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Topaz's RPG Stats Equal Tournament Round 7: Kamek vs NoLegs the Cat (0-0-0)

Alright, so im basically gonna copy Psycho's reply in Round 8 for Anna, but replace Anna with NoLegs (and i think Kamek has more combat options)
But yeah, NoLegs is a competent fighter, can use Scan to figure out the weaknesses of Kamek, and i dont think Kamek can handle 150+ varied summons and NoLeg's crazy arsenal of weapons and magic
 
So, off the bat, Kamek can disable Nolegs attack options leaving him with just his Physicals. He can also replace all their equipment with Halfway dice blocks taking away any ability gained from them. To deal with the summons (which might not even come into play if Kamkek disables Nolegs move options beforehand) Kamek can create his own forces to combat them such as an army of minions or large airships. I'll also note that since Nolegs doesn't resist transmutation any magic blast from Kamek that hits him would be gg's.
 
Alright, im presuming that the gear isnt composited, but ill mentioned that
First, Kamek's disabling sounds a lot like Power Null, which NoLegs resists via the fact Syphon exists in EBF5 (which does the exact same thing as whats seen in the video, disables magic) (Gear is Wizard Hat, Cardboard Box, and Wizard Robe), so he should be fine on that front. Hell, NoLegs doesnt really need to use Scan, seeing how spellcasters are common

Also, if he Defends using Shell Armor (or summons a Angel Mirror), he becomes Enchanted- making him weaker to physical strikes, but totally immune to magic for as long as the effect is up. Transmutation seems to be magic based sooooo

Basically, to NoLegs, Kamek is just yet another caster enemy and will either apply Syphon on Kamek (forcing him to go in close, which is where NoLegs can cut him up), or apply Enchanted on himself.....which would achieve the same thing

TLDR: NoLegs resists funny magikoopa BS and can shut Kamek down easily
 
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First, Kamek's disabling sounds a lot like Power Null, which NoLegs resists via the fact Syphon exists in EBF5 (which does the exact same thing as whats seen in the video, disables magic) (Gear is Wizard Hat, Cardboard Box, and Wizard Robe), so he should be fine on that front. Hell, NoLegs doesnt really need to use Scan, seeing how spellcasters are common
Going off his profile, he only resists Power Null with equipment which Kamek can replace with Halfway dice blocks.
Also, if he Defends using Shell Armor (or summons a Angel Mirror), he becomes Enchanted- making him weaker to physical strikes, but totally immune to magic for as long as the effect is up. Transmutation seems to be magic based sooooo
Fair, although if he uses that Kamek can attack him with his Broom or use his summons to attack him physically.
Basically, to NoLegs, Kamek is just yet another caster enemy and will either apply Syphon on Kamek (forcing him to go in close, which is where NoLegs can cut him up), or apply Enchanted on himself.....which would achieve the same thing
Kamek can make copys of himself so trying to hit the main one with Syphon before they get rid of his equipment and null him is gonna be hard. It also doesn't help that all the Kameks can trap Nolegs in chains, giving them the chance to get rid of his equipment and null him or to transmute him.
 
Fair enough on the first point. Would there be any way to avoid it? Despite being Power Nulled (like when hit with Syphon), NoLegs can still call summons to fight and overall be useful (so he isnt limited to melee)

Second point.....i dont think Kamek is going to win in CQC with NoLegs. Cat knows how to cut and stab

Third point- NoLegs has skills that can affect an area/multiple enemies at once. Swift Slash (which also inherits weapon effects), he can make himself Lovable with Love Aura which would make it so Kamek cant target him with single-target effects (he doesnt seem to resist Empathic Manip), Star Blast (which can easily clear out the clones), and optional stuff like Firecrackers would give NoLegs Good Luck, and Kamek Bad Luck. Basically, NoLegs has more of a chance to hit, Kamek has less chance to hit

(i also dont see whats stopping NoLegs from eating a Chili Pepper from the start and summoning GodCat (either the Creator or Destroyer) to the field)
 
Fair enough on the first point. Would there be any way to avoid it?
Mario and Luigi couldn't do anything to prevent it so I'm guessing no.
Despite being Power Nulled (like when hit with Syphon), NoLegs can still call summons to fight and overall be useful (so he isnt limited to melee)
Kamek's power null seals their bro attacks which can let them summon the Zeekeeper so he won't be able to summon ether.
Third point- NoLegs has skills that can affect an area/multiple enemies at once. Swift Slash (which also inherits weapon effects), he can make himself Lovable with Love Aura which would make it so Kamek cant target him with single-target effects (he doesnt seem to resist Empathic Manip), Star Blast (which can easily clear out the clones), and optional stuff like Firecrackers would give NoLegs Good Luck, and Kamek Bad Luck. Basically, NoLegs has more of a chance to hit, Kamek has less chance to hit
While useful, it's not gonna help when Kamek seals his moves.
(i also dont see whats stopping NoLegs from eating a Chili Pepper from the start and summoning GodCat (either the Creator or Destroyer) to the field)
Power null deals with that and the Chili Pepper is probably gonna be turned into a dice block by Kamek.
 
So if Mario and Luigi couldnt do anything about the Power Null....wouldnt that be considered Very High? Considering Kamek can also just turn NoLeg's gear into half-die-
I just want to be sure is all
 
So if Mario and Luigi couldnt do anything about the Power Null....wouldnt that be considered Very High? Considering Kamek can also just turn NoLeg's gear into half-die-
I just want to be sure is all
They could still use physicals to fight back and eventually win against Kamek and Paper Kamek, so it doesn't meet the "immediately win a match against someone without protection" criteria for very high hax.
 
They could still use physicals to fight back and eventually win against Kamek and Paper Kamek, so it doesn't meet the "immediately win a match against someone without protection" criteria for very high hax.
Alright, thank you for clarifying.

I dont think i asked for Kamek's first move actually. Would they go for the Power Null first, or the Transmutation. I know the transmutation can be avoided (well, the magic bolt kind of transmutation anyways)
actually
Doesnt Kamek need to perform a action for his magic?


(i think now is the time to mention the Pocket Watch, in the EBF5 key at least, it gives Haste to NoLegs passively, which speeds up his own time. Think of it as a speed amp that Kamek would need to somehow get rid of before it starts stacking)
 
I dont think i asked for Kamek's first move actually. Would they go for the Power Null first, or the Transmutation. I know the transmutation can be avoided (well, the magic bolt kind of transmutation anyways)
actually
Doesnt Kamek need to perform a action for his magic?
All of his Magic blasts have Transmutation so it's not something he really has to go out of his way to do. In Paper Jam he went for the Power null not too long into the fight.
(i think now is the time to mention the Pocket Watch, in the EBF5 key at least, it gives Haste to NoLegs passively, which speeds up his own time. Think of it as a speed amp that Kamek would need to somehow get rid of before it starts stacking)
He would have already gotten rid of all Nolegs equipment before it would be too much of a problem. And assuming he can do it in the same way has Paper Kamek, Nolegs can't avoid it while he does have the Pocket Watch.
 
Not gonna lie, this seems like another battle where its basically who shoots first

Kamek doesnt resist most of what NoLegs brings out, and one decent blast of Transmutation and some Power Null would screw NoLegs over and force something like a Limit Break (as far as im aware the only thing in EBF5 that disables Limit Break usage is Matteus's Stoned effect), unless Kamek's already got that covered

I still think Empath Manip is gonna be a problem for Kamek, because if NoLegs is Lovable, Kamek cant directly target him. If NoLegs uses it right off the bat, then he's good to go to set up and win. Keep in mind, this affects EVERYTHING that doesnt resist the effect

But yeah. Should we wait for more arguments?
 
Kamek doesnt resist most of what NoLegs brings out, and one decent blast of Transmutation and some Power Null would screw NoLegs over and force something like a Limit Break (as far as im aware the only thing in EBF5 that disables Limit Break usage is Matteus's Stoned effect), unless Kamek's already got that covered
Kamek's power null works differently from the Stoned effect so I don't think Nolegs is gonna be able to use Limit Break.
I still think Empath Manip is gonna be a problem for Kamek, because if NoLegs is Lovable, Kamek cant directly target him. If NoLegs uses it right off the bat, then he's good to go to set up and win. Keep in mind, this affects EVERYTHING that doesnt resist the effect
Can it be avoided? Cause if not that sounds like Very high hax.
Kamek never uses transmutation to end a fight to my knowledge.
Thats cause it doesn't work on 90% of the cast cause they resist it and they take his magic as normal attacks.
 
I mean, Empath still acts like one of NoLeg's magic skills, if Kamek can null it then it shouldnt matter.
Assuming that would be Kamek's first move anyways

But if you want i can restrict it of course (it does sound very high ngl but still can be nulled)
 
Kamek doesn't immediately start with power null and Nolegs Empath Manip would instantly gg's anyone who lacks a resistance so it's probably best to restrict it for the tournament.
 
Yeah ill restrict Empath Manip for this yeah

And since Kamek doesnt instantly go for Power Null....well, NoLegs can do a lot here. He can set up Enchant, summon a bunch of summons to counter Kamek's summons, or try and go for the kill with one of his skills. Hell, NoLegs could even go right for the Power Null first, ensure Kamek cant do his magic and then go from there

Basically
Who shuts each other down first. And since NoLegs has Info Analysis, he's most likely the one to disable first
 
And since Kamek doesnt instantly go for Power Null....well, NoLegs can do a lot here. He can set up Enchant, summon a bunch of summons to counter Kamek's summons, or try and go for the kill with one of his skills. Hell, NoLegs could even go right for the Power Null first, ensure Kamek cant do his magic and then go from there

Basically
Who shuts each other down first. And since NoLegs has Info Analysis, he's most likely the one to disable first
As I noted before Kamek can make copys of himself (which is something he does at the very start of the battle in both scans) to take Syphon for him. They can also work in tandem to execute Kamek's wincons (I;e having one bind him to prevent him from moving, having one get rid of his equipment, having one power null him, and then having one transmute him). Also, I didn't note this before but Kamek can take control of Nolegs summons with his mind manip which can cover a whole island.

I feel like unless Nolegs goes for his magic null as soon as the fight starts (which he wouldn't know to do without using his Info Analysis first) Kamek is gonna make copys of himself and overwhelm Nolegs.
 
Should probably mention that Mind Manip doesnt work on all of NoLegs's summons, mainly any of them that resist Confusion (or generally lack a brain like a Monolith), but aye maybe its a moot point

I mean, you did say that the Power Null wasnt something Kamek doesnt pull right out the gate, its the clones, it should give NoLegs plenty of time to get a quick Scan (only takes a few seconds) and then dive under cover to attack again. Remember, this is taking place on Corsucant- which is basically one big ass city with plenty of spots to hide

And sure, most of his natural skills are more physical, but his shared skills could quite possibly have Interstellar range (scaling to Natalie's Genesis, and the fact Ion Cannon can still strike Akron in his black hole pocket dimension), so he could probably just nuke him before he gets too close
 
mean, you did say that the Power Null wasnt something Kamek doesnt pull right out the gate, its the clones, it should give NoLegs plenty of time to get a quick Scan (only takes a few seconds) and then dive under cover to attack again. Remember, this is taking place on Corsucant- which is basically one big ass city with plenty of spots to hide
Kamek can control where his blasts travel and they can hit foes before they can react even if he misses the blast is gonna turn whatever it hits onto an enemy. Kamek can also just TP Nolegs to him if needed.
And sure, most of his natural skills are more physical, but his shared skills could quite possibly have Interstellar range (scaling to Natalie's Genesis, and the fact Ion Cannon can still strike Akron in his black hole pocket dimension), so he could probably just nuke him before he gets too close
If he tries that Kamek can chain him up to prevent him from acting or just TP away with his uni range teleportation.
 
....yeah this is going to go nowhere if im gonna be honest. Gonna wait a bit to see if anyone else wants to argue before continuing


(i aint surrendering yet)
 
By the way I was wondering, couldn't Nolegs just inflict kamek with "Bad Luck" and "Tired" statuses(which would probably hit all of the Kameks including the real one, since it targets all enemies in the game) to lower his accuracy and make all of his attacks miss?
 
By the way I was wondering, couldn't Nolegs just inflict kamek with "Bad Luck" and "Tired" statuses(which would probably hit all of the Kameks including the real one, since it targets all enemies in the game) to lower his accuracy and make all of his attacks miss?
Kamek can spam teleport as well as use zone speed to avoid it. Also he and his copies are likely gonna be flying in different directions so is gonna be hard to hit them all in one go.
 
Kamek can spam teleport as well as use zone speed to avoid it. Also he and his copies are likely gonna be flying in different directions so is gonna be hard to hit them all in one go.
It looks like the teleport takes a second or two to actually go through with the Teleport- kinda reminds me of an annoying Cosmic Monolith that likes to teleport to avoid attacks
ahem
im still going to vote NoLegs (no bias trust), even if his items are turned into dice- the EBF crew have been able to throw snowballs with enough force to hurt things, so if the worst come to worse

actually
ok to clarify about Kamek's Transformation of items
You said it effects the inventory of the target, yeah? So would that include NoLeg's equipment AND consumable items (like healing food and spicy peppers), or just equipment? I dont think Kamek would be aware of the consumables inventory if thats the case
 
It looks like the teleport takes a second or two to actually go through with the Teleport- kinda reminds me of an annoying Cosmic Monolith that likes to teleport to avoid attacks
He can teleport much faster if he wants, I probably should of linked this scan first.
im still going to vote NoLegs (no bias trust), even if his items are turned into dice- the EBF crew have been able to throw snowballs with enough force to hurt things, so if the worst come to worse
What's stopping Kamek from just avoiding what he throws? He can easily just TP out of the way or use zone speed. He can also heal up any damage taken from getting hit.
actually
ok to clarify about Kamek's Transformation of items
You said it effects the inventory of the target, yeah? So would that include NoLeg's equipment AND consumable items (like healing food and spicy peppers), or just equipment? I dont think Kamek would be aware of the consumables inventory if thats the case
He affects everything in the characters hammerspace/inventory at once so he wouldn't need to know about the consumables transmute them.
 
Ok, so NoLegs's equipment and consumable stuff is in trouble, i see. Thank you for clarifying

(Oh yeah i want to amend something with NoLegs's Empath Manip. Kamek can still hit him, but not by direct fire, so if Kamek has any AoE spells that can work. If you still want it restricted, totally fine)
 
Lovable is basically
Upon activation, NoLegs and any allies cannot be hit by direct means by any enemy in front of them, but can still be hit by AoE attacks (so when an foe does it, you are forced to use an AoE skill).

It also goes away after a while (like all statuses in EBF5 bar Virus), and can be dispelled away.

So yeah Kamek can fight back with AoE magic, or any summons that can attack in an area, but its gonna severely cripple his options. Dont know if that means he can use the Transmutation (unless turning equipment into dice is also something Kamek can AoE), but hey.
Cats got options lol

Actually- i think if the Empath Manip is allowed, then NoLegs can just combo it with Enchanted to basically ensure Kamek cant magic him. All NoLegs would need to do is nuke Kamek, or ensure that Lovable/Enchanted continues to be applied/in effect
 
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Actually- i think if the Empath Manip is allowed, then NoLegs can just combo it with Enchanted to basically ensure Kamek cant magic him. All NoLegs would need to do is nuke Kamek, or ensure that Lovable/Enchanted continues to be applied/in effect
Even if Nolegs goes for that before Kamek power nulls him; he can just make a copy of himself that doesn't have the status effect (If there aren't already many on the battlefield already) to fight for him or just summon peeps to fight for him until it wears off.
 
No no- the status effect is on NOLEGS, not Kamek. NoLegs can target himself with the effect. Shouldve clarified, apologies
 
No no- the status effect is on NOLEGS, not Kamek. NoLegs can target himself with the effect. Shouldve clarified, apologies
Oh I thought it was like the Infatuation from Pokemon.
That definitely makes it harder to deal with... Can't think of a good counter for that off the top of my head. So ig this comes down to who can pull off their wincons first. I'd say Kamek has a better shot of it due to being able to chain up Nolegs whenever which can prevent him from giving himself Lovable/Enchanted and give him the time to pull off his wincons.
 
I mean, depending on how chained NoLegs is (If you can provide a scan that would be wonderful), NoLegs might be able to cast it still. His main cast animation only takes a few seconds-
Even made a video on how short it is (and what it looks like) here. very short
 
Kameks chains are instant so he can probably stop him before he can cast it.
Dont know if its just me, but there seems to be a second or two delay before the chains are in effect, so yeah, this would basically be
Who shoots first

Final question, what is Kamek most likely to do as complete first move? If he doesnt use Chains first, then NoLegs would be able to get Lovable/Enchanted up
 
Fair enough yeah, but i think NoLegs can sneak in the Love Aura while the Kameks try to form their magic shenanigans. After the confusion, NoLegs can just get Enchanted on, and from there probably annihilate Kamek right there and then

Well
Guess thats the argument

Voting time?
 
If I am to comment, IIRC Kamek's leading moves have been pretty inconsistent in the series (Some games like the platformers have him dodge while he doesn't dodge in the RPGs). Plus, his transmutation really only affects items and not equipment, otherwise they would've lost their clothing.
 
Well, if we're ready to vote....i may as well cast mine
for NoLegs. Bias aside, i just think NoLegs has more variety in skills on what he can do, and has more ways to respond to Kamek's screwery,
 
If I am to comment, IIRC Kamek's leading moves have been pretty inconsistent in the series (Some games like the platformers have him dodge while he doesn't dodge in the RPGs). Plus, his transmutation really only affects items and not equipment, otherwise they would've lost their clothing.
Also forgot to mention, good point on the transmutation bit. Means NoLegs wont be completely defenseless then (and could probably benefit even more from stuff like Pocket Watch)
 
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