Tier -1

[Yobo_Blue]

What if there was a Tier -1, and how would it be achieved?

(No memes)

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Utterly impossible. By definition, either this character is just a Tier 0 with more fancy words or the Tier 0 said character scales to is just High 1-A or hell just 1-A.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

I mean, for the sake of this conversation, let's pretend going beyond True Infinity is possible. How would a writer at least attempt to achieve this?

 

[Noahkaismith]

I mean, I supose if you were to say that, for example, that since The One Above All is a fictional character, that'd make Stan Lee a -1, but we don't work like that here.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Obviously not, this is theoretical at best.

 

[Noahkaismith]

I mean, for the sake of this conversation, let's pretend going beyond True Infinity is possible. How would a writer at least attempt to achieve this?

Hmm... Could they establish something beyond the concept of infinity?

 

[Yobo_Blue]

My best guess is through quite a bit of bending of Reality-Fiction Interactions

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

It isn't though. WE define what a Tier 0 is. And by our definition, nothing can be beyond it­.

@Noah All Tier 0s are beyond all concepts, including infinity. "True Infinity" is just a name.

­

 

[Yobo_Blue]

It isn't though. WE define what a Tier 0 is. And by our definition, nothing can be beyond it­.
@Noah All Tier 0s are beyond all concepts, including infinity. "True Infinity" is just a name.

­

Mybe we should switch this to the fun and games board

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

Why is the topic for this thread "Soul Calibur"?

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Obviously, we have to bend the rules a bit here @Saikou

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

If by "bend the rules a bit" you mean "completely remaking the concept of a Tier 0 just for the sake of the discussion, which would render the whole discussion pointless" then yeah.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Yeah, completely destroying a system may be necessary, but it wouldn't necessarily destroy the Tiering System. Personally, I think just we could do the same with reality fiction interaction and get a better results. It's really nothing more than a optional discussion, which is why I think it should be moved to the fun and games board. Even if it would require the destruction of the Tiering System, my main question was about the ways a author would attempt to achieve it, even if it would still only be Tier 0

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

My point is that Tier 0 isn't just "Can destroy X" or "Transcends Y". By definition, it's above absolutely everything in its verse. "Higher than Tier 0" is impossible by its very definition.

An author can "attempt" to make a -1, by saying that a character is beyond omnipotence, but that would just debunk the Tier 0's omnipotence.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Here is essentially what I'm going for. A writer might be Tier 0, but if it were possible to go beyond that and if the cosmology allowed, a higher dimensional beings of the "Real World" would be on this level.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

for the sake of argument (as this might not work), lets imagine tier 0 as inf^inf an inf number of times, with 1-A being inf^inf and high 3-A being just inf

a tier higher than 0 would require a number larger than infinty to represent, as inf^inf an inf^inf an inf^inf....... number of times would still be tier 0, as it still is infinty.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Well it's not really like that though. Simply being "bigger", "stronger" or "better" only matters for 1-A and below. High 1-A and Tier 0 aren't ruled by such things.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

so would "undefinable" be a better decription? because, if so, this just proves that a tier higher than 0 would be impossible to prove, as "beyond omnipotent" both can't exist, and insinuates a number/concept larger than infinty, which doesn't make any sense.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Perhaps this is a better phrasing: How would a being prove themselves to be above the current Tier 0's without direct showings or statements?

 

[Yobo_Blue]

They would still technically be Tier 0 though

 

[IwonTheLotteryYES]

Infinity is limit of our imagination. For us humans, we do not know if there is anything past infinity. To us right logically that would be impossible. Perhaps in the future if the human race survives its strifes we might learn of something past the concept of infinity. but that is unlikely to happen. For us to learn of something like that would involve us trying to comprehend something that cannot be comprhended to begin with because our brain capcacity just won't allow it. If you understand or even get what i mean.

 

[ZackMoon1234]

I heard the Suggsverse requirement to be powerful is being omnipotent, so this could work :smug


I dont know if its true or not, but its probably a joke

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

Perhaps this is a better phrasing: How would a being prove themselves to be above the current Tier 0's without direct showings or statements?

i'd say that it is impossible, as while a being could technically be "closer to omnipotence" than another, but could never reach true omnipotence, similar to how it is impossible to break the SoL, just get extremely close to it, a being higher than tier 0 would either be truly omnipotent, which has it's own hassles to prove, or above it, e:g Guy's power > omnipotence, which just doesn't work.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Infinity is limit of our imagination. For us humans, we do not know if there is anything past infinity. To us right logically that would be impossible. Perhaps in the future if the human race survives its strifes we might learn of something past the concept of infinity. but that is unlikely to happen. For us to learn of something like that would involve us trying to comprehend something that cannot be comprhended to begin with because our brain capcacity just won't allow it. If you understand or even get what i mean.

So basically, Tier-1 would be something like beyond the concept of concepts

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

You can't be superior to a Tier 0 by definition. If you are then that 0 was probably never Tier 0 to begin with.


If something can be surpassed then it can't qualify for Tier 0.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

@H13

I meant more along the lines of becoming the new Top God.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

at the same time, that would make it far above the concept of a description or definable power, and would be dificult to imagine, much less prove to exist in the first place,

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Heres what I would define it as

Current Tier 0 is a Real World writer

New Tier 0 is real life high 1-A

 

[IwonTheLotteryYES]

Infinity is limit of our imagination. For us humans, we do not know if there is anything past infinity. To us right logically that would be impossible. Perhaps in the future if the human race survives its strifes we might learn of something past the concept of infinity. but that is unlikely to happen. For us to learn of something like that would involve us trying to comprehend something that cannot be comprhended to begin with because our brain capcacity just won't allow it. If you understand or even get what i mean.

So basically, Tier-1 would be something like beyond the concept of concepts

Tier 0, or omnipotence is already something that is pushing or comprehension due to a bunch of unexplained paradoxes. so something if something were to be higher than that would be completely out of the human realm of thinking. In way "Being beyond the concept of concepts" is already omnipotence. In other words we simply cannot fathom a possibility beyond infinity because "Infinity is our limit"

 

[IwonTheLotteryYES]

we just wouldn't know what is past what we don't understand beyond our reach, beyond our limit of thinking. YOu see even now people are having troubles trying to grasp or even think of it. I am having troubles trying to think of ways to phrase it. I wouldn't say its impossible, but its just completely beyond human comprehension.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Thanks for the input. I don't intend to overthrow the current system, and I apologize if this thread in and of itself is heresy. I just wanted to have a bit of user input on this.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Should I close this then?

 

[Antvasima]

No problem. I can close the thread.