Something in regards to the notation of combat speed

[DontTalkDT]

I just stumbled by chance over the Moira profile and saw that she and a bunch of other overwatch characters are listed as "Subsonic with Massively Hypersonic+ reactions and combat speed".

Now this kind of notation is something I have seen in the past on a few profiles as well (Not that I would recall which ones...), so I wanted to talk about it in general.

Thing is, which kind of Speed is the "Subsonic" here?

I always thought, that the speed stat, without further remarks of what it is, is the combat speed.

That is, because I always understood the line "The term "Speed" normally refers to Combat Speed." on the Speed page, as meaning that without further specification what stands in the speed stat is the combat speed.

It also makes the most sense for me that way, since combat speed is the most relevant speed for battles and sets a baseline for reaction and attack speed.


You can see why I would have a problem with formulations of the speed stat as above.

In my understanding what is standing there is "Subsonic combat speed with Massively Hypersonic+ reactions and combat speed", meaning two different values for combat speed are mentioned.

That of course doesn't make much sense.


Am I wrong in my interpretation?

What kind of speed do you guys take the not further specified speed stat for?

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Subsonic movement/running speed

 

[Antoniofer]

Welp, generally I consider Combat Speed = Reaction Speed unless stated otherwise, like Hokuto Ken (iirc), where someone stated that it can't even follow its attacks, but not always Reaction Speed is Combat Speed, there's characters that can use some skill/powers but still unable to move. And Combat Speed = Attack Speed if only refering to close attacks, like punches and kicks.

 

[DontTalkDT]

Subsonic movement/running speed

Should it then be listed like this in your opinion?

As said in my understanding the speed stat without further note isn't movement speed, but combat speed. So if it is movement speed it would need it to be mentioned.


Other thing is that a characters running speed can not be lower than its combat speed in my understanding, since being able to follow your opponents movement is essential for keeping up with the opponent in combat. (Travel speed can be lower due to stamina issues though)

For stuff like being able to move arms that fast, but not necessarily run I personally used the formulation "close combat speed" in the past, though that is really unofficial...

 

[DontTalkDT]

@Antoniofer: Mostly a different issue, this is more about what kind of speed you assume it is if a profile just says "Supersonic" for example.


On what you wrote, I would agree if it were combat speed Ôëñ reaction/attack. More or less due to the reasons you said. (Basically if you fight a character in speed x that only really works if you can process what is happening in the battle and your attacks (at least punches or whatever the character uses) are fast enough to work)

 

[Antoniofer]

Ah, welp, if that is the case, I generally assume combat and reaction speed (assuming close combat speed). In theory, the justification should be at the side of the rating, and since travel speed isn't generally scalable, most likely the speed written should be close combat even without justification (Although, we shouldn't allow ratings without justifications).

 

[Antvasima]

I do not think that it seems necessary to perform a massive wiki revision regarding this. Preferably the statistics should preferably use a "[...] travel/running speed and [...] combat speed/reflexes" format, but it is usually easily understood othervise as well, as long as one of them is spelled out.