Transduality compared to a lower universe

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

Let us say a verse has multiple levels of reality, and each level has it's own concept that is superior to lower level's concept. An inhabitant of a level sees everything in the lower level, including all concepts and the concept of duality as fiction, but is still bound by his own level's concept of duality. Does that give him transduality?

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

My brain broke, I tried to use logic but it failed, tried to make something up and it also failed.

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

My brain broke, I tried to use logic but it failed, tried to make something up and it also failed.

basically you see a world as fiction, along with all it's concepts including the concept of duality. All those concepts that govern that lower world does not apply to you. But in your own world you are just a normal person and the higher concepts of your world applies to you. Does that mean you are transdual compared to the lower world?

 

[Noneless21]

So for example the character you're saying is 4D that basically seeing all of 3D including duality and concept as fiction while you're just a normal person in 4D plane of existence is that correct?

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

basically you see a world as fiction, along with all it's concepts including the concept of duality. All those concepts that govern that lower world does not apply to you. But in your own world you are just a normal person and the higher concepts of your world applies to you. Does that mean you are transdual compared to the lower world?

I don't think they would have Transduality, but I'm not sure. Transduality Type 2, says on your level of reality, not a reality below you. Otherwise, every character that transcends the concepts and dualities on a lower level than themselves would have transduality which is not the case.

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

So for example the character you're saying is 4D that basically seeing all of 3D including duality and concept as fiction while you're just a normal person in 4D plane of existence is that correct?

i am not using dimensional difference, since higher dimensions follow the same laws of lower dimension or some shit. I am saying a higher reality A that is governed by it's own higher concepts which >>>>>>> concepts of lower reality B which an individual of the higher reality A sees as fictional and meaningless but is still governed by the concepts of his own higher reality A.

 

[Noneless21]

i am not using dimensional difference, since higher dimensions follow the same laws of lower dimension or some shit. I am saying a higher reality A that is governed by it's own higher concepts which >>>>>>> concepts of lower reality B which an individual of the higher reality A sees as fictional and meaningless but is still governed by the concepts of his own higher reality A.

Sooo, it's like limited transduality 2 or something? It's weird ngl

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

I don't think they would have Transduality, but I'm not sure. Transduality Type 2, says on your level of reality, not a reality below you. Otherwise, every character that transcends the concepts and dualities on a lower level than themselves would have transduality which is not the case.

I would like to add those characters have no evidence of transcending the concepts of the lower world. Usually higher order concepts are not a thing in fiction. When you have a multi layered world usually the higher reality and lower reality are governed by the same concepts rather then lower concepts governing the lower reality and the higher reality having it's own concepts that govern it which are transcedent of lower reality concepts.

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

Sooo, it's like limited transduality 2 or something? It's weird ngl

Also i think type 3 cause the higher reality sees all concepts of lower reality as fiction including the platonic concepts of dimensions so the higher reality is low 1-A/1-A.

 

[Noneless21]

I dunno, so you mean that there's other people at that higher plane of existence too?

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

I dunno, so you mean that there's other people at that higher plane of existence too?

yes.

 

[Noneless21]

So does that transduality even be applicable because theoratically when you're at the "higher" plane of existence, the logic, concept and duality of lower existence shouldn't be applied to you is it not?

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

I personally think the answer should be yes, as the higher reality transcends the normal concept of duality. The fact that the verse has higher order concepts is just another thing.

 

[Vietthai96]

No, even if you see the dual system of a lower plane as fiction, it is not qualify you transduality. You yourself need to be beyond dual system to qualify. This leap in logic is really bad

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

What I was thinking, you are beyond A dual system, but not YOUR dual system on YOUR level of reality.

 

[NIK_FARIS]

Is this perhaps MGF? Either way, that is not how transduality work. Because by that logic we would give Transduality to any normal tier 1 who based on r/f as they are beyond and above anything of the lower dimension (treat it as kind of fiction).

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Let us say a verse has multiple levels of reality, and each level has it's own concept that is superior to lower level's concept. An inhabitant of a level sees everything in the lower level, including all concepts and the concept of duality as fiction, but is still bound by his own level's concept of duality. Does that give him transduality?

Type 2

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Is this perhaps MGF? Either way, that is not how transduality work. Because by that logic we would give Transduality to any normal tier 1 who based on r/f as they are beyond and above anything of the lower dimension (treat it as kind of fiction).

Ye true but if he specifies like he did that, that character exist beyond dualities but is still bound to dualities on his level its not saying higher dimensional characters all transcend dualities its like saying he is saying the characters are higher dimensional beings hence they are not bound by the concept of 4D death which doesn't make any sense


Then again if the character is bound by dualities on his level then technically if he was to fight a character on his level he wouldn't have transduality which would Render him having transduality useless so maybe I agree and disagree with you

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

No, even if you see the dual system of a lower plane as fiction, it is not qualify you transduality. You yourself need to be beyond dual system to qualify. This leap in logic is really bad

That leap in logic derives from the definition of type 2 in itself

 

[Sniper670]

No, even if you see the dual system of a lower plane as fiction, it is not qualify you transduality. You yourself need to be beyond dual system to qualify. This leap in logic is really bad

Agree to this

 

[Sniper670]

TD 2 gives some weird Invulnerability/immunities to said dualities
And just like Aca 5, you need feats that do not contradict that statement, which is....... Hard

 

[theultimate5105]

You need to be beyond the dual system on your level
by your nature as a being who sees them as fiction you would be beyond their dualities by default

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

So i have to be beyond duality in my reality? What if i send an avatar of myself in the lower reality? Would that avatar of mine in that lower reality be transdual?

 

[Sniper670]

Normally Avatars are significantly restricted versions of their true Forms anyway and don't share the same abilities etc etc. So Avatar needs feats to be TD

Take Arceus for instance.

 

[Vietthai96]

This kind of logic is as bad as: i see a an Acausality 4 guy as fiction, so i also Acausality 4

 

[Sniper670]

"Transduality is the state of being wherein an entity exists independently of, and qualitatively beyond, various dual systems, ranging from very specific, limited sets of dual distinctions to duality itself on a conceptual level"

I don't think seeing the Dualities as fiction qualifies. You need to be independent /unbound of the dual systems, and unaffected by/immune to it

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

You need to be beyond the dual system on your level
by your nature as a being who sees them as fiction you would be beyond their dualities by default

"You have to be beyond them at your level" that automatically gets you above space time at that level which gets you into makes you view them as fiction that automatically leads back to the same situation that Mr issei right here presented its still saying if I transcend all dualities on those lower realms I have transduality

Saying you specifically you're at a certain level after that level you transcend those dualities including space time you view them as fiction as of now and exist in higher realms while still being bound by space time on a realm you currently inhabit in a literal sense that you only Transcend the previous ones on the reality you inhabited and transcended it and now viewing it as fiction just means if I already view all of lower realities and it's dual systems as fiction I'm already transdual type 2

There's no distinction between what you just said and what Mr issei over here presented

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

This kind of logic is as bad as: i see a an Acausality 4 guy as fiction, so i also Acausality 4

Bad logic that derives from the definition presented by the wiki if there are problems with how the interpretations made based on the definitions presented by the wiki ab transduality type 2 and are accurately based on that then it's bad logic that derives from the definition of the wiki itself lol I'm not sure if that analogy even pertains to situation

 

[theultimate5105]

"You have to be beyond them at your level" that automatically gets you above space time at that level which gets you into makes you view them as fiction that automatically leads back to the same situation that Mr issei right here presented its still saying if I transcend all dualities on those lower realms I have transduality

Saying you specifically you're at a certain level after that level you transcend those dualities including space time you view them as fiction as of now and exist in higher realms while still being bound by space time on a realm you currently inhabit in a literal sense that you only Transcend the previous ones on the reality you inhabited and transcended it and now viewing it as fiction just means if I already view all of lower realities and it's dual systems as fiction I'm already transdual type 2

There's no distinction between what you just said and what Mr issei over here presented

Being above space-time of your level is not a reality-fiction difference, or anywhere even close to it

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Being above space-time of your level is not a reality-fiction difference, or anywhere even close to it

That was not the point

 

[theultimate5105]

That was not the point

It invalidates your point, Being beyond space-time doesn’t mean you are no longer on its Level. So it is applicable regardless

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

It invalidates your point, Being beyond space-time doesn’t mean you are no longer on its Level. So it is applicable regardless

Dude are you ine... Nvm yes yes it does yaay

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

BTW guys unrelated question, but if you manipulate information that governs reality the same way a plot governs reality can you have both info and plot manipulation?

 

[NIK_FARIS]

BTW guys unrelated question, but if you manipulate information that governs reality the same way a plot governs reality can you have both info and plot manipulation?

That’s seem more of CM and IM to be fair. Unless the verse state thing like narrative or story or something similar, I don’t think you can get plot manipulation.

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

That’s seem more of CM and IM to be fair. Unless the verse state thing like narrative or story or something similar, I don’t think you can get plot manipulation.

Yes, the information controls the world like the narrative and also acts as concepts and laws which govern the world.

 

[Sniper670]

Slime?

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

BTW guys about transduality type 4...from what i understand type 1-3 are all about transcending dual values, but type 4 is about transcending more then dual values. For eg transduality is transcending life and death, plurality is transcending life, death, both alive and dead, neither alive or dead, etc.
Am i right?

 

[Noneless21]

BTW guys about transduality type 4...from what i understand type 1-3 are all about transcending dual values, but type 4 is about transcending more then dual values. For eg transduality is transcending life and death, plurality is transcending life, death, both alive and dead, neither alive or dead, etc.
Am i right?

i think TD type 4 is transcend even the very concept of duality itself from what i'm seeing

 

[Oblivion_Of_The_Endless]

BTW guys about transduality type 4...from what i understand type 1-3 are all about transcending dual values, but type 4 is about transcending more then dual values. For eg transduality is transcending life and death, plurality is transcending life, death, both alive and dead, neither alive or dead, etc.
Am i right?

Not quite. What you described are still kind of dualities.

Type 4 would be "trialities", "quadralities", "pentalities", and so on (those words do not exist but its just to make the point clear)

For example, if 0 is nonexistence, 1 is existence, and 2 is something transdual, then the Type 4 character would be 3, or 4, or 5, etc...up to infinite-layered logic

 

[NIK_FARIS]

To be fair, I don’t even seem to get how Transduality above 3 even exist. I feel like it is more of play of word.
But fiction can go wild right?