloud is one of the only stories to have characters visit both the American G1 timelines and the Japanese G1 timelines, so when they state Unicron exists across all universes in this context it also includes the American G1 timeline.

There is also a really weird somewhat vague statement in AVP that would in theory sort of smooth this all over

June 10, 2015​


Q: Dear Vector Prime,

Do the Covenant predate the Thirteen in all realities? Are they Multiversal Singularities as well? What more can you tell us about the proto-Transformers known as the Covenant?
.
.
A: Dear Archaeologist of Ancient Autobots,

The Covenant were old when I was young, and stars have been born and lived and died since I was young. I remember the Liege Maximo spinning yarns of their exploits too fantastical to be true, to wonderful to be false. How my brother might have come to possess this forbidden knowledge is a mystery, but then, the Liege Maximo was full of secrets and ever-questing.

I cannot answer your questions definitively. The Covenant do not seem to exist in all, indeed most, realities. I believe they may well be Multiversal Singularities, albeit extremely limited ones. On the other hand, they may simply be archetypes so profound as to be duplicated across several realities nearly unaltered, an extreme example of trans-dimensional harmonic resonance. I remember tales of their creation on Methusula's moon, Protos, the template for what would much later become Cybertron. They were created immediately before, or perhaps immediately after, Primon, and the twelve-and-the-one were the templates upon which The Thirteen were created.

Or, perhaps, the Covenant and Primon ARE The Thirteen, are us, in a different guise, having walked a different path, partially divorced from our singular nature and yet still attenuated to us. Such things are more common than you think; observe that Methusula and Protos served as the laboratory for Primacron and his assistant in both Primax 984.17 Alpha and Malgus 1207.26 Alpha, from whence Unicron was unleashed upon the galaxy. Surely not a coincidence.

Regardless, they are tireless sentinels, awaiting Point Omega for the good of us all, or so the stories went. And perhaps that is all they were, in the end, a fanciful tale from my brother to amuse and enthrall and perhaps manipulate us.

Even legends need legends. Remember that.
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Relevant part
Or, perhaps, the Covenant and Primon ARE The Thirteen, are us, in a different guise, having walked a different path, partially divorced from our singular nature and yet still attenuated to us. Such things are more common than you think; observe that Methusula and Protos served as the laboratory for Primacron and his assistant in both Primax 984.17 Alpha and Malgus 1207.26 Alpha, from whence Unicron was unleashed upon the galaxy. Surely not a coincidence.
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It's heavily implied here given he uses the actual original Sunbow stream designation, that Sunbow Unicron is essentially "partially divorced" from the Singular nature of "Bigger Unicron" i.e. that it was once connected and now isn't. Unlike with the Covenant, where Vector doesn't definitively know for certain, he uses the examples where this has actually already happened before.

There have been many contradictory takes on this throughout the franchise though, Furman directly and explicitly said all Unicrons are one as early as 2001, then we have the Cloud example above, and AVP shortly after that stating Sunbowcron isn't connected, but the above explanation may explain why. If it was at one point connected and became partially split off from the whole somehow, then it would make every opposing statement/opinion of the writers on this true at the same time.


Most normal Transformers lore moment lol
 
Here are some interesting little tips to help you with the bayverse (I don't know if it can be used canonically)

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Optimus.negz said:
Wasn't the concept of singularity erased by Nexus Prime?
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Yes and no
Singularity variants keep appearing post-Shroud, and even just in the context of AVP/FunPub era Shroud stuff, AVP outright said it was unknown if the Shroud fully affected everything. This was confirmed to be fact when Shattered Glass was revealed to be a separate multiverse that was un-shrouded after Nexus' actions, as the very last TF issues published by FunPub. Earth Wars as recently as last year had a Singularity version of Vector Prime show up that can summon himself from alternate timelines and is able to oversee the omniverse (which was implied but much more limited in AVP), and gave us a singularity version of...Nova Prime??? Furman's doing some strange things with Earth Wars.

Also keep in mind that the Shroud was supposed to also ban multiversal travel, so Transformers stories post-Shroud that include cross timeline jumping and the like by default have to be assumed to be unaffected by it per its own rules, at least unless further lore is given which is unlikely and we've seen rarely in stories that do address the Shroud there's some possibilities to bypass it (Physis' avatar sacrificing itself to send Spacewarp to a different universe, the Ichikawa MP Dia Burnout profile discussing the Shroud but leading directly into the Legacy Speedia manga which is about a multiversal confluence)

The Shroud is in this weird limbo state where it's very much canon but its effects are largely being ignored or just handwaved and worked around by the few writers who are actually aware of it.

The Transformers: One RPG sourcebook also has a section on the 13 where rather than focusing on the TF: One 13 lore, it actually adds lore to the 13 that Sorenson established in Ask Vector Prime, such as directly confirming that the Dark Spark belonged to Mortilus, and that Alpha Trion (and the 13 in general) have multiple identities across the multiverse (Solomus is another guise of Trion's or vice-versa). Logos Prime is even mentioned and given lore for the first time in a decade.
 
Btw, I don't know if you talked about it, but I found this for Transformers One.



« His Requiem Blaster could sunder reality, and his superstructure is a raging inferno of literal hellfire. »

« With the responsibility of managing the concept of death, perhaps Mortilus was always fated to be remembered as a villain. His Prime Artifacts were the Dark Spark, which could reanimate the dead, and the Void Scepter, which could warp minds. »

« ...she created each of the Artifacts of the Primes her siblings wielded. »

« The guardian of time and space, Vector's ability to perceive multiple realities and traverse them at will make him enormously powerful... »

( It's clearly inspired by aligned )
 
Optimus.negz said:
Btw, I don't know if you talked about it, but I found this for Transformers One.



« His Requiem Blaster could sunder reality, and his superstructure is a raging inferno of literal hellfire. »

« With the responsibility of managing the concept of death, perhaps Mortilus was always fated to be remembered as a villain. His Prime Artifacts were the Dark Spark, which could reanimate the dead, and the Void Scepter, which could warp minds. »

« ...she created each of the Artifacts of the Primes her siblings wielded. »

« The guardian of time and space, Vector's ability to perceive multiple realities and traverse them at will make him enormously powerful... »

( It's clearly inspired by aligned )
Click to expand...

This is clearly not talking about the Thirteen in Transformers One.

It describes Megatronus as having betrayed his siblings and becoming the First Decepticon, that didn’t happen in One. It describes The Arisen, Autonomous Maximus, Logos Prime and Mortilus, none of whom were among One’s Thirteen. It mentions Amalgamous causing a “God War”, that also didn’t happen in One.
 
LordTracer said:
This is clearly not talking about the Thirteen in Transformers One.

It describes Megatronus as having betrayed his siblings and becoming the First Decepticon, that didn’t happen in One. It describes The Arisen, Autonomous Maximus, Logos Prime and Mortilus, none of whom were among One’s Thirteen. It mentions Amalgamous causing a “God War”, that also didn’t happen in One.
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Mb, Plus it says in the tfwiki that it's not entirely canon 😭.
 
Optimus.negz said:
Mb, Plus it says in the tfwiki that it's not entirely canon 😭.
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the 13 section is canon, the parts that are non-canon are the wildlife and such specific to TF: One as it is a "live" continuity so apparently they aren't allowed to add things to it. The material that's non-canon is actually labelled non-canon in the book to make sure there's no confusion (some of the only TF material in general to ever not be canon in some capacity)

These are written by Jim Sorenson and there's numerous expansions in this book on stuff he was writing about the 13 in Ask Vector Prime like the Greek gods stuff. It's meant to, as it says in the overview, cover a lot of lore for many versions of the 13. Logos' profile references his encounter with the Hytherion originally mentioned by Hirofumi Ichikawa in Beast Wars Reborn and mentioned again during Ask Vector Prime for example.
 
Ednaxel2 said:
Has anyone worked on anything for Cyberworld?
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I am waiting for it to finish so that I can binge, don't remember anything too notorious for them, the first episodes I saw gave them decent skill showings and good Info Analysis
 
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